The Original Gay Porn Community - Free Gay Movies and Photos, Gay Porn Site Reviews and Adult Gay Forums

  • Welcome To Just Us Boys - The World's Largest Gay Message Board Community

    In order to comply with recent US Supreme Court rulings regarding adult content, we will be making changes in the future to require that you log into your account to view adult content on the site.
    If you do not have an account, please register.
    REGISTER HERE - 100% FREE / We Will Never Sell Your Info

    To register, turn off your VPN; you can re-enable the VPN after registration. You must maintain an active email address on your account: disposable email addresses cannot be used to register.

Americans Say "No" To U.S. Involvement in Syria- Despite Chemical Weapons Used by Government

Another big difference is that Congress was involved in 2002 and 2003 .... in 2013 they evidently will not be involved. Obama will strike without the approval of the US Congress.

Also, a major problem in your thinking is that both Biden and Obama were very adamant that the POTUS did not have the power to do what Obama now says he is going to do. I'd call that hypocritical on both Biden and Obama.

Bush also went to Congress -- Obama evidently has no intention

So I guess now you'll give the president some praise for taking your advice. No? I shouldn't hold my breath and wait for it, you say? Didn't think so.

Someone who hates the military and doesn't have a clue about tactical plans. Someone who is confused about their role and lacks leadership abilities.

So, I'm confused at your position. Should he have gone to congress or should he not? I understand that the official Republican/Conservative position is to be against WHATEVER the president's position is, but I'm curious as to where you fall in this. Or do you fall on the opposite side of "whatever Obama does."

Someone who publicly gives two views of the same issue in the same day.

Does anyone have a spoon handy? I can't afford the calories, but the irony is just TOO delicious to pass up!

To paraphrase a certain poster, carrying a shit bucket to throw at Obama is a tough job. You have to leave your common sense and intellect at the door and blindly attack.

I remember my grandparents talking about how the Depression would not end and how Roosevelt drew the US into war as a solution.

This answers SO MANY questions about you Jack, and proves that Reactionary Conservatism is not only a pernicious disease it's also hereditary!
 
I would like the filthy rich countries like Dubia and Saudi help Syria ..


 
I don't think you seem to feel the repercussions of what those lil' ol' consequences seem to be that I listed. Maybe the last recession didn't affect you if you made good money, but it most certainly affected middle class Main Street America who felt the pinch at the gas station, the supermarket, going out to eat, etc. Anything that relies on transportation and uses fuel to get commodities to their destinations will be affected by an all-out war.

Well, the experts are saying that the Syrian situation won't spike oil prices significantly. The NY Times has an article (site isn't allowing me to link it but you can Google the title), "Major Surge is Unlikely for Prices of US Gas", which isn't too surprising given how little Syria exports.

Unless, you have sources that say otherwise about US gas prices, I would consider that as a reason to not intervene.

Again, this does not affect our national security interests. If it did, I would have a different perspective. But it doesn't. To those people that were affected by this attack, I am sorry ... at the same time it is not the business of the United States' citizens. I understand that sounds cold, but after seeing what we've seen this past decade, enough is enough and the majority of the public wants the U.S. to reverse course on foreign policy. That was one of the key reasons Obama was elected. Most definitely was one of the key reasons I voted for him.

I don't think the Libyan revolution was in our interests either. Or the Rwandan Genocide when we decided to sit it out. Not having a personal tie to a crisis is no rule in whether you should get involved or not. I know if you saw a car accident, you wouldn't keep driving. You'd, at the very least, call 9-1-1-. Same reasoning here.



You don't know that, Lost. Sure, Obama can say that now that he is not looking to send boots there. That is assuming war doesn't break out. What happens if war does break out? I don't feel you are analyzing all of the possible outcomes and reactions to this lil' ol' strike Obama was planning. War breaking is most definitely a very real and I feel likely possibility. The armed forces will have to get involved if that occurs.

