Got myself into quite the predicament. Long read, advice?

[hollywooder18]

Hey everybody. I’ve posted here a few times and while I’m not a frequent user, I lurk around often and I especially like the help and support that this section of the forums offers, so good job with that everyone! I am the latest person who could use some opinions, some guidance, and maybe a little “tough love”. Before I get into my ordeal I want everybody to understand that I know I have done wrong, and I know that I have made some mistakes. I am very comfortable admitting that I am far from perfect and I probably do not deserve the things I have. It’s my decision to open up to anybody who wants to take the time to read this, so I understand I am leaving the door open for any criticism, whether negative or positive. Am I hoping for positive advice and suggestions? Of course! Am I expected to be bashed some? Yes.. not saying I do not deserve it, but I am simply in need of some opinions from others. So I now welcome you to enter my personal life and you may choose to do with it what you want.

We will start from the beginning. First off, I am young, in my early 20s. I never touched a man until I was 18 and out of high school and I got into my first relationship (with a man) when I was 19. We did the typical “honeymoon stage” type things, it was semi-serious, we did care for and love each and we had fun for a little while, but after six months the relationship ended. Now, he wasn’t at a good point in his life and neither was I. I was in my first serious relationship and I will admit, I was a bit needy, somewhat jealous when he hung out with other people, and it took it’s toll on me and I ended up not being that nice of a guy because of it. This guy had a lot going on in his life, and he wasn’t completely “ready” to be in a relationship, at least not in my eyes. He later admitted that this was probably true. He was married, with kids. His wife knew/knows he was gay, but he was still living at home (for his kids), and he was very nervous and “sheltered” when it came to being out in public. To make things simple, let’s call this guy Anthony. Now while neither of us we probably ready to be in a relationship, him because of where his life was and me because I didn’t really know how to be in a real, committed relationship because it was so new to me, Anthony and I had a very good time together. We had a lot of fun, we got a long great, and the sex was honestly.. phenomenal. But like I said before, I got a bit “crazy” and things didn’t work out well. We stayed in contact, hooked up a few times afterwards, but then I met guy number 2, we will call him Patrick.
When Patrick and I met, we basically fell in love right off the bat. The night of our first date, we spent the night together. Nothing sexual because we both wanted to wait because we both had intentions on something serious, but to say the least, that first night was pretty perfect. Now something you all should probably know, both Anthony and Patrick are older than me, you could double my age and they’d still both be older haha (I’m 21 by the way), both are in their early 40s. With both though we knew that age didn’t matter and I’m a firm believer of that. So before Patrick and I had met, he wasn’t much of a “relationship” kind of guy. He dated but, being a New York City resident, he had his fair share of hook-ups over his 10 years of gay living. Just to note, he had been with over 100 guys, always safe and tested frequently, but he has never tried to hide how many partners he has had. He says I am his first “boyfriend”. While Patrick may not have been a boyfriend to many other people, he sure was a good one. Right from the beginning he was very romantic, very caring, very sweet, just an overall great guy. We honestly fell in love very quickly, that’s why we started living together after two months of being together.
Our first problem arose before we had even known it. I have always been a top, Patrick has always been a top. What do you do in this situation? Well, we experimented and both tried flip-flopping, and while it worked for a short period of time, I had officially become the bottom in our relationship. Did I hate it? Not necessarily, but was I 100% happy? Not really. So time goes on, things happen, and we are living our life together. We go on trips, we have fun together, and we enjoy our home life.

**Another thing you should note, when Patrick and I met, it was in my hometown in Massachusetts. He was doing business here and was going back and forth between NYC and my town via bus/train each week.

Patrick and I have our fair-share of problems, as all couples do. The big one is that I have a small issue with being separated for a long period of time, even for a few days. I have a huge fear of being hurt and I know it’s something I have to get over. I’m not overly insecure, but for some reason I have a trust issue. So obviously due to the fact that Patrick works in my hometown as well as in NYC, he has to make his way back and forth and we need to be separated once in awhile. I will admit, he has definitely started calling my hometown “home” much, much, MUCH more often than NYC, to the point where he has gone months without leaving. I know I’ve kept him sheltered and I feel terrible about it on numerous occasions.

