Yes I am

[Andreus]

I am an american and I am a muslim. My mothers people originally came from what she called old Persia before they fled to Europe many years before she or I were born.

Yes

that means that my blood is the same blood of the Iranians and the Iraqis

today I have cried for hours because I know more than anything that so many people would revel in my death.

it is everywhere in my world. on the television, in the words of people too ignorant to know just how devastating their careless words can be, in the faces of the people that strip search me as I board planes, in the eyes of the men that no longer love me

Indeed, someone has almost succeeded in taking my life once

and on my back I carry the weight of knowing what it feels like to be hated so much that your very life is considered expendable

and for nothing but the actions of some madmen continents away that i have never met or believed in

I listen to this poem on audio that a good friend gave me to feel like just one person understands out there.

I want to share it with you all

and I want to tell you

I am not made of Iron, I am made of flesh. I have a heart and I am just like you.

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular][FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]First Writing Since[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]by Suheir Hammad[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]New York, New York[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]1. there have been no words.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i have not written one word.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]no poetry in the ashes south of canal street.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]no prose in the refrigerated trucks driving debris and dna.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]not one word.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]today is a week, and seven is of heavens, gods, science.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]evident out my kitchen window is an abstract reality.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]sky where once was steel.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]smoke where once was flesh.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]fire in the city air and i feared for my sister's life in a way never[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]before. and then, and now, i fear for the rest of us.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]first, please god, let it be a mistake, the pilot's heart failed, the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]plane's engine died.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]then please god, let it be a nightmare, wake me now.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]please god, after the second plane, please, don't let it be anyone[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]who looks like my brothers.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i do not know how bad a life has to break in order to kill.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i have never been so hungry that i willed hunger[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i have never been so angry as to want to control a gun over a pen.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]not really.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]even as a woman, as a palestinian, as a broken human being.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]never this broken.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]more than ever, i believe there is no difference.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the most privileged nation, most americans do not know the difference[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]between indians, afghanis, syrians, muslims, sikhs, hindus.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]more than ever, there is no difference.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]2. thank you korea for kimchi and bibim bob, and corn tea and the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]genteel smiles of the wait staff at wonjo the smiles never revealing[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the heat of the food or how tired they must be working long midtown[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]shifts. thank you korea, for the belly craving that brought me into[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the city late the night before and diverted my daily train ride into[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the world trade center.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]there are plenty of thank yous in ny right now. thank you for my[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]lazy procrastinating late ass. thank you to the germs that had me[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]call in sick. thank you, my attitude, you had me fired the week[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]before. thank you for the train that never came, the rude nyer who[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]stole my cab going downtown. thank you for the sense my mama gave me[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]to run. thank you for my legs, my eyes, my life.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]3. the dead are called lost and their families hold up shaky[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]printouts in front of us through screens smoked up.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]we are looking for iris, mother of three. please call with any[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]information. we are searching for priti, last seen on the 103rd[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]floor. she was talking to her husband on the phone and the line[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]went. please help us find george, also known as a! ! del. his family is[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]waiting for him with his favorite meal. i am looking for my son, who[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]was delivering coffee. i am looking for my sister girl, she started[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]her job on monday.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i am looking for peace. i am looking for mercy. i am looking for[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]evidence of compassion. any evidence of life. i am looking for[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]life.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]4. ricardo on the radio said in his accent thick as yuca, "i will[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]feel so much better when the first bombs drop over there. and my[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]friends feel the same way."[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]on my block, a woman was crying in a car parked and stranded in hurt.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i offered comfort, extended a hand she did not see before she said,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]"we"re gonna burn them so bad, i swear, so bad." my hand went to my[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]head and my head went to the numbers within it of the dead iraqi[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]children, the dead in nicaragua. the dead in rwanda who had to vie[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]with fake sport wrestling for america's attention.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]yet when people sent emails saying, this was bound to happen, lets[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]! ! not forget u.s. transgressions, for half a second i felt resentful.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]hold up with that, cause i live here, these are my friends and fam,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]and it could have been me in those buildings, and we"re not bad[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]people, do not support america's bullying. can i just have a half[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]second to feel bad?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]if i can find through this exhaust people who were left behind to[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]mourn and to resist mass murder, i might be alright.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]thank you to the woman who saw me brinking my cool and blinking back[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]tears. she opened her arms before she asked "do you want a hug?" a[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]big white woman, and her embrace was the kind only people with the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]warmth of flesh can offer. i wasn't about to say no to any comfort.