And you don't know that we will send in soldiers into Syria. You're letting the worst-case scenario guide you and how you feel on what should be done. (It's the Chicken Little approach to international diplomacy.) If the worst case scenario would look like it was going to happen, I'd think you and I would agree on staying out. But making Syria into a military giant, when it isn't, is far from reality. Israel has routinely antagonized it over the years and it has never directly responded to Israel.



I am not saying Syria will ever win a conflict with the United States or the team of Syria and Iran. What I am saying is that "it isn't our God-damned business", Lost. We have zero to gain by getting involved. Get rid of one dictator and replace him with an Al Qaeda-backed government. Wonderful.

Dennis Kucinich hit the nail on the head with this. Obama made the right move yesterday.

Obama is not doing regime change. Unless you have evidence to the contrary, bringing up that we're "get[ting] rid of one dictator" and replacing it with another is made up. Newt Gingrich of all people had a great point yesterday while on CNN when he said that some of the rebels are more anti-American than Assad is. And that's true. Obama would be a fool to tip the balance of power and create a power vacuum where these terrorist/rebels could take control of Syria. Obama is no fool. He won't allow this to happen.

Obama has stayed out of this conflict for two years, clearly wanting no part of it. And now that he feels obliged to respond military, people think he's going to send it to hell a hand basket by not exercising caution. Cautious is the best word to describe Obama's approach so far. He's refused to supply weapons and only agreed to do so months ago after the first incidences of chemical weapons. And, from what I've heard from rebel commanders, US weapons still haven't arrived.

Obama is clearly practicing restraint and caution.
 
Lost, my opinion is not changing, and neither is yours apparently. I have my reasons and I am not backing down on them. This has been thought-out on my end and is as hot button a topic as you can get for me.

For everyone else, I contacted my Congressmen and Senators and urged them strongly to vote "No" on any authorization to the use of force in Syria. Those that feel strongly about this, I would urge you to also contact your representatives in Congress on this.

http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

If President Obama does not respect Congress' "No" vote on this, which I am seeing this morning that Kerry is saying the President does not feel he needs Congress' approval on this and may strike anyway ... I will be contacting my Congressmen for President Obama's impeachment.

And I think in this day and age, he will be impeached. It would be a disastrous and unfortunate end to his Presidency ... all simply because of his desire to put foreign matters that don't affect this country over domestic matters that do affect our nation's citizens.
 
If he's going to go to Congress for a vote, he must accept the results. If not he is beyond salvageable as the representative chief executive of a constitutional federal representative democracy. Or what is SUPPOSED to be one. No doubt he'll lose most of the left on this, and without them he has nothing. I'm no fan of his as most of my posts on him will show yet I don't want this for the country, A.. WTF is with you, Mr. President?!!!
 
President Obama's foot-dragging and allowing the UN to complete its assessment is a result of the Cowboy in 2003 who said fuck the world and the constitution. Consensus isn't a bad thing.

Your memory is in error. The "Cowboy" sat smiling while Cheney and Rumsfeld orchestrated the herding of Congress to go through the proper motions.

If President Obama does not respect Congress' "No" vote on this, which I am seeing this morning that Kerry is saying the President does not feel he needs Congress' approval on this and may strike anyway ... I will be contacting my Congressmen for President Obama's impeachment.

And I think in this day and age, he will be impeached. It would be a disastrous and unfortunate end to his Presidency ... all simply because of his desire to put foreign matters that don't affect this country over domestic matters that do affect our nation's citizens.

Sadly, he would be impeached not because so many in Congress would think it good for the country, but because they don't care about the country, just their careers and ideology.
 
Sadly, as I alluded in the other thread, I think a lot of this is coming down to his own ego, frankly, and possibly whoever has been in his ear egging him on with this. I have said for some time now that the president's powers are vastly over-rated ... but evidently some presidents feel the need to show how big they think their sticks are to the world by talking tough ... regardless of what the country's citizens are saying, and regardless of how little this matter even affects us (which it doesn't).

