Frustrated, Confused, and Need Advice

[Jukebox]

What's good, JUB peoples?

I think this is my first time in like, 2 years I've actually posted a topic on these forums. I come to browse from time to time (as you can see on my post count), but other then that I never really take participation in forum conversations.

Well here's my story, and it might mimic a lot of other tales out there, so chances are most of you have more than likely either read a situation like this, or have been in one like this. So here's the deal:

A year ago around this time, I lived wit one of my good friends. The year before we lived in the dorms, and became cool wit each other which turned into a really good friendship. We became bros pretty much. It wasn't until around this time somethin' started to happen between us, because I wasn't feeling any type of way towards him and vise versa. We started getting really close when we lived together, and by close I mean:

• 
  
  Wrestling at least 5 times out of the day
  *Up all night until 7-8 A.M. talking, or wrestling
  *We started doing things like holding each other at the waist in the middle of the room while in conversation or something
  *When we would wrestle (when it got even more playful), I'd sit on top of him for minutes at a time, and sometimes we would end up in this cuddle-like position
  *I would ask, "Can I give you a massage" (I became the aggressive one after awhile), and even though he would reply, "No", I'd do it anyway, and he'd say nothin and lie there and receive it
  *Sometimes when I would sit on top of him, he'd lay stomach down, and I'd smack his booty playfully. He never said anything. Just laid there and took it
  *Once while driving, we were arguin (playfully) over what CD to put into the player, and when I took it out, it fell into his hand, and my hand followed the CD, which ended up clutchin his hand for more than a minute. We turned to each other and smiled
  *His girl, whom he has been datin for 5 years, had one day told him, "Why dont you and him just be together. You guys do everything we do except have sex,", and while we were havin that conversation up until 7 in the A.M., I asked him if I could lay on his back, and he replied "Yea", but at the same time, he had an erection wit my pillow over his lap
  *I don't know how many times I've seen his dick. (he took a picture of it with my digital camera)
  *Sometimes, after wrestling, when we would lay in awkward positions, he would place his hand on my knee, or my leg, or on top of my hand without hesitation

Those are the key points. Hehe. Now here's the thing: one night I was just like, "Alright. F it. Obviously we're both feelin the same way, so I'm just gonna come out and tell him," so I told him. I told him why I liked him and how it started. It wasn't because of his looks, but because of his personality and everything. In the process of telling him (which means he KNEW what was up), I placed his hands and arms on my shoulders while I grabbed him by his waist and pulled him close. Did he move away? Nope. And while I was telling him all of this, he kept smiling, and then he had ANOTHER erection that same night with the pillow on his lap. Then he says to me, "Well, I don't think that way. So I'm sorry."

<---

So the next couple months are awkward. To make a long story short, he keeps claimin the reason why we never do anything is because I told him that I liked him, but thing is, from time to time, we'll start up on our old habit and flirtatiously push each other around, and sometimes I still might be able to cop a feel every now and then.

Now I asked him last night (we're still good friends) that if in his past, was he ever made fun of for being gay because of the way he talks, and he told me yes. I feel like that has something to do with it all. This is the first time I've ever felt this type of way towards another male, and I feel like his past represses feelings and emotions. Like, I feel like he's had to prove to people he's not gay by doing certain things, and goin out of his way to act a certain way towards gays because he was teased and what not growin up, and as far as I know, being teased about bein gay isnt somethin people take lightly. He told me yesterday, "If I felt some type of way towards you, I would've told you, but I don't." Actions speak louder than words. I still don't believe that bull. I haven't believed it since that night I told him and he told me he didn't feel that way.

How can 2 grown men (well, young men) CONSCIOUSLY act that way towards each other, and one come out have feelings and the other doesn't? Like, what else should I do? I told him to simply just tell me. I told him nothin would pop off between the two of us because that's too much downlow work to maintain, but I'd at least appreciate it if he came out and said it. There's no way you can't feel or be some type of way when you can let another man smack you on ya ass, give you massage, and hold you by your waist more than once and be completely okay with it. If I did that to my other best friend he'd be quick to swing. LOL! So anyone have any advice?

I know its long, but that's the condensed version. Haha.

 

[threetimes]

that is sweet... have no advice to give. im sorry. but somehow, i feel lucky to have a friend like that even though he is str8. i wldnt mind that at all... i guess?

 

[Jukebox]

Yea.

It's just frustratin'. I don't see how we can go through all of that and then he's not like that. Like, WTF, you know?

 

[NickCole]

When someone tells you who they are, believe them.

 

[Comrad]

Hehe that sounds like fun. Ok, if i where you, you old em how you feel. So just ride the wave out from there own out. But please don't push up on him anymore than you have now. Don't bring it up constantly. Just have fun and take it just for what it is. Oh yeah and upload those nude shots and personally message me sometime, soon!

 

[SilverRRCloud]

IMHO, you made one cardinal and crucial mistake.

You talked.

There was no need to invoke the whole gay thing verbally and trigger all of his defenses.

If you kept playing and fooling around and allowed the things to take their natural course, you would have had a great buddy on your side.