So a year goes by (13 months to be more accurate) and Patrick and I are still together.
That’s what brings us to today. Patrick and I are still together, going on 13 months. He makes me feel good about myself, he makes me laugh, and we enjoy the time together. We don’t have a great sex life and on a scale of one to ten, my satisfaction is probably around a four, unfortunately. Now, sex isn’t the biggest thing in a relationship for me, but I do like sex.. One problem we’ve had since the beginning was that I always had to initiate it, and when I say always, I honestly mean 99.4% of the time. And of course the fact that I’m a real top trapped in a bottom’s lifestyle didn’t really add to the enjoyment, but Patrick has made it clear that he is not interested in switching things up. On a good note, Patrick gets along with my family great. They love him, he loves them, we all have a good time together. Same goes for his family and myself.
So, you guys are probably wondering why I felt the need to tell you all this. You might be asking yourself, “What does he need help with, things seem good!” Well.. prepare for the kicker. If you remember before I said that my ex, Anthony, and I have stayed in contact ever since we broke up. Anthony and Patrick have met and hit it off great and things were fine. The issue?

I never really got over Anthony.

Now I had the greatest guy I could ever imagine as my boyfriend and things are definitely looking to be long-term. But for the entire time we’ve been together, I never really shook my feelings for my ex. I would think about him every day, I would get very excited whenever we hung out, and the thoughts of being back with him were ones that reoccurred constantly in my head. But there was nothing I could really do, Anthony didn’t have feelings for me and wasn’t interested in getting back together. He had tried dating over the past year but to no avail. His luck just wasn’t very good and he just couldn’t find the right guy.

About a month ago, I was texting with Anthony about nothing in particular and he ended up telling me he’d been thinking about me a lot and was starting to wonder about us and if we should try things out again. Now he knew I was in a relationship, but for the first time in a year he was actually thinking about the idea of us as a couple again. So about a week later Patrick was out of town and I was in my sad, lonely mood, and I ended up going out for a few drinks with Anthony. We just shot the breeze, talked about life, and had a really good time together. Obviously the topics turned to he and I and he said that he’s starting the think the reason his luck has been so bad with guys is because nobody makes him feel the way I did and maybe he is supposed to be with me. Over the next few weeks (which lead to right now) we have gone out, had fun together, enjoyed each other’s company, caught up a lot, talked about us, and unfortunately, hooked up. We went out last night, and Anthony basically said he’s ready to get back together.

The thing about Anthony is that he’s a very simple guy, who lives a very simple, small-town life and I really like that. With Patrick, he is a city guy who needs to live in the city and I just don’t think that’s what I have in mind for my life. I could never picture myself doing long distance, so Patrick and I have had plans of moving to the city for good and basically leaving my hometown behind. I wouldn’t hate living in the city, who could? But I really see myself enjoying the small-town life and living more “simple”. Don’t get me wrong, I’m far from a hick or a hillbilly haha, I drive a nice car and I like to look good, but my hometown definitely is no city. Everybody knows everybody and I kind of like that.

There’s always been something that draws my head, and my heart, to Anthony and I just could never shake it. I am very happy when I am with him and he makes me feel very good about myself. He’s a very nice guy and his life is in a much better place now than it was when we were together the last time. I really don’t want anybody to get hurt, but I know somebody is going to. I honestly have no idea what to do right now and it’s stressing me out pretty bad, and I know I’m to blame.

Feel free to give your input. Any questions are very welcomed and with be answered honestly. I’m putting myself completely out there and I am looking for any opinion, whether it be positive, negative, neutral, anything. I inserted a poll just for fun, if you guys want to vote that's fine, but I'm not going to use the poll for any serious decisions haha. Thanks for reading everybody! Have a great day!

