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Anyone ashamed to be gay??

Aflute04

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Woah, I had to re-read this post a couple of times to make sure I was reading correctly. Here is what I came up with... I think that within every culture, there are grounds to which a person would feel ashamed. But, even with all of the negative conotations that arise from your culture, there should be some sort of sense of pride. Like with being a homosexual, instead of focusing on the negative, why don't you focus on how brave some people are to go totally against the 'norm' (oh gosh, please don't bash me for that) to be who they are and not care what others think.

While I certainly do not agree with the sterotypes associated with gays (even if at times, they seem very relevant), I am still proud to be a homosexual. I am proud of the fact that I can be who I want to be with WHOM I want to be!

In short, I think that instead of focusing on the negative, focus on the positive so that others out there can see that we aren't all about the examples you gave.
 
Hey buddy ... I am not pissed off ; BUT I do take issue with your statements ... it appears that you are focusing on the negative of "Gay" .. which there are . BUT: there are also those very same types of folks in the str-8 world , if you just look. I know many guys who would/will rather go out and drink 'n party or buy new outfits than pay their bills ... they are indeed immature and irresponsible .
I also know guys who say they are str-8 who go out and whore themselves by having sex with a differrent girl-female two or three times a week and NO , they don't use condoms even ...
So there are negative characters in the Str-8 world and in "Gay" -"Bi" world .... it is just that the ones doing all the negative stuff are the ones who seem to get noticed .
 
Hey Boxfan,

Welcome to JUB!

Mate... its hard to respond to some of your concerns without knowing where you are, how old you are... or more the point...how you reached these conclusions.

You have made some very blanket generalizations that are basically wrong unfounded and that are both damaging to yourself and our community in general.

Sure, I'm not going to deny you that you could find examples of everything that you spoke about quite easily. But does that represent the majority of the gay community? No mate... not at all.

Its like going to a footy game and sitting in a stand of 45 000 people. And of course there are loud mouth drunks... so does that make the people in the crowd load mouth drunks?
Go to a concert and there will be drug smoking youths theres... so doesthat mean everyone there is the same?
Go to a straight strip club and you are bound to see married men there... so does that mean all married men are sleazy cheats?
Go to a casino and see the number of mothers that have left children locked in the car while they feed there poker machine addiction...does that mean all mothers are gamblers and irresponsible??

Boxfan, you can always find the bad in any situation if you choose. You will always find reasons to feel ashamed if you want to... and thats the easy way out. There will always be people in any group... that you wish weren't there. There will always be members of our society that are extravagant, dangerous, irresponsible and reckless. But they exist in every culture and every world.

Dont fall into the trap of believing everything you hear or read.

Ask yourself how many gay guys arent at clubs, are at home living normal healthy beautiful lives with partners that you never see.

If 10% of the population is gay then in the US alone theres 25 odd million gay people living their lives. Surely they cant all be slutty irresponsible drug users who are middle aged????

You yourself are an example of the huge hidden numbers of us who live our lives the way we choose to...quietly independently productively. You said that you see none of those things in you... be proud of that. Be proud of your strengths, your values, your morals.

Your an artuclate and observant guy boxfan. And I believe that the things you talk about do dismay you and make you feel ashamed. And thats ok.

But you need to ask yourself why. If its because you still have fears about yourself and how you think people will or do see you then you need to understand that you are making that burden for yourself no one else. If you think that you will be perceived as all of those things that you talk about then you're wrong. If you think that by being gay you lower your standards or level of respectability then its false.

You are you. Your values integrity and ability to care love and respect are all about you... not about being gay. You are far more than your sexual orientation and the people who love and care for you know that. They see all of you not just this part... and the people who are in your world will all feel the same way... your happiness is far more important to them than the "group" you fit into.

You have the ability to change stereotypes. You have the ability to change misconceptions and untruths. Just by being you. You help break the mould and these crazy ideas of who we supposedly are.

Dont be ashamed. And dont necessarily be proud. Be you. Be the guy that your friends and family know. Be the guy who is responsible, who wants a partner to share his life with, who is caring and loving. Show the people around you what it is to be gay and happy.

Because by doing that mate we shatter the lies that have sucked us all in at one stage or another.
 
  • I don't drink, and the most I've ever drank was a single vodka and coke.
  • I don't smoke, in fact, I've never taken a single drag.
  • I have never taken any illegal drugs.
  • I rarely take even medicine.
  • I don't buy 42'' televisions that cost £1000.
  • I don't have an Xbox 360 or a Playstation III.
  • I don't sleep around. (I've only ever slept with one person)
  • I shop at Primark - £4 a shirt, thank you very much!
  • I go to gay bars because I *can* be myself there.

I know an awful lot of straight guys who, if that was a checklist, would score 0 on that thing. I'd score full, and most gay guys I know would score pretty highly on that.
 
im ashamed of society for only focusing on a single facet of the gay community
 
Until at most a couple of months ago, when I started posting to the JUB and making tentative moves to confront my sexuality, I had very similar thoughts. In fact, looking back, there were three main reasons why, to me, being gay was such an unspeakably awful thing that I wasn't even able to *think* about my sexuality in an open way (I'm in my late 20s):

- gay people are women in men's bodies
- gay people are neurotic nut-cases
- gay people have very little in common with straight people and might as well live in a ghetto

That's stating my views very starkly, but you get the idea. I've largely abandoned those views, so the purpose of this post is to explain how and why.

