On Topic Discussion 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

[cityboy-stl]

I got the Covid and flu shots in October and had about 36 hours of fever and fatigue. It was a little worse than some of the others, but not really that bad. Not as bad as the second shingles shot. I got the RSV shot a few weeks ago and had absolutely no reaction at all. It was a pain getting the RSV shot because stupid Missouri requires a prescription for it.

 

[KaraBulut]

... It was a pain getting the RSV shot because stupid Missouri requires a prescription for it.

Federalism.

The wording in the CDC's recommendation for the RSV shot says that it is recommended for people over 60 years old, pregnant women and infants but other patients may be able to eligible based upon discussions with their health provider.

Because of that "discussions" clause in the recommendations, state laws in Georgia, Iowa, Missouri, Utah, and Washington DC require a prescription for everyone in order to prove that you discussed it with your health provider.

 

[Peloso]

We have about another 2-3 weeks left before COVID, flu and RSV season peaks, so don't be surprised if you hear a lot of people out in public with nasty coughs in January.

Here in New York, which was the virus epicenter for a while in 2020, I see very few people wearing masks. The trains and buses are returning to their overloaded, pre-pandemic sardine can hell, and I see only about 5% of riders masking up. Hospitals have resumed mask mandates.

It seems the general public is still so irrevocably mentally scarred by the lockdowns of 2020 that they are unwilling to even consider any degree of social distancing.

 

[belamyi]

Does anybody recall that "test" they published about the immunology knowledge necessary for anyone to be entitled to discuss COVID-19 measures and policies? Was it posted in this thread or in some other JUB section?

 

[belamyi]

Does anybody recall that "test" they published about the immunology knowledge necessary for anyone to be entitled to discuss COVID-19 measures and policies? Was it posted in this thread or in some other JUB section?
Today, after two months of surging of flu, covid and respiratory infections, and punctual collapsing in health assistance centers, authorities finally approved mandatory use of masks at hospitals, primary care centers and medical centers: cases are expected to peak this first fortnight of the month, after all that stupid family and mass revelry (this evening, during the Magi parade, a million starry-eyed are expected to either catch (eventually again) or pass on their seasonal viruses under the first proper rain in months in BCN and Catalonia).

 

[cityboy-stl]

Federalism.

The wording in the CDC's recommendation for the RSV shot says that it is recommended for people over 60 years old, pregnant women and infants but other patients may be able to eligible based upon discussions with their health provider.

Because of that "discussions" clause in the recommendations, state laws in Georgia, Iowa, Missouri, Utah, and Washington DC require a prescription for everyone in order to prove that you discussed it with your health provider.

Well, at least that's an explanation. Everyone else I asked, including my doctor, the pharmacist, and even the health department (on their Facebook), said "I don't know". Still, it seems stupid to require a prescription if you fall within the recommended category. It clearly says, "others are eligible based on discussions", which by common sense reading means, if you are in the recommended category, discussions are not required. But that's Missouri for you.

 

[rareboy]

Here in New York, which was the virus epicenter for a while in 2020, I see very few people wearing masks. The trains and buses are returning to their overloaded, pre-pandemic sardine can hell, and I see only about 5% of riders masking up. Hospitals have resumed mask mandates.

It seems the general public is still so irrevocably mentally scarred by the lockdowns of 2020 that they are unwilling to even consider any degree of social distancing.

And with all the precautions, including full vaccination, masking and distancing as much as I could while at a conference in Toronto...I knew I was almost sure to get it because probably only 1 in 100 people were masked.

And now it looks like my immuno-compromised partner and I are likely going to have long Covid with respiratory and other issues.

I am calling on Monday though to line us up for RSV shots.

 

[KaraBulut]

Here in New York, which was the virus epicenter for a while in 2020, I see very few people wearing masks. The trains and buses are returning to their overloaded, pre-pandemic sardine can hell, and I see only about 5% of riders masking up. Hospitals have resumed mask mandates.

It seems the general public is still so irrevocably mentally scarred by the lockdowns of 2020 that they are unwilling to even consider any degree of social distancing.