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]"my brother's in the navy," i said. "and we"re arabs". "wow, you[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]got double trouble." word.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]5. one more person ask me if i knew the hijackers.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]one more motherfucker ask me what navy my brother is in.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]one more person assume no arabs or muslims were killed.one more person[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]assume they know me, or that i represent a people.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]or that a people represent an evil. or that evil is as simple as a[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]flag and words on a page.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]we did not vilify all white men when mcveigh bombed oklahoma.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]america did not give out his family's addresses or where he went to[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]church. or blame the bible or pat robertson.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]and when the networks air footage of palestinians dancing in the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]street, there is no apology that hungry children are bribed with[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]sweets that turn their teeth brown. that correspondents edit images.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]that archives are there to facilitate lazy and inaccurate[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]journalism.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]and when we talk about holy books and hooded men and death, why do we[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]never mention the kkk?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]if there are any people on earth who understand how new york is[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]feeling right now, they are in the west bank and the gaza strip.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]6. today it is ten days. last night bush waged war on a man once[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]openly funded by the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]cia. i do not know who is responsible. read too many books, know[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]too many people to believe what i am told. i don't give a fuck about[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]bin laden. his vision of the world does not include me or those i[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]love. and petittions have been going around for years trying to get[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the u.s. sponsored taliban out of power. shit is complicated, and i[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]don't know what to think.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]but i know for sure who will pay.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]in the world, it will be women, mostly colored and poor. women will[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]have to bury children, and support themselves through grief. "either[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]you are with us, or with the terrorists" - meaning keep your people[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]under control and your resistance censored. meaning we got the loot[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]and the nukes.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]in america, it will be those amongst us who refuse blanket attacks on[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]the shivering. those of us who work toward social justice, in[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]support of civil liberties, in opposition to hateful foreign[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]policies.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i have never felt less american and more new yorker, particularly[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]brooklyn, than these past days. the stars and stripes on all these[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]cars and apartment windows represent the dead as citizens first, not[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]family members, not lovers.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i feel like my skin is real thin, and that my eyes are only going to[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]get darker. the future holds little light.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]my baby brother is a man now, and on alert, and praying five times a[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]day that the orders he will take in a few days time are righteous and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]will not weigh his soul down from the afterlife he deserves.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]both my brothers - my heart stops when i try to pray - not a beat to[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]disturb my fear. one a rock god, the other a sergeant, and both[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]palestinian, practicing muslim, gentle men. both born in brooklyn[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]and their faces are of the archetypal arab man, all eyelashes and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]nose and beautiful color and stubborn hair.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]what will their lives be like now?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]over there is over here.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]7. all day, across the river, the smell of burning rubber and limbs[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]floats through. the sirens have stopped now. the advertisers are[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]back on the air. the rescue workers are traumatized. the skyline is[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]brought back to human size. no longer taunting the gods with its[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]height.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]i have not cried at all while writing this. i cried when i saw those[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]buildings collapse on themselves like a broken heart. i have never[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]owned pain that needs to spread like that. and i cry daily that my[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]brothers return to our mother safe and whole.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]there is no poetry in this. there are causes and effects. there are[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]symbols and ideologies. mad conspiracy here, and information we will[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]never know. there is death here, and there are promises of more.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]there is life here. anyone reading this is breathing, maybe hurting,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]but breathing for sure. and if there is any light to come, it will[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]shine from the eyes of those who look for peace and justice after the[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]rubble and rhetoric are cleared and the phoenix has risen.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]affirm life.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]affirm life.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]we got to carry each other now.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]you are either with life, or against it.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular]affirm life.[/FONT]

[/FONT]

 

[Andreus]

words

words are things best not weilded by the insensitive

 

[DarkNeko]

Andreus, I too have faced prejudice for my ethnic background but that is just something that you have to rise above. you are stronger than you you may believe.

 

[Negasta]

I would not revel in your death, you have done nothing to deserve that. There are many people whom I would enjoy whatching die, you are not one of them.

I hate anybody who would force their beliefs on anybody else, be they Christians, Jews, Atheists, Muslims or Scientologists.

You do not force your views, so I have no quarrel with you.

 

[Lube]

I don't read many posts that long, Andreas, but it was very enlightening.

