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Cars in the USA.
- Thread starter epikur
- Start date
While I live in Bogotá Colombia, now, I grew up in, and owned several cars in the US before retiring. US manufactured cars for the Colombian market, are generally more economical as are those in your photos. However, I notice a push here to offer the larger SUVs to the wealthy Colombians. Fuel is no less expensive here either.
It appears, that size makes right, in the Colombian driver's minds, since traffic signs (unless the police are near by) are only suggestions to drivers here.
There is a 100% import duty imposed on cars to Colombia, so owning one can get expensive.
The US market is in deep trouble, because the car makers have not awakened to the reality of Global Warming and a growing percentage of the car buying public has. Foreign car sales in the US will put an end to that trend by causing the dinosaur manufacturers to go extinct. There are US manufactured models offered here that are more economical in terms of fuel use, but they are not offered in the US.
US manufacturers of cars seem to think political pressures on elected officials will make Global Warming go away. Needless to say, they are being stupid. Their insistence on this will be the doom of the earth and of themselves.
Europeans, and most of the rest of the world have realized that fossil fuel is doing damage to the environment, not to mention that it is finite, and so while we wait for research to come up with alternative fuels, they have gone small to conserve.
My last car in the US was a Geo stick shift which was like getting into a shoe, but it got 50 miles to the gallon of gas. And got me there and back as well as any SUV. But people laughed at it and me because of it's size and mine—I'm 6 feet 4 inches, when I drove it.
Here in Colombia, I don't need a car, and if I can't walk to where I want to go, I use public transportation, which is cheap and plentiful, if not totally green.
It appears, that size makes right, in the Colombian driver's minds, since traffic signs (unless the police are near by) are only suggestions to drivers here.
There is a 100% import duty imposed on cars to Colombia, so owning one can get expensive.
The US market is in deep trouble, because the car makers have not awakened to the reality of Global Warming and a growing percentage of the car buying public has. Foreign car sales in the US will put an end to that trend by causing the dinosaur manufacturers to go extinct. There are US manufactured models offered here that are more economical in terms of fuel use, but they are not offered in the US.
US manufacturers of cars seem to think political pressures on elected officials will make Global Warming go away. Needless to say, they are being stupid. Their insistence on this will be the doom of the earth and of themselves.
Europeans, and most of the rest of the world have realized that fossil fuel is doing damage to the environment, not to mention that it is finite, and so while we wait for research to come up with alternative fuels, they have gone small to conserve.
My last car in the US was a Geo stick shift which was like getting into a shoe, but it got 50 miles to the gallon of gas. And got me there and back as well as any SUV. But people laughed at it and me because of it's size and mine—I'm 6 feet 4 inches, when I drove it.
Here in Colombia, I don't need a car, and if I can't walk to where I want to go, I use public transportation, which is cheap and plentiful, if not totally green.
Post war Europe was devastated economically and needed to raise cash. The people couldn't be burdened with a new tax, so the govts tried a "rich man" tax by taxing gasoline and having a road tax. (road taxes are paid, depending on the type of vehicle for using the road, kinda like vehicle registration, but different)
This seemed to work out fine and when the economies got better, oh, say the sixties, governments were hooked on this new source of income. People wanting cars already new of the price they would pay with the tax and either paid up, or used public transport (funded by the road tax).
As governments increased the tax on gasoline, the public demanded better gas mileage, and got it.
Whole different thing happened here in the States. Our economy was doing fine, and highways were being made to connect the country. Cars were getting bigger and faster, hey, gas was cheap!
Since most driving was done on highways and at high speed, the public demanded better safety. We were upset at the number of deaths. Cars had to meet stringent safety standards, which added weight to the cars. This is why there are quite a few smaller cars not imported here since they can't pass the safety test. (and emissions, we have limits on the amount of pollution released by cars).
Hope this helps.
This seemed to work out fine and when the economies got better, oh, say the sixties, governments were hooked on this new source of income. People wanting cars already new of the price they would pay with the tax and either paid up, or used public transport (funded by the road tax).
As governments increased the tax on gasoline, the public demanded better gas mileage, and got it.
Whole different thing happened here in the States. Our economy was doing fine, and highways were being made to connect the country. Cars were getting bigger and faster, hey, gas was cheap!