 

[Nate 90]

I won't get too deep into my observations, since it's your life and I only know what's right in front of me. But it definitely comes across that you're more interested in Anthony and the life you'd share with him. But either way you need to come clean with Patrick. Not just about what's been going on, but the numerous doubts you've had about your relationship and where it's headed. At the very least you'll gain some perspective on the situation from knowing how he feels.

 

[Ninjato]

I have always dreaded these types of situations. You're with someone but you find someone that you want to be with more. Did Anthony move out of the house? Are you sure things are going to be different? Are you going to tell Patrick that you hooked up with Anthony? Do you think Patrick will forgive you if you tell him? I really don't what to do in these situations. If you've been thinking about Anthony during your relationship, you're probably going to continue thinking about him. So it seems like you should choose Anthony. Sucks for Patrick though.

 

[hollywooder18]

Thanks for the replies guys. I definitely need to come clean, it's killing me and to be honest I really do hate hurting people, I just can't control how I feel. To answer your questions:

-Yes, Anthony did move out of his house and is much more comfortable with people seeing us together
-I am pretty sure things will be different. We are both at better paces in our life
-I'm not sure how Patrick will respond. He's a very understanding person and I honestly think he'll accept my feelings because I think he understands that I can't control my feelings. Do I think he'll forgive me for cheating? Yes, but respect will be long gone.

I am constantly thinking of Anthony, yes. And I don't see myself stopping it either, and I'm actually okay with that. Anthony honestly makes me very happy and I have a great time with him. He used to, and has started to again, text me in the mornings to say good morning and ask me how I am (I work very early so I am up at 4am).

 

[hollywooder18]

Anymore opinions? Thanks!

 

[KaraBulut]

Honestly, at this point in the game, you would be better off working on getting yourself together and deciding what you want.

If this were a casino, you're trying to decide whether to keep your money on the sure-thing (Patrick) or bet your money in a riskier deal where you may end up losing it all (Anthony).

A gambler would say "bet it all". A non-gambler would say, "Not worth the risk". The smart answer is, "take your money, get out of the game, and go home until you get a better option".

You've made a commitment to someone who is more of a friend-fuckbuddy. That means that you aren't available. Until you've resolved that situation, you are not ready for a relationship with anyone. If you're not happy and you're not satisfied with the sex, then that's something that you need to resolve before you move on.

And this might be a good time to decide what you want and why you're in these relationships.

 

[TX-Beau]

Yeah, I have to agree. Your only issue at this point is how to get out of the relationship you don't actually want.

 

[Seasoned]

Neither of these guys seem to have enough of what you want or need. It appears that you'd be wise to keep looking for a person who could offer a more fulfilling relationship. You are getting bits of what you want. These aren't the only alternatives for you. Don't settle.

 

[bankside]

You value stability and loyalty within the bounds of a relationship, and I know that because of the fears that creep into your head after a few days away from someone.

Yet you picked Anthony, who was in an unstable mess when you met him, and is terribly poor at respecting the boundaries of your current relationship.

And you picked Patrick, who was stuck in a rut of unstable random short-term flings and hook-ups until you came along, and who is now stuck in a rut of sexless inertia, barely giving back what you put into it.

My advice, quite honestly, is option three: neither. I think you should try establishing your own life as a single person for a while.

As far as the age thing, I feel I should say a word about that: it doesn't matter, and it does. I have now hit my early forties. I believe in second chances and starting over and new adventures. But if I had reached 40 and made my life a mess of awkward exes, complicated divorces, semi-closeted paranoia, strings of random relationship-defying hookups, I would feel a bit self-conscious about bringing any of that baggage into a new relationship. With someone my age, someone twice my age, someone half my age….