I don't really participate in the Politics forum (whatever it's called), but even if people are very angry sounding it's just words. At least everyone I've seen on JUB seems relatively civil.

Now, I have a brother-in-law who would probably like to see every non-Christian dead or converted, but that's the side of the family I now completely avoid. I gave up trying to debate anything political or religious with them, as apparently they made all their life decisions at, oh, about 10 years of age, and refuse to consider any alternative point of view.

 

[runner]

words

Why am I so tempted to say "whatever."

 

[eddielee]

Andreus, while I cannot fully relate to your situation I can, as a gay man, understand your feelings. Rest assured, I don't want any race or culture dead and certainly not someone as sweet as you. People say hurtful things and never think about the pain they cause others. Where I live, I've experienced hate talk that upsets me. I had a co-worker that was murdered because he was gay. He was tied to the back of a truck and dragged down the highway.

 

[Lube]

Priorities

...
I am merely explaining to you the success of life.
...
If you want to change something you are not happy about, go out there and make sure it gets changed.

It may be something trivial, such as the council wanting to put a homeless shelter at the end of your road (as happend to me last year)...

So making sure homeless shelters don't get built (in your neighborhood) and cheap gas (your sig) are your highest priorities?

 

[Andreus]

Andreus, I too have faced prejudice for my ethnic background but that is just something that you have to rise above. you are stronger than you you may believe.

yes

and today I seek a higher ground

it just hurts sometimes

 

[Croynan]

words

words are things best not weilded by the insensitive

If they did not weilded those words then their insensitivities would be in hiding and would that not be more dangerous so as not to know their thoughts?

The only other answer to their insensitivities is silence and that allows them to win.

On the other hand, silence is one of the most effective means of communication, in that it gives one almost complete control over the other person.

The price that is paid for the victory, is that nothing is resolved - and almost all remains as it was. But the silence is deafining.

I realize i am leaving a one posting statment - as I do not feel I wish to discuss or comment any further. Pesonal decision.

My intent is not to be offensive in any way, but I just feel I would be inadequate to respond any further. If I have disturbed the flow of the discussion, I truly apology for that and or any offense that has been made.


pax.

eM.

 

[Andreus]

I don't read many posts that long, Andreas, but it was very enlightening.

I don't really participate in the Politics forum (whatever it's called), but even if people are very angry sounding it's just words. At least everyone I've seen on JUB seems relatively civil.

Now, I have a brother-in-law who would probably like to see every non-Christian dead or converted, but that's the side of the family I now completely avoid. I gave up trying to debate anything political or religious with them, as apparently they made all their life decisions at, oh, about 10 years of age, and refuse to consider any alternative point of view.

oh this isn't about the political forums

politica debate is an old battle that i am very good at winning

I can argue and win every debate i enter, that i am certain.

this is about something and someone else entirely

its about me

thanks for your kindness

i remember kindness before anything

 

[Andreus]

If they did not weilded those words then their insensitivities would be in hiding and would that not be more dangerous so as not to know their thoughts?

The only other answer to their insensitivities is silence and that allows them to win.

On the other hand, silence is one of the most effective means of communication, in that it gives one almost complete control over the other person.

The price that is paid for the victory, is that nothing is resolved - and almost all remains as it was. But the silence is deafining.

I realize i am leaving a one posting statment - as I do not feel I wish to discuss or comment any further. Pesonal decision.

My intent is not to be offensive in any way, but I just feel I would be inadequate to respond any further. If I have disturbed the flow of the discussion, I truly apology for that and or any offense that has been made.


pax.

eM.

I dont know sometimes eM

is it more dangerous to repress hate? and force it into the backrooms of dirty little buildings full of men in white pointy hats?

I just dont know

you are a wise man and you have lived a long life. Your posts mean alot to me.

You, like Robert marlene, are people that i want to be like one day

thanks for the years of company and conversation, my friend.

 

[Andreus]

Andreus, while I cannot fully relate to your situation I can, as a gay man, understand your feelings. Rest assured, I don't want any race or culture dead and certainly not someone as sweet as you. People say hurtful things and never think about the pain they cause others. Where I live, I've experienced hate talk that upsets me. I had a co-worker that was murdered because he was gay. He was tied to the back of a truck and dragged down the highway.

people like you and me can make the difference, thats for sure

the yelling at the periphery can be just that

if we all speak up loud enough it can change.

as one of my idols says...