When I entered college and took a history class, I learned about a bunch bunch of stuff that had never been mentioned in any history class in K-12 public schools that I attended in the US. It was the first time anyone mentioned the Holocaust. It was the first time that the numbers of casualities of World Wars had been mentioned. It was the first time that the pandemics that swept through the world in the late 19th century and early 20th century, including the 1918-1919 influenza epidemic that killed 50 million people, were mentioned.

At the time, I remember thinking, "How had no one ever mentioned these mass casualty events to me before now?".

The world went through something between 2020-2023. Over seven million people are dead from COVID so far- an estimate the WHO says is probably higher because people were dying so fast in places like China and India that they still don't know the actual numbers.

Fortunately, enough people have acquired immunity, through vaccination or through getting COVID, that we won't be seeing packed emergency rooms and refrigerator trucks from COVID anytime soon. COVID is now on the level with the flu, although the numbers are still pretty staggering - we're still seeing about 1,000 deaths per week in the US which is in line with the number of annual deaths we see in bad influenza epidemics.

There's a little PTSD going on where everyone is desperately trying to remember and "recover" normal and put it all behind them. I hear discussions in the media that second-guess the events of 2020, especially masks, social distancing and lockdowns. A lot of people are coping with the pandemic by forgetting the days when hospitals were overwhelmed, there was no PPE and there were refrigerator trucks sitting around because the funeral homes couldn't handle the number of corpses they had to process.

What should scare us is that we don't seem to have learned from the pandemic. People are going out in public when they "have a cold". They aren't testing for COVID before going to public events, even though the government is still distributing free tests. COVID booster uptake is less than 20% for 2022 and 2023, even though the shots are 100% covered by Medicare, Medicaid and most health insurance policies. More important, there's no effort in Congress or State Legislatures to say, "What did we do right? What did we do wrong? What lessons did we learn so that we can prepare for the next one?".

 

[KaraBulut]

Well, at least that's an explanation. Everyone else I asked, including my doctor, the pharmacist, and even the health department (on their Facebook), said "I don't know". Still, it seems stupid to require a prescription if you fall within the recommended category. It clearly says, "others are eligible based on discussions", which by common sense reading means, if you are in the recommended category, discussions are not required. But that's Missouri for you.

Here's what is stupid: when providers have questions about immunizations, we look to the pharmacists to clarify the rules and guidelines. They're the experts.

If you were in a place other that Missouri where the legislature seems to have gone completely mad, it would just take a little lobbying for the law to be changed to redefine pharmacists as "providers" who can prescribe immunizations. Pharmacists know the guidelines. The laws were changed a few years back to allow them to administer immunizations. It just needs another tweak to the law to say that they meet the definition of a "provider" for the purposes of immunzations.

 

[rareboy]

When I entered college and took a history class, I learned about a bunch bunch of stuff that had never been mentioned in any history class in K-12 public schools that I attended in the US. It was the first time anyone mentioned the Holocaust. It was the first time that the numbers of casualities of World Wars had been mentioned. It was the first time that the pandemics that swept through the world in the late 19th century and early 20th century, including the 1918-1919 influenza epidemic that killed 50 million people, were mentioned.

At the time, I remember thinking, "How had no one ever mentioned these mass casualty events to me before now?".

The world went through something between 2020-2023. Over seven million people are dead from COVID so far- an estimate the WHO says is probably higher because people were dying so fast in places like China and India that they still don't know the actual numbers.

Fortunately, enough people have acquired immunity, through vaccination or through getting COVID, that we won't be seeing packed emergency rooms and refrigerator trucks from COVID anytime soon. COVID is now on the level with the flu, although the numbers are still pretty staggering - we're still seeing about 1,000 deaths per week in the US which is in line with the number of annual deaths we see in bad influenza epidemics.

There's a little PTSD going on where everyone is desperately trying to remember and "recover" normal and put it all behind them. I hear discussions in the media that second-guess the events of 2020, especially masks, social distancing and lockdowns. A lot of people are coping with the pandemic by forgetting the days when hospitals were overwhelmed, there was no PPE and there were refrigerator trucks sitting around because the funeral homes couldn't handle the number of corpses they had to process.