I believe age is not a limiting factor. I've known couples in my own family with over a 20 year gap and they were truly perfect for each other. But I can't say age doesn't matter. I hope your next 20 years are about achieving and maintaing your goals, not hitting 40 and starting over again with someone half your age. When a young man dates older men, I often hear that the young man is attracted to the maturity in a 40 year old that he never sees in men his own age. Consider the possibility that any 40-year-olds you come across, with the kind of maturity and stability you might find attractive, are likely already in long-term stable relationships that began in their 20s.

The 40 year-olds I know who qualify as mature and stable are in the same boat: we're attached, and it's been that way for 15 or 20 years, because we began this journey together in our 20s. The only way any of us would be free to date again would be if we were widowed, which has happened in some cases. But in general, the 40 year-olds I know who are free to date guys in their 20's have just spent two decades of their life not achieving anything permanent or stable, which is why they're still available. Or they've only made career achievements at the cost of stability and progress in their personal lives. Some of them I'd call flakes. Others I'd say are honestly happy but just not interested in a relationship.

Consider it, but if that's not what is happening in your situation(s) then don't worry about it. Either way though, I think you should deeply think about granting yourself a fresh start with option three.

 

[scooter63]

My opinion on this, and I am far from an expert on anything you asked, but I am a person who has no vested interest in you or your situation.

First, you are not happy with the current things going on with Patrick. You are wanting more sexual play in your relationship and you have to go ask for it. You make it sound like you have to beg for it. That to me is not a good sign nor is it healthy. Sex should be a mutual enjoyable activity that is wanted and sought by each in the relationship.

Second, while compromise is needed in any situation including a relationship, you are being forced into a sexual role that you are not comfortable with, that you are not wanting, nor are you comfortable with. (I picked that up from your wording). While you state that you have switched it up before and have talked about it, you are not comfortable in this role. We are what we are and we enjoy what we enjoy. You can't make someone like spinach if they don't like it.

Third, you are looking for something that has your partner near you at most times. When Patrick leaves for the city this leaves you alone and wanting. Now separation is good and is necessary in a relationship, it does leave you missing something when it is several days or longer term. This then leaves you to become "needy" even though you are working and conducting your life. This can and it does seem to be leading to problems.

Finally, you seem to be missing something with Patrick that is not fulfilling you with your needs. One wonders if Patrick is also missing something. Makes me wonder why the sexual activity has decreased when you state that he had over a 100 different partners in 10 years of being out. Is he getting something back in NYC when he returns and is not disclosing? Not to bring more into the picture and cause more problems, but there is the question that begs to be answered. Why the change in sexual activity? What changed in the relationship?

So this brings me to my response of what I think you should consider. I am not going to tell you to do anything as it is ultimately your decision. My suggestion is that you speak with Patrick and explain your situation. You have needs that are not being fulfilled and while you enjoy him personally and the times that you have shared, there is more that you are missing out on and lacking in your life being with him. We have to be at a happy medium and right now you are not there.

I would break off the relationship with Patrick during your explanation and while you might be afraid of what your family might think because he is such a nice guy and everything, there is more to a happy life. Your family only needs to know that things were not working out. They need to know anything else they do not need to run your life. You choose who you are with.

I would not rebound immediately into a relationship with Anthony. Live your life as a single man for a while. Date. Date Anthony and date others. Go out and find friends and acquaintances with other people and see what else is out there for you. Give it time and see where things lead with Anthony. See if things grow or if it becomes stale. The sea is large and there are a lot of fish in the sea. We may not see it personally as we have tunnel vision but when others tell us to take a good look around we can see the big picture. Give it some time to be free, to experience things in life, your young yes, and you do know what it is that makes you happy and what fulfills you inside. That is what you will look for and find. If it is Anthony, then you will find that out and you will know that. By taking it slow, you will also give Anthony time as well to grow and develop without forcing him to make choices that he might not be comfortable with that will cause regrets later on.

So my advice is to make the break with Patrick because you are not fulfilled, take time to date, explore, and see what is out there, give yourself time to put space between a bad experience, and a potential new relationship. Do some thinking and growing and then get out there and start finding it.