You chose to talk and that led you into the blind alley.

Men come in all states of mind. Some perceive themselves as very straight but would do the gay thing in complete discretion with their best friend just because they want to get their rocks off, too and do not see this as being a big deal.

Once you started talking emotions, gay relationships and all, he simply decided, he was not going to go there.

At times it is simply better to let the actions speak for themselves and leave the talk out of the equation.

SC

 

[Jukebox]

Oh I agree.

I told him, "If I would've never brought it up and told you how I felt, we'd still be doing what we did a year ago, and it probably would have gotten worse." Sometimes I feel like I should have never said a word, and other times I'm glad I did because I was a wreck trying to compete between him and his girl.

He was on this, "Well, you did everything" kick for a minute, but that talk was to remind him that it was a 50/50 thing going on here. I could see if I was coming on 100%, and he was rejecting it each time, but when I would come on, he'd come back, and sometimes he'd come onto me and I'd REALLY come back. Also, neither of us are gay. Sounds like I'm in denial but that's the truth. I've never had a feeling for another male up until then, and I've been stuck on him ever since. Maybe its a bi thing? Idk.

Part of me wants to believe him, but the other is like, "Hell nah. Somethin' isn't right." I told him I think we need to go see someone to get down to the bottom of this, and see why this happened. Idk. We're suppose to talk about it some more but wit the advice ya'll have given me I'm just gonna let it die. It'll take some time for my feelings to still go away, but at the same time, I also told him that I wouldn't want us to actually date because that would ruin the friendship too much. It's just I'd like for him to admit there was somethin instead of denyin' it, but we'll see. I'll keep you all updated!

And I don't have no nude shots, and even if I did, I wouldn't do that to him. He's still one of my best friends, and we've much respect for each other even after the circumstances. Sorry.

 

[mac_twck]

Sometimes we are physically attracted to people who don't fit our concept of what we thought.

Sounds to me like you both have some thinking to do.

I've said this before....who cares who we are with. Men with women, men with men, whoever. Just revel in the feeling of love (or lust) and go with it. If it was meant to be...it will.

Mac

 

[sheep]

He only told you he wasn't in love with you. Can't you still wrestle/massage/hug/touch etc? I think you really enjoy body contact with him and I'm damned sure he does too, so if it is still an option, do it. Just fall in love with someone else.

 

[Jukebox]

Well when I told him all of that stopped.

My theory: He was alright with it while nothing was said. Like a game of innocence if you will. It was fine what we were doin' until I actually SAID somethin. Then it was like, "Oh I'm not like that," and then it stopped. Every now and then, we'll push/shove each other around playfully, and start that smilin' stuff again, but it hasn't gone further then that. Sometimes I'll pinch at his stomach still and he won't say nothin', or, like over the summer (he picked up weight), I was like, "Lift up ya shirt so I can see this new gut of yours..." Just little stuff like that. Then he'd get to, "No, stop!" real playfully, but still let me do it anyway.

That kind of stuff still gets me all messed up. And I told him, I don't consider either of us gay. I haven't felt like this towards another male until now. His personality and overall character stimulated my mind, which stimulated my emotions and feelings. When we were close and sittin on my or his bed til 7 A.M. layin up against each other, I was extremely comfortable. I didn't want it to end. Same when we were somewhere in the room after wrestlin' holdin each other by the way. It was more of an unconscious act before I picked up that I was doin it first and he followed.

I told him yesterday that I was gonna leave it alone, and when he was ready to come and talk to me about it. He knows how I get, and yesterday for like, the first time when Mariah Carrey's "Always Be My Baby" played on my iTunes I was just in tears. It hurts to try and let that all go, but at the same time it's good for me mentally and emotionally. Idk. Even his girl has called him gay on a number of times, but I'll just let nature take its course.

Its an awkward situation, but I'm glad we're still real close friends.

 

[JackFTwist]

Well when I told him all of that stopped.

And that dear friend is the point.

Straight guys do all kinds of things. So do confused guys. This guy - who you love - does not want to go into the gay place. Talking about it makes him uncomfortable and puts a crimp on your relationship.

It's been said above: stop talking about it. Stop it.

You cannot make things happen by talk. So many of us think, and I did at your age, that if I could just find the right words and explain it, it would all make a difference...

no it does not work that way, but you can easily drive people away by all the talk.

Love him as he is and don't try to change him into something he does not want or you will lose your friend.

By the way, if I had 5¢ for every time a girl said of her straight boyfriend that he and his his buddy do everything together but sleep together, I'd be a very rich man. This is not a new thing.

I know it hurts that you love this guy so much it does hurt and the way you see it is not the way he sees it - but you cannot change it. Accept or lose, those are your real life options. I wish you the strength to accept.

 

[StlKj]

When someone tells you who they are, believe them.

Actually, when someone shows you who they are, believe them.


Just don't expect that they'll believe it too.

 

[rareboy]

How can 2 grown men (well, young men) CONSCIOUSLY act that way towards each other, and one come out have feelings and the other doesn't? Like, what else should I do?

