Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

[BearBoi]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

There is no "gay gene".

It is not possible for a single gene, or even a small sequence of genes, to influence such a complex and multifaceted aspect of biology such as sexuality.

Even among the most basic of animals, such as the fruit fly (much beloved by geneticists due to the fact that it only has 4 chromosomes), they've not been able to change its sexual orientation through manipulation.

Researchers can make the fruit fly grow legs out of its mouth, put eyes on its stomach, and do all kinds of crazy thing, but influence its sexual orientation? Nope. The closest they've come is by screwing up its sensory receptors so it could not tell the difference between male and female and tried to mate with everything. That isn't the same thing by a long shot.

But if there were a single gene controlling this aspect of biology, than its counterpart would also be vulnerable. If there were a "cure" for the gay than there would be a cure for the straight. It is the hubris of these idiots to suggest that nobody would be interested. I’ve had a couple straight friends quietly mention how they envy gay guys for the ability to be done with women forever. (They were both divorced… heh) I’m sure there are more men than might admit who would take the blue pill, even if only temporarily.

In this science fiction world Ann adheres to, perhaps society would (ironically, for her) cease to view sexual orientation as anything more than a fluid gradation, which, as we all know, it really is.

Oh, Ann... you silly minx.

 

[fetaby]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

But I think the saddest part of all this is that even if what she says is true, the parents who would decide to abort a gay baby wouldn't even realize that they are the ones who created it.

 

[MoltenRock III]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Worse yet, consider the possibility of genetic engineering in the future. You'll be able to design your child to be smart, athletic or whatever traits you want them to have. Think many people will be checking the gay box as one of their choices?

Oh for fuck's sake, get real.

You and your brethren are stretching so far that you aren't arguing from just a "slippery-slope" fallacy any longer, but rather 10 miles from the bottom of Mt. Everest. Is your logic so weak and your raison d'être so challenged that such utter nonsense has become your clarion call to fellow gay men?

The "argument" that genetic testing at some future date be it 10, 15, 25, or 50 years in the future which can identify a genetic aspect of a fetus that hypothesizes on that fetus' likely sex orientation is conditioned on the following at a minimum:

1.) Governmental & medical regulations allow such genetic testing
2.) Insurance companies, the state, or parent would pay for such a test
3.) Expectant mothers will perform such a test, and want to know the outcome even though currently less than 1/3 of parents find out their child's gender before birth
4.) Gay rights / public understanding of us either regresses or doesn't progress at all
5.) Parents and society give in to a "we are only the total of our sum, individual genetics and no more / no less" in some Gattaca utopian world.
6.) Mothers would then choose to abort said baby on a % chance he/she would turn out likely to be gay.

A "slippery-slope" type argument against a speed limit increase on interstates/highways would be not wanting it to be raised to 75 MPH, because drivers would likely drive 80 MPH. Instead, you've gone to "OMG! Think of all the children being killed because soon / then people will be driving their flying car through residential streets at Mach 3!"

Sorry, ain't biting on that bait.

 

[Ram]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

The funny thing is Ann Coulter is the reason why I am for abortion.

 

[Ram]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

You either accept the premise that being gay is simply inborn or you have to accept the notion that it is a choice.

If you think it is a choice, the you similarly have to accept the downside of that including the notion that gayness can be cured.

If it is inborn, and can be reliably predicted before birth, people will certainly abort children who are gay for whatever reason. Just as they now choose to abort children with severe birth defects.

If you have supported abortion for whatever reason the mother wants it, you can't now deny here right to murder an unborn gay person because she feels like it.

Worse yet, consider the possibility of genetic engineering in the future. You'll be able to design your child to be smart, athletic or whatever traits you want them to have. Think many people will be checking the gay box as one of their choices?

I am sorry if this is rude but that kind of statement would only be made by someone is who vastly uneducated in the complexity of biology, molecular biology and DNA.

I understand the many forums produce armchair "doctors", armchair "sociologists/psychologists" and armchair "biologists", but if you think you know biology because you read something in Yahoo!news... I got news for you, you don't know biology.

 

[Ram]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

India features prominently in aborting female babies.

Sadly not many can afford the pre-screening so they wait for the females to be born and twist their necks.

 

[rareboy]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I think that it is sad that it is only because of the irrational and structural homophobia that exists today that everyone would agree that a homo fetus would automatically be aborted because it is like having Down's Syndrome or something.

I would prefer to think that if science prevailed and homo became as acceptable as straight, that parents (and I know a number already) would be just as happy to have a baby homo as a baby straight.

I can also guarantee that unless the entire third world including all the lower middle class and poor in the US suddenly get the kind of access to socialized medicine that would permit the luxury of genetic testing to determine if the baby is a vagitarian or cocksucker instead of straight.....the ubermensche eugenics scenario isn't on the horizon.

I'm glad to see though that those who understand biology and genetics are able to explain the fallacy behind the entire premise to those who immediately jumped to the conclusion that Dan Coulter and the dumbasses who believe him even remotely knew anything about this subject.

 

[Ram]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I'm glad to see though that those who understand biology and genetics are able to explain the fallacy behind the entire premise to those who immediately jumped to the conclusion that Dan Coulter and the dumbasses who believe him even remotely knew anything about this subject.

Yeah. I mean I was in school for 3 years studying that shit and it pisses me off when some guy thinks he knows bio and shit after a youtube presentation or some blog entry.

As much as I hate to sound like an education-elitist, some things need time, school, and research to understand.