I wish you the best and hope that things go well with you no matter what your decision is. It is ultimately yours to make and we won't be disappointed in what it is that you do. You do what makes you happy. Keep us posted on how things go and ask further questions. Lots of eyes and thoughts and ideas are not all bad.

Best wishes to you for joy and happiness in your life always.

 

[hollywooder18]

Thank you everybody for all the replies, suggestions, and opinions. It's very refreshing to have other points of views on the situation and it is very helpful! I had a long weekend with some family from out of town so I didn't get a chance to see Anthony at all, though I may see him later on today. It was kind of relieving because I wasn't caught up in spending time together, but I did find myself missing him and texting often.

Patrick had a long weekend as well and the busy-ness of our schedules has kept us tired and without much time to talk or be alone at all. I plan on talking to him later on today, so I will keep you all posted with how that goes. He did ask me yesterday if anything was wrong and that I've seemed distant lately. He was starting to doze off so I knew I shouldn't try to get into it right then so I just told him I have had a lot on my mind lately and busy-ness and tiredness have been taking a toll, which is true.

Just so everybody knows, I do love Patrick very much. I have been in love with him and I have a very good time with him and I can see myself enjoying a good life with him. He's very smart, very successful, and he has opened me up to new experiences and I like that. I just know something is wrong because, as I tell Anthony, I haven't gone a day in over a year without thinking of Anthony. Do I think Anthony can open me to as many new experiences as Patrick? Not really. Do I think Patrick could help me excel in more areas than Anthony would? Honestly, yes. But I seem to have more fun with Anthony and I'm starting to feel that the more simple and relaxed small-town life is the one that wold make me happier.

Something that Anthony pointed out to me the other night was that he thinks I like the fact that he doesn't strive for perfection with everything he does like Patrick does. Patrick sticks to an hourly, daily, weekly schedule, which is great if that's the kind of personality you have, but I like spontaneity in my life sometimes. Just a minor tidbit I will be back with an update tonight everybody, enjoy your Sunday!

 

[Georgiadude]

Sorry but I had to stop reading as soon as I read what I knew was coming. Having been the one cheated on I can't begin to tell you what a HORRIFIC feeling it is. If you "love" him half as much as you say you do you'd have the common courtesy to tell him. If you're old enough to have adult relationships you're old enough to man up. You come here asking for advice on who to be with like you're deciding what shirt to wear. Not only asking but creating a fucking poll? Seriously?!? Disgusting. These are peoples lives your playing with. Thank God so far people have had the decency to not vote. My God, how sad. If you weren't "over" him you shouldn't have gotten involved to the extent you have. You fell in love after 2 months. Please. You were looking for someone to fill the void so you didn't have to deal with the first break up. I don't have the words and this is a no flame zone so I wont tell you what I really think of you. You are going to crush him. He's rearranged his life to spend as much time with you as he can and you repay him by sneaking around on him, lying and sleeping with an ex. You sure have a skewed view of love. He asked you tonight what was wrong and instead of being honest AGAIN you lied and hid the truth. The first guy isn't any better. He's knowingly getting involved with someone that was supposedly in a committed relationship. You're both cheaters and deserve each other. He even met the guy and trusted him to let you stay in contact with him and you two betray that trust by stabbing him in the back. What a pair.

I loved my ex more than life itself. I did everything and would have done almost anything for him. I've never loved someone so much in my life and he repayed my love with lies, deceit and cheating. It ripped my heart to pieces. I'm telling you this so you understand what you're doing to him. The longer you drag this out, the worse it's going to be. He deserves to know what the person HE believes loves him, the person he's changed his life for and gotten an apartment with is really doing to him behind his back. I truly hope you're picking up on the disgust and anger I'm trying to express while staying within the rules of this forum. If you're not compatible with him, I understand that but it doesn't excuse cheating. He's a human being and has feelings that should be shown some respect. Not some t-shirt that you just cast aside because it doesn't fit anymore. I will not help you "choose" someone. You've already chosen. You're just coming here to get some validation to make yourself feel better. So sad.

