Unbelievable baby serial killer

[LeicsDom]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66120934

Hospital bosses failed to investigate allegations against Lucy Letby and tried to silence doctors, the lead consultant at the neonatal unit where she worked has told the BBC.

She has been found guilty of the murder of 7 vulnerable babies but they say there are many more

 

[unloadonme]

I can't be bothered to read through the enormous amount of news coverage about this case, but I'm sure I heard somewhere that this was the longest murder trial in British legal history.

 

[unloadonme]

The judge is due to pass sentence on Monday, but that will be a mere formality. A term of life imprisonment is mandatory for murder and there can be little doubt that the judge will make a whole life order in this case.

Life imprisonment in England and Wales - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[LeicsDom]

The judge is due to pass sentence on Monday, but that will be a mere formality. A term of life imprisonment is mandatory for murder and there can be little doubt that the judge will make a whole life order in this case.

Life imprisonment in England and Wales - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

She has already said she will not appear in Court for sentencing. This will add further pressure on the Government to enable Judges to force convicted prisoners to appear before them for sentencing and to hear the victims' statements read

 

[unloadonme]

She has already said she will not appear in Court for sentencing. This will add further pressure on the Government to enable Judges to force convicted prisoners to appear before them for sentencing and to hear the victims' statements read

Maybe. She'll get the same sentence whether she elects to remain in the cells or not. The victim statement element of sentencing is, I think, a relatively recent legal development. It strikes me as mawkish and unnecessarily indulgent. The impact of having one's baby murdered must be pretty obvious. The judge will already have taken all of that into account in determining the sentence, which will undoubtedly be a whole life order in this instance in any case.

 

[NotHardUp1]

In the US system, multiple life sentences are handed down to murderers, but apparently no effort is made to resurrect them after they die and force them to serve out the rest of their due.

It's almost as if they do it to give the illusion of seeing that justice was done.

 

[pigface]

Maybe. She'll get the same sentence whether she elects to remain in the cells or not. The victim statement element of sentencing is, I think, a relatively recent legal development. It strikes me as mawkish and unnecessarily indulgent. The impact of having one's baby murdered must be pretty obvious. The judge will already have taken all of that into account in determining the sentence, which will undoubtedly be a whole life order in this instance in any case.

A victim statement is good for their mental health and recovery - if they feel it is right for them.

 

[Dargelos]

Decisions on guilt and sentencing are made by the judge and jury and nobody else. The opinions of members of the public are not based soley on evidence presented at the trial and so must not form part of the trial. Families of victims are just members of the public, allowing them to make personal statements risks making the court vunerable to populism. In this specific case, the rights and wrongs could not be clearer and nothing is going to change the verdict. But there are other, more typical cases, where the outcome is not so obvious. In these cases the expectation of an emotional diatribe from family members may affect the balance of the trial even though it is not part of the evidence. Letting off steam may well be helpful for those persons but that is not what a criminal trial is for.

 

[unloadonme]

A victim statement is good for their mental health and recovery - if they feel it is right for them.

A court of law should restrict itself to the facts. Often that includes hearing evidence from the victim. If the victim wishes to say how he or she feels about the evidence, then the psychotherapist's couch is the right place for that.

In these cases the expectation of an emotional diatribe from family members may affect the balance of the trial even though it is not part of the evidence.

Victim statements are given after the verdict and before sentence. There's therefore no possibility that they can affect the trial and I think judges are sufficiently savvy (not to mention heavily constrained by sentencing guidelines) to not be swayed by them.

 

[Dargelos]

I hope you are right. I hope it is true that judges are too professional to allow their judgement to be affected. The jury have voted before the victim statement but it can still affect them before they have heard it. For they have a good idea of what is going to be said and it is that expectation that they are reacting to. Unlike the judge, the jury members are amateurs, untrained in distancing themselves.

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

I hope you are right.

Yes. It's the same in the States: victim statements come only during the sentencing phase of a trial, after the defendant has been convicted.

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

In the US system, multiple life sentences are handed down to murderers, but apparently no effort is made to resurrect them after they die and force them to serve out the rest of their due.
It's almost as if they do it to give the illusion of seeing that justice was done.

Well, if a defendant is convicted of multiple murders, and the murder carries a penalty of death, ze'd get multiple death sentences; one wouldn't just decide not to sentence someone for murders two through six (or whatever). And everyone knows perfectly well that there will be only one actual execution. (Also, if one of the convictions is reversed, the penalty for the others would still stand.)

 

[Thad1527]

In the US system, multiple life sentences are handed down to murderers, but apparently no effort is made to resurrect them after they die and force them to serve out the rest of their due.

I always thought that meant you'd be buried in the prison yard. Seems no worse than being buried at the golf course

 

[LoveMyPeppermill]

I always thought that meant you'd be buried in the prison yard. Seems no worse than being buried at the golf course

The prison is already tax-exempt.

 

[NotHardUp1]

I always thought that meant you'd be buried in the prison yard. Seems no worse than being buried at the golf course

Just a guess, having no legal education, but I suspect the State has no say over the disposal of your remains IF you have a will/estate/heirs to claim your body. Your punishment ends at the point of death, unlike our ancestors who posted heads on gates, or left victims hanging for warnings. (shudders)

Those who were paupers and/or had no family claiming them, would have been buried in pauper's graves or even on site when the prison did so.

 

[unloadonme]

Just a guess, having no legal education, but I suspect the State has no say over the disposal of your remains IF you have a will/estate/heirs to claim your body. Your punishment ends at the point of death, unlike our ancestors who posted heads on gates, or left victims hanging for warnings. (shudders)

Those who were paupers and/or had no family claiming them, would have been buried in pauper's graves or even on site when the prison did so.

In the UK, capital punishment ended in the 1960s, but until that time executed prisoners were by law buried within the prison grounds regardless of the wishes of the deceased or his or her family.

BURIAL OF OFFENDERS (Hansard, 18 July 1961)

BURIAL OF OFFENDERS (Hansard, 18 July 1961)

api.parliament.uk

 

[unloadonme]

As predicted, Letby has just been given a whole life term of imprisonment for each of the murders and attempted murders.

 

[pigface]

This woman must have some psychiatric illness. Whether there would be any value in putting her in an asylum rather than a prison, I don't know.

 

[unloadonme]

This woman must have some psychiatric illness. Whether there would be any value in putting her in an asylum rather than a prison, I don't know.

I think that the defence lawyers would have made full use of the psycho angle if there has been any justification whatsoever for taking such a line. As it was, the case was tried on the basis that she was sane.

 

[rareboy]

This woman must have some psychiatric illness. Whether there would be any value in putting her in an asylum rather than a prison, I don't know.

The angel of mercy mental illness syndrome has been put forward many times where nurses have been either suspected or convicted of killing infants or elderly people.

The Hospital for Sick Kids here in Toronto went though an horrific investigation that ultimately seemed to conclusively prove there were never any murders at all.

Alternatively, the nurse who injected elderly patients with insulin

Elizabeth Wettlaufer - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org