They just need their ego fed so that if they say they are going to do something, then they want to show their power and do it. And I feel Obama has been in the Oval Office long enough that he is beginning to feel insecure about his power that he feels he needs to show it in some capacity ... just to satisfy himself.

Sounds like his Chief of Staff was able to break through and talk some sense into him on Friday night. Hopefully, warhawk Hillary is also taking good notes of this situation if she plans to run in 2016. The country has vastly changed and when they say they aren't going to tolerate the continuation of the Bush Foreign Policy, they mean it.
 
This whole thing is a catastrophe in the making.... WWI was set off by the Archduke Ferdinand's assassination. John Kerry seems bent to press the case of action by pushing that now evidence of sarin gas use by the Assad regime. If we do act to punish the Assad regime for use of chemical weapons, now alleged use of nerve gas.... no doubt in my mind someone is either going to go off script or go calculatedly cold and compound this by a horrific attack that would cause the whole thing to explode and put the world in a situation we may not be able to get out of without great misery falling on at least some segment. Congress, please vote no... and Mr. President, ACCEPT that result.
 
Sadly, as I alluded in the other thread, I think a lot of this is coming down to his own ego, frankly, and possibly whoever has been in his ear egging him on with this. I have said for some time now that the president's powers are vastly over-rated ... but evidently some presidents feel the need to show how big they think their sticks are to the world by talking tough ... regardless of what the country's citizens are saying, and regardless of how little this matter even affects us (which it doesn't).

They just need their ego fed so that if they say they are going to do something, then they want to show their power and do it. And I feel Obama has been in the Oval Office long enough that he is beginning to feel insecure about his power that he feels he needs to show it in some capacity ... just to satisfy himself.

Sounds like his Chief of Staff was able to break through and talk some sense into him on Friday night. Hopefully, warhawk Hillary is also taking good notes of this situation if she plans to run in 2016. The country has vastly changed and when they say they aren't going to tolerate the continuation of the Bush Foreign Policy, they mean it.

I keep hoping he'll invent a new "Obama Doctrine", that says when there is use of weapons of mass destruction, we go to the people whose intelligence services can be counted on to do a good job, and if there's agreement on who ordered that use ad who recommended it, we go after the people responsible -- personally. So long as we pretend that "countries" make decisions to do such things, the problem will never go away; it has to be addressed as an issue of personal responsibility to maintain a minimum standard of acting like a human being.
 
What comedy -- it says "the conflict in Syria will only be resolved through a negotiated political settlement"!

Maybe... in a hundred years.

I feel like the major world powers should force a sit down of leaders from all the major Arab world ethnic and religious groups, and force a redrawing of the map... so many of the problems we're experiencing are a result of the borders that England arbitrarily drew up (and in the case of Syria, you've got a ruling class ethnic minority group who's terrified of having to face judgement day if/when the subjugated majority gets into power)
 
I feel like the major world powers should force a sit down of leaders from all the major Arab world ethnic and religious groups, and force a redrawing of the map... so many of the problems we're experiencing are a result of the borders that England arbitrarily drew up (and in the case of Syria, you've got a ruling class ethnic minority group who's terrified of having to face judgement day if/when the subjugated majority gets into power)

I've had that thought myself. It always comes up when I read about the Kurds, who've been promised a homeland by international agreements but still don't have it. Since Syria has Kurds, this would be a good moment to start the process... though we missed a better one when we were running Iraq. Start with outlining an independent Kurdistan, and work from there. Promise money for people to move to where they want to be -- that would be a lot cheaper than continual intermittent military interventions.

What we can't do is continue to act like the British did, certain of our own superiority to the point where we don't even consider paying attention to human reality.
 