Steven.

 

[TX-Beau]

This is beginning to read like a soap opera.

 

[hollywooder18]

Sorry to make you feel like you're "reading" a soap opera. Just my life I guess.

 

[greenblue]

Yea man.. If your going to date older and wiser men you need start becoming older and wiser asap. Also remember just because your with an older man doesnt make you an older man. I couldn't even read your passage all the way through due to extreme dissapointment and an overwhelming sadness. Objectively.. you are pretty immature and it seems that you u are exactly like the younger gays that you (and I) do not like to date let alone be friends with. As a younger guy who is very excepting of older attraction and love ..

I hold it in high esteem and would never want to tarnish my reputation or the reputation of other young gay men who might be able to handle relatioship issues properly.

Maturity amounts when you are able to talk about and own your feelings. I was dating a guy who was 43 when I was 21. I knew that I was not financialy stable and laid that out on the table immediately when things begin to get serious because I didnt want to hurt him and because I didnt want to be percieved as a life ruining or money sucking 20 something gay kid who most of my friends have been damaged by. Surprisingly.. the honesty made things a little more serious... I am a firm believer (not factualy achieved) that ther reason most relationships of this nature (with such an age dispairity) dont work is because of money and the gap in lifetime achievement. The guy I was talking to could eat out ... drive.. travel and go do what he wants whenever he feels pleased. I can't. Yea i can reciprocate his approach and feelings but I could never one up him by paying for rent or driving him to and from when i pleased. Like I said presenting this to him made him think that it didnt matter. As a young and wiser gay guy It matters. matters. Its probably irrelevent but it would be really interesting to know to wha extent these guys are providing for you financialy? Sorry for any hastyness.. as I am typing this on my phone in a saddend rage at 4:30 in the morning.

 

[hollywooder18]

Neither of these guys are supporting me financially at all actually.. Everything is split equally and I sometimes choose to pay instead of either of them. Not sure where I implied that I was being supported by anybody but myself. I have a good job that keeps me financially stable and I never ask anybody to pay for anything for me. Bills are split equally except for my own (cell phone, car insurance, etc.), which are paid for by yours truly. I wake up at 4 am Monday through Friday for work so I don't need anybody else to support me.

There has been a lot going on in the past week with the situation. I don't have time to update now in full but both guys are interested in being serious, where as Patrick now knows things are wrong and still is fighting for me.. Which I do not deserve. Patrick says he would put me above everything, New York City, career, everything. He said he would work on the sexuality and because he knows how bad I want a dog, he mentioned he would give up our apartment to rent out a house for us. I really don't deserve him. He also knows that I dislike my job very much, I've worked years there and worked my way to where I am but the hours have taken a mental, physical, and emotional toll on me. Patrick said today I could quit my job and he would cover the bills and he would be happier than seeing me in pain from work.

Anthony has fallen back in love with me and says while he can't give me what Patrick can, he would give everything he has to make me happy. I am pretty sure that if I were to be with Patrick, or anybody else, I would never stop thinking about Anthony. Neither of these guys deserves what I'm doing and I'm being extremely unfair to both. I know that. I really just want to give up on everything because of what I've done and I should've never let any of this get so far. I am very ashamed and very sick because I don't know what to do.

 

[palbert]

I think you need therapy. Seriously. You are too conflicted about everything to make a rational and relationship affirming decision.

 

[altlover85]

holywooder18, what would you advise a friend to do? That might help you with some clarity on things.

I can see the attraction to both of them. If I were you I would really evaluate what YOU want, regardless of Anthony or Patrick.

If someone was to say, describe your ideal situation with the man of your dreams, what would that be like? After you've thought about that, remember that no one is perfect and that you will have to make some compromises at some point no matter who you're with.

Best of luck to you, Patrick, and Anthony.