Americans Say "No" To U.S. Involvement in Syria- Despite Chemical Weapons Used by Government

[T-Rexx]

Assad and Putin are having a good laugh at our "community organizer" LOL.

Too bad GWB was never a "community organizer."

The USA would be $1 trillion and 4,000 lives richer.

Obama has badly mishandled the Syrian crisis, but Obama's incompetence in this regard does not compare in the least to that of GWB. And the situation would not even be a "crisis" but for GWB's spectacular stupidity in Iraq. But for that, all of Congress and the American people would be supporting Obama on attacking Syria today.

Obama is wrong about Syria, and he has clumsily embarrassed himself by not embracing traditional liberal approaches to foreign policy (Obama is, after all, a Republican at heart. That's what got him in trouble in Syria in the first place - he is trying to copy GWB). But at least Obama has not killed 100,000+ people, bankrupted the treasury, and lied us into a destructive war. The "community organizer" has given us the most competent management of foreign policy - and that includes Syria - that the USA has seen in 13 years.

Obama deserves a lot of criticism for his bungling of Syria. Laugh if you want. But, please, give me more of this hilarious bungling. The Republican approach kills people while making the underlying problems worse.

 

[rareboy]

I have no idea why everyone keeps saying this was mishandled.

The US President threatened unilateral military action.

The US gave Syria an alternative.

Russia was smart enough to pick up on this diplomatic initiative.

Today the Russians and the US have announced that after three days of meetings in Switzerland, an agreement for Syria handing over the Chemical Weapons and becoming a signatory to the Convention has been reached.

GENEVA -- U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry and Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov reached agreement Saturday on a framework for Syria to destroy all of its chemical weapons, and said they would seek a UN Security Council resolution that could authorize sanctions -- short of military action -- if Syrian President Bashar Assad's government fails to comply....

"The world will now expect the Assad regime to live up to its public commitment," Kerry told a packed news conference in the Intercontinental Hotel in Geneva, where he has been staying and the negotiations were conducted since Thursday night. "There can be no games, no room for avoidance, or anything less than full compliance by the Assad regime."


Read more: http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/syria-s...under-u-s-russia-deal-1.1454712#ixzz2esKXc2mV

It would seem as though with the `good`will of the two Superpowers battling it out over this little proxy state that the problem has been solved. Would it have been solved without credible threat of military action? Not likrly. Would it have been solved without the agreement by the Russians that the Assad regime had actually used CW? No.

My hat is off to both Obama and Putin for doing what world leaders should do. Come to an agreement. Without the loss of more innocent lives.

Hopefully now, a schedule for the resumption of talks to end the civil war can now be put back into play.

 

[Kulindahr]

I have no idea why everyone keeps saying this was mishandled.

The US President threatened unilateral military action.

The US gave Syria an alternative.

Russia was smart enough to pick up on this diplomatic initiative.

Today the Russians and the US have announced that after three days of meetings in Switzerland, an agreement for Syria handing over the Chemical Weapons and becoming a signatory to the Convention has been reached.



It would seem as though with the `good`will of the two Superpowers battling it out over this little proxy state that the problem has been solved. Would it have been solved without credible threat of military action? Not likrly. Would it have been solved without the agreement by the Russians that the Assad regime had actually used CW? No.

My hat is off to both Obama and Putin for doing what world leaders should do. Come to an agreement. Without the loss of more innocent lives.

Hopefully now, a schedule for the resumption of talks to end the civil war can now be put back into play.

I think the view is that Obama, Putin, and everyone stumbled into this solution. Do you think this was the intent all along?

 

[kallipolis]

I think the view is that Obama, Putin, and everyone stumbled into this solution. Do you think this was the intent all along?

From our perspective it would be guessing.....I'd guess that Obama, and Putin understood that a diplomatic compromise was in everyone's interest, for even American military strategists have learnt from their experiences in Iraq, and Afghanistan that launching missiles does not guarantee the success of the mission.....with Iraq, and Afghanistan providing sufficient evidence that other tactics may provide a remedy that military intervention could not.

