Hillary says she will help struggling Americans. Why Should We Believe that she would?

[kallipolis]

The question remains. Anybody?

Obsessing over a false equivalency does not make a sound argument.

An hospital emergency room physician making Dollars 40 per hour, and an investment fund manger making Dollars 1000 per hour.

I reckon that the physician is worth more to society, than an investment fund manger.

Their income disparity speaks otherwise.

What ever work we are discussing here should pay sufficient for the employee not to have to rely on food stamps and/or charitable hands out to provide them, and their family with the basics of life.

 

[Hankerin1075]

Can't tell if you're just acting stupid.
A living wage is one that allows a person to live a normal life (food, drink, home, utilities, healthcare, transport) without going into debt or requiring government assistance. Covers the basics for required for independence, if not the luxuries.

It varies by area, mostly due to regional rent variations.

So, put a number on it. What should they be payed?

 

[Hankerin1075]

You guys are illustrating my point. There is no number. All the arguments make no sense without a specific number to reach. Everybody keeps saying livable wage but there aren't any numbers. No plans. What is livable? Nobody can answer this. It's a trick question. What is livable to you is different than the next guy. We have to get down to the numbers. Nobody will get down to the real numbers. The original question STILL remains.

 

[Hankerin1075]

Obsessing over a false equivalency does not make a sound argument.

An hospital emergency room physician making Dollars 40 per hour, and an investment fund manger making Dollars 1000 per hour.

I reckon that the physician is worth more to society, than an investment fund manger.

Their income disparity speaks otherwise.

What ever work we are discussing here should pay sufficient for the employee not to have to rely on food stamps and/or charitable hands out to provide them, and their family with the basics of life.

Not every task in the world deserves a good wage. Ha! I love that you said reckon. I say that and love to hear it from others.

 

[Hankerin1075]

Tell me what an EMT should make. A number. Jesus you guys are pros at dodging questions.

 

[kallipolis]

Tell me what an EMT should make. A number. Jesus you guys are pros at dodging questions.

You are dodging the issue.

For the matter is not one of what a particular skill, trade, or profession should make...

...but of your presumption, that you are uniquely qualified to decide that one skill is more deserving, than another.

 

[Hankerin1075]

You are dodging the issue.

For the matter is not one of what a particular skill, trade, or profession should make...

...but of your presumption, that you are uniquely qualified to decide that one skill is more deserving, than another.

So you will not answer my simple question. Good lord. I've stated my opinion already. What is yours?

 

[kallipolis]

So you will not answer my simple question. Good lord. I've stated my opinion already. What is yours?

Were my answer X; would that satisfy you?

Of course not, for it would be a meaningless reply.

As is your question, for it is loaded with your preconceived belief that you are qualified, to decide the worth of any particular skill.

Salaries, and wages in the job market are unfair, and never work on the assumption that a skill is fairly recompensed, per my earlier illustration between the physician, and the investment fund manager.

 

[Kabluey]

So you will not answer my simple question. Good lord. I've stated my opinion already. What is yours?

Simple folk like simple answers.

We've told you. You don't understand anything but the dumbest of answers, no doubt because you want to argue the toss.

You also want to deny the fact that those who are 'worth' more get paid relatively more than the lowest paid in any economy. You just don't want to believe that people don't have to be in full time work and in poverty.

Wages are not zero sum. It's only you who wants to argue that. It the minimum cost of living is $600 per week, the minimum wage should equate. If it's $500, then likewise. Believe it or not such things are measured and indexed. They're not unknown.

Too complicated a concept? Or are you really that stupid?

 

[jbrown329]

The party of tolerance. Stay classy.

20+ years of chronic depression with overlapping major depression, throw in generalized anxiety disorder (30yrs), seasonal affective disorder and ptsd (from being abused as a child). See how fucking well you hold it together when your depression hits so fucking bad that the thoughts of suicide are right under the surface 24/7. When it used to make you sleep for 12-18hrs a day and now you're lucky to get 4. It sits you straight up in bed with the damn tears streaming. Your pillow is soaking wet from the tears.