Since most driving was done on highways and at high speed, the public demanded better safety. We were upset at the number of deaths. Cars had to meet stringent safety standards, which added weight to the cars. This is why there are quite a few smaller cars not imported here since they can't pass the safety test. (and emissions, we have limits on the amount of pollution released by cars).
Hope this helps.
thermodynamics
Resident Enginerd
Yeah, I do think some of the tiny cars are truly toys. But there's a lot between Chevy Suburbans and some of the toys--they're called mid-and-full-sized sedans. I think we'd be fine there.
I do think the bill that passed Congress raising the CAFE standards was an excellent thing.
Regarding emissions, 2007 was a big deal. The next big step is 2010. The 2007 standards closed what gap was left regarding emissions between the US and other parts of the world. 2010 will will be the next gigantic hurdle. The LEV (Low emissions vehicle), ULEV (ultra low emissions vehicle), SULEV (super ultra low emissions vehicle), and PZEV (partial zero emissions vehicle) that have been around for several years (especially from Honda) will become the norm in the US. The exhaust will be cleaner than the air that went into the intake (except for CO2, which we can't get rid of). It's true. 2010 is also when diesels will be treated just like their spark ignition counterparts. The days of diesel smoke/smell are numbered.
After 2010 in the United States, both spark ignition and diesel engines will literally clean their air.
I do think the bill that passed Congress raising the CAFE standards was an excellent thing.
Regarding emissions, 2007 was a big deal. The next big step is 2010. The 2007 standards closed what gap was left regarding emissions between the US and other parts of the world. 2010 will will be the next gigantic hurdle. The LEV (Low emissions vehicle), ULEV (ultra low emissions vehicle), SULEV (super ultra low emissions vehicle), and PZEV (partial zero emissions vehicle) that have been around for several years (especially from Honda) will become the norm in the US. The exhaust will be cleaner than the air that went into the intake (except for CO2, which we can't get rid of). It's true. 2010 is also when diesels will be treated just like their spark ignition counterparts. The days of diesel smoke/smell are numbered.
After 2010 in the United States, both spark ignition and diesel engines will literally clean their air.
I am in no way defending the US auto industry, however....
The reason so many small cars you see on European roads are not on American roads is due to safety standards. Many of the cars produced in Europe don't meet the minimum crash test requirements and therefore cannot be sold here.
Smart cars are on their way, but they've had a long road before getting here. They were initially set to launch here two years ago, but due to US safety standards they had to re-engineer their cars to meet safety standards. When they were set to launch in 2005, they were planning on launching with two or three models; now, they are only bringing one model to the US.
NOW, with that said, I think CAFE standards in the US are extremely poor and should be raised immediately. The technology is there to make more efficient car engines, there's simply no incentive for US automakers to make them, nor is the government forcing them. If Toyota can make a full line of automobiles that all get over 30mpg, then Ford, Chrysler and GM sure as hell can as well.
The reason so many small cars you see on European roads are not on American roads is due to safety standards. Many of the cars produced in Europe don't meet the minimum crash test requirements and therefore cannot be sold here.
Smart cars are on their way, but they've had a long road before getting here. They were initially set to launch here two years ago, but due to US safety standards they had to re-engineer their cars to meet safety standards. When they were set to launch in 2005, they were planning on launching with two or three models; now, they are only bringing one model to the US.
NOW, with that said, I think CAFE standards in the US are extremely poor and should be raised immediately. The technology is there to make more efficient car engines, there's simply no incentive for US automakers to make them, nor is the government forcing them. If Toyota can make a full line of automobiles that all get over 30mpg, then Ford, Chrysler and GM sure as hell can as well.
Looking at this from a Canadian perspective:
We signed the flawed Kyoto Accord. It is flawed because it allows 3rd world counties to keep polluting and polluting in greater amounts over 10 years as their economies grow quickly.
We have CAFE but with the help of the big three knocking on the doors of Parliament, is was streamlined to charge a single amount of tax on a new vehicle even if it was a Smart Car or Hummer. I personally feel that SUV purchasers should have to pay a large tax to dissuade them from buying what they don't need.
As it was stated, Toyotas get more than 30 MPG. A friend has a Matrix with the super efficient powerful 1.8 engine and it does, in fact get more than 30 mpg. However like so many imports that have small engines, it needs premium fuel. The cost difference for the premium fuel negates the cost per mile savings. My V8 Mustang costs close to the same for fuel.