 

[rareboy]

I think the view is that Obama, Putin, and everyone stumbled into this solution. Do you think this was the intent all along?

These are not stupid men.

Does anyone actually believe that Putin and Obama and their teams didn't discuss alternative measures when they sat down together in St. Petersburg? Seriously?

I think that a lot of what we've witnessed in the last week and a half has been as much stagecraft as anything.

 

[TX-Beau]

I don't. I think asshole in Syria though he could get away with it, kinda did, Obama got his unfortunate posturing handed to him, and Putin decided to pretend he isn't a thug dictator just like the guy in Syria.

They may have "discussed" the general situation, but I simply don't see Obama and Putin in Cahoots!

(Cahoots, love that word.)

 

[darden]

yeah... while I'm glad for the outcome, listen to the original Kerry clip in context, with audio/video not just the transcript. he was very obviously offered up the "deal" facetiously, while talking about how Syria could never actually be trusted, but the Russians saw an out and ran with it.

unless he spent the last 8 years taking acting classes, the 2004 Kerry I remember isn't nearly that good of an actor.

 

[Jack Springer]

These are not stupid men.

Does anyone actually believe that Putin and Obama and their teams didn't discuss alternative measures when they sat down together in St. Petersburg? Seriously?

I think that a lot of what we've witnessed in the last week and a half has been as much stagecraft as anything.

Can you stage stupidity? Obama, Kerry, and crew are bumbling idiots.

If you believe this was a grand scheme ... maybe you should also be buying the grand canyon, brooklyn bridge, etc.

 

[xbuzzerx]

Too bad GWB was never a "community organizer."

The USA would be $1 trillion and 4,000 lives richer.

Obama has badly mishandled the Syrian crisis, but Obama's incompetence in this regard does not compare in the least to that of GWB. And the situation would not even be a "crisis" but for GWB's spectacular stupidity in Iraq. But for that, all of Congress and the American people would be supporting Obama on attacking Syria today.

Obama is wrong about Syria, and he has clumsily embarrassed himself by not embracing traditional liberal approaches to foreign policy (Obama is, after all, a Republican at heart. That's what got him in trouble in Syria in the first place - he is trying to copy GWB). But at least Obama has not killed 100,000+ people, bankrupted the treasury, and lied us into a destructive war. The "community organizer" has given us the most competent management of foreign policy - and that includes Syria - that the USA has seen in 13 years.

Obama deserves a lot of criticism for his bungling of Syria. Laugh if you want. But, please, give me more of this hilarious bungling. The Republican approach kills people while making the underlying problems worse.

This speaks for me as well. Republicans trying to equate Benghazi with (or make worse than) the failure to act on the security memo prior to 9/11, and then turning around and trying to equate Obama's performance in a conjectural conflict that has thus far cost us nothing in military casualties or money with George Bush's Iraq policy. Amazing.

At the earliest stages of this whole story, when Republicans were anticipating that Obama would want to intervene (and thus they were against intervention at that time) I said to a friend, the cognitive dissonance on this vs. their wholehearted support of Bush's claim of maybe-sorta weapons would end up being amazing, but as usual, only progressives noticed the cognitive dissonance.

Now that it looks like Obama's not going to strike, let's retool the discussion into Obama's lack of effectiveness-- even though we were against intervention when he wanted it.

Really, it's ridiculous.

 

[Kulindahr]

This speaks for me as well. Republicans trying to equate Benghazi with (or make worse than) the failure to act on the security memo prior to 9/11, and then turning around and trying to equate Obama's performance in a conjectural conflict that has thus far cost us nothing in military casualties or money with George Bush's Iraq policy. Amazing.