So, see how fucking classy you are. See how fucking well you hold it together. When ALL your coping mechanisms are gone. When you no longer have any friends irl. So, fucking stay classy yourself.

 

[Hankerin1075]

Thanks for the replies guys. They don't make much sense, but I appreciate the effort. Still no answer to my question.

 

[Kabluey]

Thanks for the replies guys. They don't make much sense, but I appreciate the effort. Still no answer to my question.

You have absolutely no clue.
Thanks for representing low wage/low information Republicans for us.

 

[jbrown329]

I was paid $2.00 per hour for that same work (McDonald's) in 1968, I todays money it would be $13.83
http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

Yeah, and if I still worked at the grocery store (1992), it would be $22.30.

 

[jbrown329]

Not what I'm saying. I'm saying that if the flipper makes 13-14 what should the EMT make? Tell me what you think. I never said I don't care about anyone. I flipped my share back in the day. What should the EMT make in a world where flippers make said wage? Simple question.

No, you raise the federal minimum wage to $15hr. Then you FORCE companies that hire EMTs to actually pay them what they are actually are worth. Which would be in the range of $25hr. And they can't raise their prices. They can EAT the cost. To damn bad about their profits. The CEO makes to damn much money anyhow.

 

[Kabluey]

No, you raise the federal minimum wage to $15hr. Then you FORCE companies that hire EMTs to actually pay them what they are actually are worth. Which would be in the range of $25hr. And they can't raise their prices. They can EAT the cost. To damn bad about their profits. The CEO makes to damn much money anyhow.

It's even easier than that.
I live in a higher minimum wage economy.
If hospitals decide to pay paramedics burger flipping wages, paramedics just flip burgers (less stress and responsibility for the same wages). So the hospitals have to pay more to retain staff.

Where I am, burger flippers get $15/hour.
Junior ambulance officers start at $20, rising to around $30 with experience, junior paramedics start at $27, rising to $37 with experience. Not extravagant, not poor.

Workforce dynamics are fluid, and jobs are pitched relative to the minimum wage.

 

[jbrown329]

Obsessing over a false equivalency does not make a sound argument.

An hospital emergency room physician making Dollars 40 per hour, and an investment fund manger making Dollars 1000 per hour.

I reckon that the physician is worth more to society, than an investment fund manger.

Their income disparity speaks otherwise.

What ever work we are discussing here should pay sufficient for the employee not to have to rely on food stamps and/or charitable hands out to provide them, and their family with the basics of life.

The fund manager is a leech and should be making 1985 minimum wage ($3.35hr) while the er doc should be making closer to $200K a year. One sucks up money and provides no service for anyone but a small few. The other provides service for a great many and saves lives.

 

[jbrown329]

It's even easier than that.
I live in a higher minimum wage economy.
If hospitals decide to pay paramedics burger flipping wages, paramedics just flip burgers (less stress and responsibility for the same wages). So the hospitals have to pay more to retain staff.

Where I am, burger flippers get $15/hour.
Junior ambulance officers start at $20, rising to around $30 with experience, junior paramedics start at $27, rising to $37 with experience. Not extravagant, not poor.

Workforce dynamics are fluid, and jobs are pitched relative to the minimum wage.

Yeah, you don't live in an oligarchy. Must be nice. No, I'm not being asinine. Just saying it as it is.

 

[Hankerin1075]

Thanks for the replies. You guys are finally starting to think about this.

 

[Kabluey]

Thanks for the replies. You guys are finally starting to think about this.

We're helping you catch up.
Feigned ignorance isn't a good debating tactic.

 

[Hankerin1075]

We're helping you catch up.
Feigned ignorance isn't a good debating tactic.

It took forever to get a response. I still haven't seen an answer to my question but you are getting there.