Very nice, very humane thinking.... unfortunately the states that would be affected would never do this voluntarily. Seems as just around the corner as the thought of a successfully negotiated political settlement. The lack of vision and foresight by colonial masters, particularly Britain is now poised to collectively bite the world, and not just in the ass.

oh, and just from CNN... now the Saudis are officially egging on a US led strike, saying something to the effect the Assad regime has "crossed the bounds of infamy".:rolleyes:
 
Times like these you get to see which countries are the adults and which are the children.

Canada, Australia, Sweden, Germany are nowhere to be found? Free riding much?

Canada called for a "firm response." Why are they so silent when it comes to action?

I've been asking for days now and all I've gotten is silence (totally expected). I asked this because this cowardly silence will be forgotten when the US strikes Syrian government targets. These cowardly people are good at not offering solutions and criticizing the doers in the world community.
 
The alleged intelligence is too sketchy to bother with.

Times like these you get to see which countries are the adults and which are the children.

Canada, Australia, Sweden, Germany are nowhere to be found? Free riding much?

Canada called for a "firm response." Why are they so silent when it comes to action?

I've been asking for days now and all I've gotten is silence (totally expected). I asked this because this cowardly silence will be forgotten when the US strikes Syrian government targets. These cowardly people are good at not offering solutions and criticizing the doers in the world community.

And numerous posters have already told you why Canada isn't doing anything. In your own thread too. Learn to read.
 
The alleged intelligence is too sketchy to bother with.



And numerous posters have already told you why Canada isn't doing anything. In your own thread too. Learn to read.

It isn't about what we're going to do or not do. Lost Lover has so many of us on ignore he doesn't have a fucking clue about who has said what. This is all about the huge hate on the LL has for Canada. And Germany. And his apparent inability to actually just Google and get the answer. This is about him hectoring and baiting the Jubbers from other countries by presenting the false case that the US is always left to go it alone in any military action that pops into their President's mind at any given moment. We all know that this is bullshit, but all we get is LL pretending that the entire world is somehow freeloading off the US military industrial complex. Canada has said that it will do the same as we did in Libya...send warships to help protect the American fleet. When Canada, among other countries calls for a firm response...it doesn't mean that the first thing you do is bomb everything.


By the way...just for the record...before LL et al get so up in arms about chemical weapons and chemical warfare...can y'all tell me when the US destroyed the last of its own stockpile of CW's. Hint: Not yet.
 
.... By the way...just for the record...before LL et al get so up in arms about chemical weapons and chemical warfare...can y'all tell me when the US destroyed the last of its own stockpile of CW's. Hint: Not yet.

Why should we destroy them. We and our surrogates need to use them.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013...chemical-weapons-within-the-last-8-years.html

http://www.pslweb.org/liberationnews/news/9-times-used-chemical-weapons-WMDs.html

http://rt.com/news/us-chemical-weapons-portnaya-152/

Utter hypocrisy.
 
The congress is biased by liberals anyway so Sept 9 or so they will do a fast vote and approve the strike.

Democracy at work with current liberal slant. You will see the results.

Obama doesn't care about his poll numbers at this point or about over-use of executive powers. He just want to prove the Congress is in his camp and in so doing is actually staging for the next election to ensure a smooth (liberal) transistion.

Oh yeah...here come the naysayers but the vote will stand for itself.

Obama has an agenda..Syria is just a convenient venue.
 

But what is the actual real game here? Is it to provoke a reaction from Iran so that the scope of use of force can be widened further?
Is it to provoke Syria into making an attack on Israel or Turkey in order to justify a boots on the ground incursion into Syria? I have to say that I am baffled. They have no oil. They aren't that important geographically or strategically.

It can't be domestic politics because I can't see either the Republicans or Democrats gaining an advantage in the 2014 cycle out of this?

What is driving this...except ego?
 
But Syrians who say Obama is a coward are wrong. He's not a coward but he lets his personal agenda in party politics dictate everything. Everything Obama has even done is political in nature and geared to bolstering his party. I cannot think of any President so keyed into party politics as he has been.

IMO Obama is disgusting.
 
Back
Top