At the earliest stages of this whole story, when Republicans were anticipating that Obama would want to intervene (and thus they were against intervention at that time) I said to a friend, the cognitive dissonance on this vs. their wholehearted support of Bush's claim of maybe-sorta weapons would end up being amazing, but as usual, only progressives noticed the cognitive dissonance.

Now that it looks like Obama's not going to strike, let's retool the discussion into Obama's lack of effectiveness-- even though we were against intervention when he wanted it.

Really, it's ridiculous.

I think the incompetence charge is related more to the overall lack of achieving anything until the Russians stepped in than specifically to military intervention.

 

[Rolyo85]

Can you stage stupidity? Obama, Kerry, and crew are bumbling idiots.

If you believe this was a grand scheme ... maybe you should also be buying the grand canyon, brooklyn bridge, etc.

Obama is a bumbling idiot eh? Gosh what a dark spiteful world you live in...

 

[T-Rexx]

These are not stupid men.

No, but intelligent men sometimes do very stupid things.

Does anyone actually believe that Putin and Obama and their teams didn't discuss alternative measures when they sat down together in St. Petersburg? Seriously?

Apparently not. John Kerry said that Syria would never give up its chemical weapons. Syria said that would be no problem. Obviously, our Secretary of State never bothered to ask. I was under the impression that it was part of the Sec of State's job to try to avoid wars by negotiating peaceful alternatives between the parties involved in a dispute.

At the earliest stages of this whole story, when Republicans were anticipating that Obama would want to intervene (and thus they were against intervention at that time) I said to a friend, the cognitive dissonance on this vs. their wholehearted support of Bush's claim of maybe-sorta weapons would end up being amazing, but as usual, only progressives noticed the cognitive dissonance.

I thought that interesting also. But I don't think anyone expected Republicans to support Obama on attacking Syria (despite the obvious cognitive dissonance with GWB and Iraq) because a greater cognitive dissonance for them would be to support Obama on anything.

Now that it looks like Obama's not going to strike, let's retool the discussion into Obama's lack of effectiveness-- even though we were against intervention when he wanted it.

Yes. Republicans did not support the president when he wanted to attack Syria. Now that he wants to try diplomatic options instead, that is wrong, also, of course.

It is humorous, but obviously Republicans have almost no policy on anything except to oppose whatever it is that Obama wants. Obamacare was their plan until Obama endorsed it. Then, it became the anti-Christ. Invading middle eastern countries over WMDs was their plan until Obama endorsed it. Then it became incompetence.

Really, it's ridiculous.

It is spectacularly ridiculous, all around.

The president should have explored diplomatic options with Syria from the outset. I find it embarrassing that it is Putin who is promoting peace, not the president. I find it embarrassing that Obama wants (or wanted?) to copy move by move the most obviously absurd and destructive foreign policy the USA has pursued in decades.

And I find it embarrassing that half of America's politicians have no plan of action on anything. The sum total of their contribution to politics is to try to stop the other side from making America a better place.

 

[Sausy]

Obama is a bumbling idiot eh? Gosh what a dark spiteful world you live in...

If you think the world really respects our Administration, time for you to take off the rose colored glasses in YOUR world. Obama has been a horror show, though fortunately as of yet he isn't GWB. Yet his combination of arrogance and obliviousness to his own limitations may be his biggest undoing.

I was and still remain opposed to the strikes, btw.. so don't go there. We were wrong to try to remake Iraq by military force, and Syria would be even worse as it is a nation falling apart, beset with drought and famine in so many regions. However I don't trust this president's competence here one bit, and that of his pretentiously grand Secretary of State, the sanctimonious John Kerry? Pl-ease!!!!!!!!

 

[Jack Springer]

Obama is a bumbling idiot eh? Gosh what a dark spiteful world you live in...

Obama allowed Putin to become a world leader in the past week by a mess of unorganized and confusing statements by members of hi administration. You and others here are spreading the BS that it was all planned and orchestrated by Obama -- do you realize how insane that sounds?

Can you please tell me the purpose and goal?