What should scare us is that we don't seem to have learned from the pandemic. People are going out in public when they "have a cold". They aren't testing for COVID before going to public events, even though the government is still distributing free tests. COVID booster uptake is less than 20% for 2022 and 2023, even though the shots are 100% covered by Medicare, Medicaid and most health insurance policies. More important, there's no effort in Congress or State Legislatures to say, "What did we do right? What did we do wrong? What lessons did we learn so that we can prepare for the next one?".

What is worse, is that the failure to learn and plan happens at the highest level of healthcare management.

Hospitals in Ontario who had to deal with the worst of it have come forward with the things we need to do in the healthcare and long term care facilities to avoid fatalities and transmission in the future.

And typically, no one is there at the funding level to really listen.

 

[KaraBulut]

What is worse, is that the failure to learn and plan happens at the highest level of healthcare management.

Hospitals in Ontario who had to deal with the worst of it have come forward with the things we need to do in the healthcare and long term care facilities to avoid fatalities and transmission in the future.

And typically, no one is there at the funding level to really listen.

Imagine if you lived in a country where there was no viable public health system. And imagine that during a pandemic, the yokels harassed and threatened public health officials to the point that they quit their underpaid, overworked jobs. Imagine that the leading virologist in your country was used as a whipping boy for your demagogic politicians to the point that at least one person was arrested with an assault rifle and a plan to kill the virologist. Imagine that there was a mass exodus of nurses from hospitals because they were treated so badly by patients who got sick because the patients didn't get the free vaccinations that the government offered them.

Now imagine that 43% of your fellow countrymen were anticipated to vote for the buffoon who was in charge when all of this happened.

2020 was a dress rehearsal. Opening night for the next pandemic is not going to go well.

 

[Peloso]

And with all the precautions, including full vaccination, masking and distancing as much as I could while at a conference in Toronto...I knew I was almost sure to get it because probably only 1 in 100 people were masked.

And now it looks like my immuno-compromised partner and I are likely going to have long Covid with respiratory and other issues.

I am calling on Monday though to line us up for RSV shots.

The "problem" with masks is that you wear one primarily to protect others and vice versa.

I just got back from a trip across town. I could count the mask wearers with one hand, and half them were wearing it only over their mouths. How do people this stupid get through an ordinary day?

 

[rareboy]

Imagine if you lived in a country where there was no viable public health system. And imagine that during a pandemic, the yokels harassed and threatened public health officials to the point that they quit their underpaid, overworked jobs. Imagine that the leading virologist in your country was used as a whipping boy for your demagogic politicians to the point that at least one person was arrested with an assault rifle and a plan to kill the virologist. Imagine that there was a mass exodus of nurses from hospitals because they were treated so badly by patients who got sick because the patients didn't get the free vaccinations that the government offered them.

Now imagine that 43% of your fellow countrymen were anticipated to vote for the buffoon who was in charge when all of this happened.

2020 was a dress rehearsal. Opening night for the next pandemic is not going to go well.

I have said to my partner many times over the last month that thank God we live in Ontario....for all its faults... because we at least had a cohesive and coherent response to Covid and have immediate access to immunization and health care intervention (although regretfully today not as much during a well earned Christmas holiday for our Dr. and hospital staff)....otherwise, we would be at twice the risk or more.

We are seeing spikes in deaths among the real elderly and immuno compromised here in spite of everything we have done right with this latest variant and that is fucking scary.

All this has to do is just mutate faster than the next vaccine and we could be seeing another tragedy.

With TrumpCo. in charge in the US...it could be a catastrophe there.

 

[belamyi]

Imagine if you lived in a country where there was no viable public health system. And imagine that during a pandemic, the yokels harassed and threatened public health officials to the point that they quit their underpaid, overworked jobs. Imagine that the leading virologist in your country was used as a whipping boy for your demagogic politicians to the point that at least one person was arrested with an assault rifle and a plan to kill the virologist. Imagine that there was a mass exodus of nurses from hospitals because they were treated so badly by patients who got sick because the patients didn't get the free vaccinations that the government offered them.

Now imagine that 43% of your fellow countrymen were anticipated to vote for the buffoon who was in charge when all of this happened.

2020 was a dress rehearsal. Opening night for the next pandemic is not going to go well.

Pandemic? The next crisis, one that would not spare anyone watching safely from home what you described there, while everything else was either going normal or even better than before the pandemic.