The smart Car is selling well here.
North Americans have enjoyed their *land yachts* but I see one problem switching to toy cars overnight. That is the size difference. If you get smucked in your Smart Car by a 105 ft long tractor-trailer it ain't gonna be pretty. People moved away from north american cars originally because of poor quality. Well, that has changed to the point that Ford has constantly improved quality and VW BMW and Mercedes quality rankings have slipped.
YMMV
Spiff
Reality goggles required
Instead of criticizing only the "American idiots" that drive an SUV, why don't you also criticize the ones that drive cars or trucks that can be equally as inefficient. There are many cars that get the same or even less mileage than some SUVs. This whole "lets crucify all SUV owners" thing has gotten out of hand, and made other gas-guzzling car owners go unnoticed. And even if some cars do get better mileage than a certain SUV, its often only by a few mpg, nothing enough to call them economically or environmentally friendly (example - the Ford Mustang, as shown in the post above.).
I'm not sure what you are saying about my Mustang. As I said the cost per mile is about the same as the Toyota. The other factor is that it is a summer car and gets low usage.
I can get 30 MPG on the highway but that is dependant an how I drive it.
S
SantaCBear
Guest
They are all evil and listen to Rush Limbaugh.
Spiff
Reality goggles required
I'd rather get run over by a fleet of SUVs than listen to Rush Limbaugh.
Spiff
Reality goggles required
An SUV owner could say the same thing where they could say it is low usage. But I don't think that will change the opinion of the anti-SUV crowd.I'm not sure what you are saying about my Mustang. As I said the cost per mile is about the same as the Toyota. The other factor is that it is a summer car and gets low usage.
I can get 30 MPG on the highway but that is dependant an how I drive it.
I'll let you in on a little secret. I also drive a Mustang. I admit, it is not an efficient vehicle and I never pretend that it is. Mine is also low usage and is garaged in the winter. 30 mpg may be better than SUVs, but it's still hardly something to consider as environmentally friendly. I just don't like hearing other car owners that get slightly better gas mileage than someone else go around pointing fingers. Unless you are driving one of the hybrids yourself, or don't drive at all, nobody is really in a position to accuse others of ruining the world.
Thats the island to the west of England and Scotland, isn't it? I don't know what Ontarios area is but Crown land makes up about 87% of Ontario's land mass, or 937,000 km2 - an area the size of British Columbia or four times the size of the United Kingdom!
Oh wait. This isn't supposed to be a pissing contest. Sorry
what? where did you get that? any sources? i am pretty sure that the european standards are a bit tougher. also every car here has to be checked at least every two years if it is still "safe" other wise you are not allowed to drive with it. i don't believe that in a country where you can still drive around with a car that is more a rolling coffin than a car, they have tougher crash tests
or do you just mean that the producer is to lazy to get any papers for any american crash tests since they don't sell any, anyway
?
i guess my last paragraph probably got it.
i just read this article:
http://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/0,1518,389458,00.html
you can't really compare the american and european standard.
americans do full frontal test, europeans do slightly overlapping frontal crashs (saying this is quite more often the case than a full frontal).
europeans ONLY test with seatbelt since this is one more safety measure (you have toe wear a seatbelt everywhere here) that works in favor of the whole concept, and designers can construct things different. also the european tests favor a good crumple zone more, while the american tests more rely on airbags etc pp. that's why it is often not easy to pass both tests with good ratings.
something interesting learned once again
still you don't have a TÜV and so nobody cares how safe the car is once it is out on the streets
i just read this article:
http://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/0,1518,389458,00.html
you can't really compare the american and european standard.
americans do full frontal test, europeans do slightly overlapping frontal crashs (saying this is quite more often the case than a full frontal).
europeans ONLY test with seatbelt since this is one more safety measure (you have toe wear a seatbelt everywhere here) that works in favor of the whole concept, and designers can construct things different. also the european tests favor a good crumple zone more, while the american tests more rely on airbags etc pp. that's why it is often not easy to pass both tests with good ratings.
something interesting learned once again
still you don't have a TÜV and so nobody cares how safe the car is once it is out on the streets
I'm sorry Noelie. I was just pulling your chain. You've had a hard day so what say we go down to the pub for a nice warm Guinness. It is warm isn't it? Lucas still making refrigerators? The beer is on me.