 

[kallipolis]

Obama allowed Putin to become a world leader in the past week by a mess of unorganized and confusing statements by members of hi administration. You and others here are spreading the BS that it was all planned and orchestrated by Obama -- do you realize how insane that sounds?

Can you please tell me the purpose and goal?

Unlike you, Jack - and your fly on the wall informer - I'm not as well informed on the daily activities of Putin, and Obama preferring to focus on the end result of the diplomatic exchanges between the Russians, and the Americans long may they continue ....

 

[rareboy]

Obama allowed Putin to become a world leader in the past week by a mess of unorganized and confusing statements by members of hi administration. You and others here are spreading the BS that it was all planned and orchestrated by Obama -- do you realize how insane that sounds?

Can you please tell me the purpose and goal?

Jack. News alert. Russia...and Putin are major players on the world stage. I think that your world view that the President of the US should be making policy and 'solving' the problems for everyone else is naive and arrogant. It has been responsible for a never ending narrative of misery and blowback for the last fifty plus years.

The only country that could solve this current issue in their client state was Russia. And it was Russia that blinked in the face of military threats against the regime they prop up. And it was done in such a way as to demonstrate to the world that it is possible to reach a diplomatic, versus a military solution to the problem at hand.

Win-Win.

 

[Jack Springer]

Unlike you, Jack - and your fly on the wall informer - I'm not as well informed on the daily activities of Putin, and Obama preferring to focus on the end result of the diplomatic exchanges between the Russians, and the Americans long may they continue ....

So you believe that Russia's increased presence and influence in the Middle East is a good thing. I don't.

 

[Jack Springer]

Jack. News alert. Russia...and Putin are major players on the world stage. I think that your world view that the President of the US should be making policy and 'solving' the problems for everyone else is naive and arrogant. It has been responsible for a never ending narrative of misery and blowback for the last fifty plus years.

The only country that could solve this current issue in their client state was Russia. And it was Russia that blinked in the face of military threats against the regime they prop up. And it was done in such a way as to demonstrate to the world that it is possible to reach a diplomatic, versus a military solution to the problem at hand.

Win-Win.

What's solved? Assad has said he's won. He'll put up road blocks from now on and will keep killing his own countryman. The war is still going on, people are getting bombed, killed, and others pushed to other countries. That's a diplomatic victory?

Russia is the new power of influence in the Middle East, the influence of the US has been diminished.

It's time to drill, drill, drill and become energy independent any way we can.

 

[kallipolis]

So you believe that Russia's increased presence and influence in the Middle East is a good thing. I don't.

Russia's influence in Syria dates back very many years not a new reality....and is influential in persuading Assad to surrender his chemical weapons, a constructive contribution to reducing international tensions in a neighbourhood that is festering with extreme violence...otherwise, Russia's influence in the Middle East is Iran where it sells its weapons not because the Mullahs have any love for Putin's Russia....also appreciating that as a result of the embargo Western manufacutured weaponry, and other high technology - civil aircraft - may not be sold.

The Middle East is dominated by Western nations selling their weaponry, and everything else that the rich Arabs can afford to buy making use of bases (Kuwait, Oman, UAE) with the United States, and the United Kingdom's influence overwhelming.

 

[TX-Beau]

Re: Americans Say "No" To U.S. Involvement in Syria- Despite Chemical Weapons Used by Government

So you believe that Russia's increased presence and influence in the Middle East is a good thing. I don't.

Love how you invented a conclusion that was nowhere in his post, then proceeded to argue with yourself.

- - - Updated - - -

What's solved? Assad has said he's won. He'll put up road blocks from now on and will keep killing his own countryman. The war is still going on, people are getting bombed, killed, and others pushed to other countries. That's a diplomatic victory?

Russia is the new power of influence in the Middle East, the influence of the US has been diminished.

It's time to drill, drill, drill and become energy independent any way we can.

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!!!!!