 

[KaraBulut]

The "problem" with masks is that you wear one primarily to protect others and vice versa.

Well, and it depends on the mask.

These newer variants are so contagious that to protect yourself from being infected, you need a well-fitted, high filtration mask. Anything less effective than an N95 (and assuming you don't have a beard or moustache) isn't going to offer a lot of protection from other people's infections.

If someone is sick and doesn't have an N95, covering their mouth to avoid coughing and sneezing is better than nothing at all but the longer you are in a confined space with them, the higher the chance you'll be exposed. Over the past 3 years, I've been exposed more times than I can count but because I had on an N95 and I've stayed current on boosters, I haven't tested positive. Knock on wood.

The people that we're seeing with symptomatic COVID have the same qualities in common: they didn't get the 2024 booster and they were indoors in a large group of people (especially holiday gatherings of family members) recently.

And keep in mind that because we have a significant population of people who have COVID but aren't sick enough to stay at home and we have another group of people who don't know they have been infected who are exposing other people.

March can't come soon enough.

 

[unloadonme]

The BBC has reported the death of Derek Draper after suffering from long Covid for almost 4 years.

Derek Draper: Kate Garraway says husband has died, aged 56

The former political adviser, had multiple health issues after first being hospitalised with Covid in 2020.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[rareboy]

Well, and it depends on the mask.

These newer variants are so contagious that to protect yourself from being infected, you need a well-fitted, high filtration mask. Anything less effective than an N95 (and assuming you don't have a beard or moustache) isn't going to offer a lot of protection from other people's infections.

If someone is sick and doesn't have an N95, covering their mouth to avoid coughing and sneezing is better than nothing at all but the longer you are in a confined space with them, the higher the chance you'll be exposed. Over the past 3 years, I've been exposed more times than I can count but because I had on an N95 and I've stayed current on boosters, I haven't tested positive. Knock on wood.

The people that we're seeing with symptomatic COVID have the same qualities in common: they didn't get the 2024 booster and they were indoors in a large group of people (especially holiday gatherings of family members) recently.

And keep in mind that because we have a significant population of people who have COVID but aren't sick enough to stay at home and we have another group of people who don't know they have been infected who are exposing other people.

March can't come soon enough.

That is the part that galls....I and so many others in the community did have the booster...but I knew from the moment I turned up on the convention floor that I was doomed.

And our neighbour, who has been the clinical director at a local long term care facility on a secondment tells us that all the people who died in the last month or so were up to date with boosters.

This tells us that while the vax has likely saved thousands of lives...we are dealing with ever evolving strains so for the love of god, be careful.

The way we feel this week and the symptoms we are experiencing......we almost certainly would have been dead if this was 3 years ago.

 

[Kulindahr]

This year's flu shot packed a wallop for some people too.

I've had several people say they didn't want to get the COVID booster because of the fever, chills and fatigue that hits them the next day.

Either way, the 24 hours of reaction after the vaccine are better than having actual COVID for days.

Today I'm just mildly feverish and feel moderately wiped out. I walked to the store and back with Knox shortly after I got up and ran out of energy before I made it back. I also woke up with a sore throat, so between the shot reaction and that I'm being a chair potato today. It occurs to me maybe I should set the thermostat higher than 62° . . . too bad I'm out of firewood.

This is better than the reaction from the prior two shots!

We have about another 2-3 weeks left before COVID, flu and RSV season peaks, so don't be surprised if you hear a lot of people out in public with nasty coughs in January.

I've been seeing a lot of people wearing masks lately, more and more since about Thanksgiving. With my sore throat I'll be wearing one so I reduce the chance of sharing it.

 

[Kulindahr]

Federalism.

The wording in the CDC's recommendation for the RSV shot says that it is recommended for people over 60 years old, pregnant women and infants but other patients may be able to eligible based upon discussions with their health provider.

Is this another vaccine I should be getting?

 

[Kulindahr]

When I entered college and took a history class, I learned about a bunch bunch of stuff that had never been mentioned in any history class in K-12 public schools that I attended in the US. It was the first time anyone mentioned the Holocaust.

Interesting. I don't recall the Holocaust being mentioned in U.S. History in high school, but it was in World History (a senior class I took as a sophomore).