Easy. It happens all the time. I'm sure he finds your attention and devotion flattering but it doesn't mean he has feelings for you.

What else should you do?

Back off. Period. Ease out of his life while you still can do it gracefully.

 

[iosif2]

Jukebox,

I tend to agree with you premise that your freind has fellings for you and is at least Bi. But it's clear he is in no way ready to see himself in such light. Even though you woke up and smelled the roses and are ready to define the attraction between you, he can't be forced. Everyone is giving you good advice by telling you to back off. I don't think that this means there is no future for you guys. By not feeling pressured, he might start welcoming the intimate banter you shared before as time goes by. Still, you shouldn't trap yourself waiting around for him to come to his senses. Move on if the opportunity arises. Your freind knows in his heart the depth of your friendship. He really won't want to lose you if you mean so much to him. There's always the chance that by seeing you take interest in others, his actions if not words, might show you his true feelings for you. At least this way you will know for sure. Peace

 

[Love_chair]

there all right and you said you or your friend are not gay but maybe you both are straight or one is bi or maybe hes gay and is just trying to hide it has happened but I have also read about a scientist who had a theory that its very rare but I have read that sometimes a completely straight man or woman will fall maybe once in there life for someone of the same sex because a human is a human and we all have the same emotions love hate pain lust and so maybe that theory is correct but its very interesting but I think since he said he has no fellings about you like that then you should give him his space and don't back him into a corner let him breath and continue to be there for him as a friend and if theres any hidden emotions lurking inside him then they might come out when its the right time and if hes willing just give it time my friend what else do you have

 

[Jukebox]

Jukebox,

I tend to agree with you premise that your freind has fellings for you and is at least Bi. But it's clear he is in no way ready to see himself in such light. Even though you woke up and smelled the roses and are ready to define the attraction between you, he can't be forced. Everyone is giving you good advice by telling you to back off. I don't think that this means there is no future for you guys. By not feeling pressured, he might start welcoming the intimate banter you shared before as time goes by. Still, you shouldn't trap yourself waiting around for him to come to his senses. Move on if the opportunity arises. Your freind knows in his heart the depth of your friendship. He really won't want to lose you if you mean so much to him. There's always the chance that by seeing you take interest in others, his actions if not words, might show you his true feelings for you. At least this way you will know for sure. Peace

I do try to make him jealous. lol

Sometimes it works. At parties, when I'm dancin' wit a girl he'll look at me the entire time, and even when I'm not, for instance, if he's across the room wit his girl or whatever, he'll just stare at me to see what I'm doin'. I've let it go (thanks to the help of you all, and some other people), but at the same time there's this little thing in the back of my mind sayin', "It's not over." I confronted him (prior to this post) about the two-three times he had an erection when I was layin' on his back and the night I told him. The one night he jumped on my back, and I sat on my bed (his back was up against the wall, and his legs were wrapped around me - extremely close position), and he had said, "You're about to fill somethin' in your back." Like, what the hell is that? LOL! You see what I'm sayin'? He wasn't aggressive, but there were times he'd do somethin like pinch at my stomach, or press himself up against me briefly and grab my hand.

And I don't "love" him all like that. I love him as a friend/brother, yes, but like "that", no. It's always just been a strong like. I couldn't see myself feelin' "that" way towards him. It might have turned into that if it kept goin'.

 

[Jukebox]

Hey!

Reviving an old thread for a minute.

So we're cool again, right? Okay. Thing is, we still do little things off and on time after time again. We'll bump into each other, I might pinch at his stomach, or when we shake hands it takes us longer than needed to release each other's grip and while doin so we smile at each other. Just the other day we were hangin out and some other dude came out of his shirt. I caught him lookin longer than he needed to.

What's the deal? lol. And the funny thing is is that this is the only guy I'd let do this stuff to me. I have no other attraction to anyone else of the same sex. Is that weird? I slapped him on the butt too recently and he said nothin'. If anyone else were to touch me or do anything that he does I'd get offended. Now I'm sprung again. I asked him recently if we were to hang out like we use to (all day, everyday) if he thought what all of what we use to do would get started up again he wasn't sure, but last time he gave me a definite no when things were still fresh when I told him.

I'm not goin to take it too far though. I don't want to get myself caught up like before. I'll just keep playin my cards right every so often. Sometimes I initiate stuff, and other times I back off until he does (which he does).

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! What is up with this thing called life?! lol! I don't know if we're just curious or bi. Do I want to be in a relationship with this dude if the possibility was there? It's a toss up. My religion deems that a sin, and I don't need anymore on my slate then what I have already. On the flip side, he makes me feel the exact same way when I'm wit a girl and for some reason I love it.

Dunno. guess I'm just ranting/trying to make sense of things. Its confusing!

EDIT: Also, I'm not just stuck in this position. I'm talkin' to other females and tryna get swept away by one of them before I get too caught up in this thing again. Thing is, if he does get out of the mess he's in and tells me he wants to try somethin and I'm in a relationship with a girl, then I'ma end up hurtin her for him possibly, and that's not cool. Never is it cool to up and leave someone for somethin like that, but....I don't know.