You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty.
Mahatma Gandhi

 

[Croynan]

Dismiss what i say as whatever you like, at the end of the day its how i lead my life and i have a VERY fulfilling wealthy happy lifestyle. I also have a lot of respect in the workplace AND in my social life as having an ability to solve problems quickly and efficiently and not taking any shit off anyone.

Its your choice.

Well one would have to go throught the archieves, but I believe if one did so, one might find some "cry wolf's" from the past about a accident, possible lose of a high paying job and advancement, about a b/f while at the same time meeting some guy coming out of the market for a "quickkie? and then wondering if some guy was going to call.

As for the respect in your social life you recently stated that you had been with approx. 800 men in your young years - that does not sound like respect to me. Some where along the line the feeling of insensitivity appears to have creaped in their unless those people don't really count as persons with identities and fellings and emotions. I guess they can just be perceived as non entities.

I am always amazed at how the so called "self made man" seems to lack any sense of what he might have done in the process of making one"s self. You mention you already own one home, yet you talk about not having the "homeless" not living dear you. Am I wrong or are there some sort of contradictions going on there?

You must come across very different to your co-workers and social peers for on this website it seems to me, from my vantage point of being on the other side of the monitor and ocean, that there is a lot of narcisim and egocentricity floating around when you make the "tell it like it is" postings you so often do. I could be entirely wrong and totally mis-reading you, but when I see and or read your postings that is what seems to constantly come through. I am not trying to attack you and be deliberately offensive - but these contradictions seem to abound.

Chastise me if you wish, Have this posting pulled it you wish. But I find it difficult with "one's plume" constantly being displayed for all to see.

But then again, what do I know? i am but a mere local village idiot who has trouble seeing some one give advice with two loaves (sp)
of bread in their hand at the same time.

 

[snapcat]

Drew and Joe;
Why don't you have each other on your ignore lists? I'm being totally serious. It's like you guys follow each other from thread to thread. That's creepy.

 

[Andreus]

my blood is persian...bosnian...celtic...peruvian...german...cree...

because my blood is blood.

it is the same as the iraqis and the iranians and the israelis.

once i stood at the foot of an oven
in a death camp in austria
where jews were burned, alive if there wasn't time for a "shower"

once i cried when i realized that gays were killed in the same way in the same place. i realized it could have been me.

now i remember that place, and i remember those who passed through it. the part that haunts me is the ordinariness of the place, not the horrors. you turn a corner, pass over a hill, with a farmhouse and a sheep, and suddenly, the sun sweetly shining, you have arrived.

now i realize one is not to lament being killed in that place. one is to dread becoming the killer.

blood is blood. all of that is in all of us. only what we do makes the difference.

when i was shot i promised myself and my god that i would do everything in my power to make sure that no one would haave to go through what i did.

all life is precious

by inaction we all have the guilt of the deaths of the innocents on our hands.

I'm willing to die for anything, as horible frightening and painful as I know that reality is, but im not willing to kill one single life for it.

 

[Andreus]

Drew and Joe;
Why don't you have each other on your ignore lists? I'm being totally serious. It's like you guys follow each other from thread to thread. That's creepy.

lol

he has been for weeks, and I assure you if anyone is doing the following, it isnt me.

ask an admin to check my list if you need the assurance.

I do click and open a few of his, but only in CE&P when to not do so would destroy my ability to understand the flow of a debate there. That hasn't happened yet in this thread.

thanks for the good advice.

 

[Andreus]

pointy is one, most indubitably.
but hate comes in the form of many hat shapes.

indeed

and on a note of hope....

I seem to recall a time when we were bitter and angry with each other, but now, I would consider it an honor to have you to my house for dinner.

there is something to be said for this talking stuff

 

[Lube]

I am always amazed at how the so called "self made man" seems to lack any sense of what he might have done in the process of making one's self.

A truer statement was never spoken.

 

[Andreus]

I have been kind to you....do you remember?

yes I do remember

and theres no wrong reason to do the right thing.

If that is how you would like for things to be again, then we can only let our daily actions prove that

I am slow to trust, but painfully loyal

we can start trying to earn each others trust, but it means, not unlike the warring parties in the mideast, that we cant want the last word, and that we have to give each other the benefit of the doubt, and if we are offended by each others words it needs to be worked out in private.

is that something you'd be interested in?