 

[MoltenRock III]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I would prefer to think that if science prevailed and homo became as acceptable as straight, that parents (and I know a number already) would be just as happy to have a baby homo as a baby straight.

Agreed. With my vast number of nieces and nephews the one thing I've most heard from my siblings during their pregnancies was "as long as he/she has 10 fingers, 10 toes, (ie=healthy) that's all I care about".

I can also guarantee that unless the entire third world including all the lower middle class and poor in the US suddenly get the kind of access to socialized medicine ...

That won't be happening anytime soon. Remember "conservatives" love the fetus but hate the baby. Meaning, they love to worship the fetus but the moment it becomes a born, individual, named, baby they have no interest in helping the mother/family pay for it, care for it, educate it, or provide economic opportunities for it.

There have been more than a couple bills that had reducing the number of abortions at their core seeking to help women provide for their new babies, and/or orphanages etc... but because they "cost" money were roundly defeated by conservative politicians. Go figure.

 

[resonance]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I think Coulter actually has a very valid point here.

Personally, I don't see why as a homosexual I should support a woman's choice to abort. As a male who has 0 chance of impregnating a woman, this doesn't affect me at all. Furthermore, abortion is frequently misused in developing nations.

The argument that screening is unaffordable is not a good point. Science progresses fast and I have no doubt it will be affordable in the next few decades.

Furthermore, it does not follow that those who are pro-choice are pro-gay. This is merely the US political spectrum. In other nations, individuals could very likely be pro-choice and anti-gay.

For example, in China, the general opinion towards abortion is very positive as a means of population control; however, few would want their only male son to be homosexual. Are pro-choice homosexuals asserting that Chinese gays have less of a right to life than American?

As homosexuals, we need to think critically to ensure the interests of our kind. Pro-choice will NEVER be to our advantage. It is only an issue of the,degree it will hurt us.

 

[scrapple]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Coulter's got a point. Many, many women will choose to abort if they find there is a chance there baby will turn out to be gay. I would think that gays would be the most vociferous opponents of abortion, since we could face a kind of genocide

 

[fetaby]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Many, many women will choose to abort if they find there is a chance there baby will turn out to be gay.

We should just pre-empt the abortions and just kill the women, or was it the men who impregnated them...

 

[Swellegant]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

The Boondocks did a very funny episode on Ann Coulter:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1seThIG34R8[/ame]

But honestly, if we're supposed to oppose a woman's right to choose what to do with her body, on the outside possibility that someday there might be a mechanism that would allow homosexuality to be eradicated through eugenics... well, that's about as logical as opposing tax increases for the rich on the outside chance that I might win the lottery and become rich myself.

If there were no more gays being born (which, even if the screening were possible, which I don't believe it ever can be, since sexuality is too complex to be devolved into a single obvious marker like gender), I don't see that it would hurt me or my "kind" in any way.

I'm already here... unless you're going to try and abort me retroactively, I don't see why I should be worried. If no new homos were being born, we'd still all be here. We'd die out eventually, in that scenario, but so what? Hundreds and thousands of cultures and subcultures have been consumed by the drift of time.

 

[MoltenRock III]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Personally, I don't see why as a homosexual I should support a woman's choice to abort. As a male who has 0 chance of impregnating a woman, this doesn't affect me at all.

You said it best yourself. Since you have "0 chance" of this affecting you, you and others like you should have absolutely 0 percent say in how others live, just as they should have no say in how you live.

Additionally, it's a woman's right to do so as the law of the land. If you rally against her right to be overruled, your rights as person / gay man / etc... should be overruled as well.

 

[TheFireGod]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I'm finding it hard to believe most hardcore Fundamentalist or Evangelical Christians aborting a baby in the first place even if it was found to be gay, autistic, or will develop cancer by 40. Unless they have a double standard, in that case, they should be criticized for it.

Maybe give them up for adoption somewhere far away and never having to deal with an 'abnormality' as they would call it.

 

[fetaby]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

^ They wouldn't abort. They'd just sign the kid up for reparative therapy.

 

[resonance]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Additionally, it's a woman's right to do so as the law of the land. If you rally against her right to be overruled, your rights as person / gay man / etc... should be overruled as well.

I don't think this is a very good argument.

The next thing you know, the logic will be extended and we'll be protecting the rights of rapists and serial murderers!

The bottom line is that there are rights we should and should not have and a womans right to abort is not necessarily one that individuals should have.

(As conservatives would point out, abortion is mostly preventable. Don't have intercourse if you don't want a baby. The same cannot be said for homosexuality.)

 

[fetaby]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

The bottom line is that there are rights we should and should not have and a womans right to abort is not necessarily one that individuals should have.

Why not?

Oh that's right, I forgot. The only reason women get an abortion is because they want to lead "irresponsible" lives.

But it is still her life to live however she sees fit. Even if that includes being what you consider irresponsible.

 

[bendted]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

I'm betting she has the gay gene in her genetic profile.

 

[jackoroe]

Re: Ann Coulter: Homos should be anti-abortion

Coulter's got a point. Many, many women will choose to abort if they find there is a chance there baby will turn out to be gay. I would think that gays would be the most vociferous opponents of abortion, since we could face a kind of genocide

You've got a valid point. Right now women can abort simply because they find being pregnant to be inconvenient. No restrictions whatsoever. The Supreme Court gave them that right.

Now how do you get that genie back in the bottle once we're facing elimination of gay people as a group?