Perpetual Machine to be Demonstrated Today

[tze100]

Wow - I think I'm going to have to pop down to London to check this out!

 

[thermodynamics]

Must be a hoax. You can't cheat the second law of thermodynamics.

 

[hunky]

Well, all I can do is wait and see, and hope it really works, for the sake of the world.

 

[Corny]

perpetum mobile? again? hehe let's see what's the flaw this time

 

[tze100]

Lisa Simpson builds a perpetual motion machine:

 

[winterknight]

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you:

THE LAWS OF THERMODYNAMICS (or heads I win, tails you lose)

1. You can't win
The increase in the internal energy of a thermodynamic system is equal to the amount of heat energy added to the system minus the work done by the system on the surroundings.

2. You can't break even
The entropy of an isolated system not in equilibrium will tend to increase over time, approaching a maximum value at equilibrium.

3. You can't leave the game
As a system approaches absolute zero of temperature, all processes cease and the entropy of the system approaches a minimum value.


(just for reference, yannow)

 

[winterknight]

You aren't listening, Yannow.

Perhaps these perpetual motion machines aren't really perpetual, inasmuch as they are tapping into other sources, like the aforementioned clock.

No "laws" are violated, which, by the way, were thought up by a human man's brain.

In that case, it's wrong to describe them as "perpetual"

A true perpetuum mobile violates either the first or second law, by definition.

The clock, for instance, would stop working if you put it in a vacuum.

 

[trawler69]

The problem I have with laws is that they are often slavishly accepted as fact, anything that appears to break them is automatically illegal. When a society has been built on old and accepted beliefs and new evidence suggests that the society was built on flawed evidence, the old school bands together to kill ,the new upstarts who threaten their credibility.

 

[_AJ_]

The problem I have with laws is that they are often slavishly accepted as fact, anything that appears to break them is automatically illegal. When a society has been built on old and accepted beliefs and new evidence suggests that the society was built on flawed evidence, the old school bands together to kill ,the new upstarts who threaten their credibility.

it's not that at all

it has just undergone no scrutiny at all the only way to prove one way or another would be to test it under controlled conditions and until proven then it is better to assume that the previous laws of thermodynamics are correct and this draws its power from somewhere and not from nowhere

it does not say anywhere that it breaks any laws of thermodynamics

i assume it does draw power from the surrounding environment be that EM, heat, wind, bees farts who knows

 

[trawler69]

it's not that at all

it has just undergone no scrutiny at all the only way to prove one way or another would be to test it under controlled conditions and until proven then it is better to assume that the previous laws of thermodynamics are correct and this draws its power from somewhere and not from nowhere

it does not say anywhere that it breaks any laws of thermodynamics

i assume it does draw power from the surrounding environment be that EM, heat, wind, bees farts who knows

I was speaking generally not specifically. Many look at something like this and immediately and with no evidence assume it is breaking a law. I am merely advocating an open minded approach in the way that has been so rare in the past. Noelie cites examples in the original post, let's chuck in Newton, Copernicus and Gallileo, heretics of their time, fathers of science now. I hope this invention works and that it is approached by open minded objective scientists who will be able to validate it despite the pressure they will be under from all sides to rubish it. The Inventors have already had personal threats.

 

[Kulindahr]

I was speaking generally not specifically. Many look at something like this and immediately and with no evidence assume it is breaking a law. I am merely advocating an open minded approach in the way that has been so rare in the past. Noelie cites examples in the original post, let's chuck in Newton, Copernicus and Gallileo, heretics of their time, fathers of science now. I hope this invention works and that it is approached by open minded objective scientists who will be able to validate it despite the pressure they will be under from all sides to rubish it. The Inventors have already had personal threats.

Personal threats... and people think the Middle Ages are over <sigh>.

I'd like to see it work, too. The fun then would be to determine its energy source!

 

[_AJ_]

Here is a couple of comments i found

"It seems as though the laws of thermodynamics cease to be violated by the machine whenever the device is subjected to scrutiny!"

and

I don't understand why he just doesn't go back in his time machine and fix it. Steorn do have a time machine, right?