Basically, for the sake of fairness and your own self-image, you need to make an effort to test your generalisations. I think they don't hold up once you actually get to know a range of gay people, on the one hand, and really think hard about the lives of straight people, on the other.

Have a careful look at the JUB. Have a look at people's photos, at the interests they say they have, at their descriptions of their love lives, at the friends they have, at the kinds of work they say they do. Don't cherry-pick when you do this. I was really surprised at the variation I found, to the extent that talking about 'general patterns' and 'exceptions' doesn't make any sense.

I don't know what kinds of gay people you know in real life. It must really depend. I didn't know any until I started posting to the JUB 3 months ago, except at best as nodding acquaintances who I would avoid. Those I have met and talked to since then (one skype friend I met on the JUB, people I met last week at a drinks evening organised by a local organisation of gay professionals and business people) certainly don't fit in with the steriotypes I had in my mind. OK, some were a bit different in a superficial sense, but if you talk to people face to face as individuals that turns out to matter very little. They were uncomplicated and friendly, they did not hit on me, they had no obvious hidden agendas, they struck me as psychologically well-anchored and decent people who tried to make me feel welcome and good about myself.

Talk to your straight friends about their problems and the problems of their friends. Read books or see serious movies made by and for straight people. I reread Anna Karenina a month ago and was amazed at what I could relate to. Once you move away from the specifics, most people, regardless of their sexuality, deal with some degree of self-esteem issues, fear of embarrassment or shame, relationship problems, or other anxieties. Some handle it well, some badly. The straight population is just as heterogeneous as the gay population.

I still think that it's probably true that you are likely to meet more effeminate, or neurotic, or alienated people in the gay population than in the population as a whole, but that doesn't mean that most gay people are like this. Also, think about the gay people you know who are narcissists or neurotics or whatever, and ask yourself if that is because they are gay, or because they have been exposed to unusual psychological and social pressures and have dealt with that in a bad way. Then think about what that says about the people who have dealt with similar stresses in a good way. I've come to have a lot of respect for people who have been through those pressures and have come out OK on the other side, because it shows that they have a lot of inner resources. I hope I will be able to count myself as one of those people. If you had asked me a couple of months ago I would have scoffed at the idea of 'gay pride', and I still dislike the term, but to the extent that this is what it refers to, there is something in it.
 
I'm not ashamed. I've already thought about what I'm going to say if someone asks me about the "gay lifestyle."

"What gay lifestyle? I'm gay, and have been for a while, but I don't know about this "gay lifestyle" you speak of."

There are plenty of gay lifestyles. Sometimes I wish the flamers didn't exist, because they set the stereotype that a lot of straight people (and I along with them) don't like.
 
i love being gay. it's really fun and the majority of people love hanging around me because us gays are pretty fun and interesting. thats just my opinion
 
I think the problem is that if you don't live in a big city, there aren't that many places to "learn" how to be gay but the bars. When I lived in LA I would see these guys from all over the country go to West Hollywood. They might have felt all alone and all of a sudden there are all these hot guys and it's a big party, and its easy to get lost in that. I also know a lot of guys have been hurt by the difficulties of growing up gay and self medicate. But you usually only see a group of gay people at a bar and that is like thinking that all straight people go to church. Today I met a couple of men that were very successful and their young, obviously adopted daughter, and they seemed no different than any other young parents. I am proud (though I had nothing to do with it ) that great art, leaders from history, and even the computer were made by gay people, and that that is a testament that we are people just like everyone else, no matter the silly stereotypes. I am proud that even the party boys who might embarrass me, still have the strength and courage to be who they are.
 
Okay, I hear you, and even thought that at one point. But let me go point by point with where I am now...

Gay bars... all you said is true. But I find the same in str8 bars. We're no different. There are always older guys in str8 bars trying to hit on the young women. Just part of the bar scene I guess.

the "whore" factor- For many gays that's true. Again that is also true for many str8s. But I tend to agree with you here. IMO it has to do with somewhat with social construct. In society, guys are the ones who want to sleep with everybody and it's the girls who put a stop to it. In the gay world, there is no girl. So it becomes more socially acceptable to sleep around. I don't like it either, and so I just don't follow suit... no matter the peer pressure.

Substance abuse-- agree that is more prevalant in the gay community. I could write a book on why that is imo. Ultimately, it comes down to facing the reality of being gay and accepting who you are. It's hard, and many escape that reality through drugs. True in both worlds, but it is harder for gays I think just by the fact of being gay and so they are more apt to drugs. It makes me feel sad about our situation more than despise it.

Fiscal responsibility-- I have to disagree with you here. I think gays tend to be more responsible with money (partly due to the lack of a wife/kids to support). Obviously we aren't hanging out with the same gays because the ones I know tend to have plenty of money and are pretty good about finances.

So yes, I agree with some of your points but I take a different look at them I guess. It doesn't make me hate the gay community, but rather gives me more compassion for them.
 
I gotta say that I'm a bit concerned with the tone this thread has taken.

In my younger years I was a clubbing, boozing, pot smoking, fashionista who slept around quite a bit. (though not as much as I wanted!). I was also an out gay man and proud of that.

At the same time I also volunteered to deliver meals to AIDS patients, worked on several political campaigns, marched in the streets for all our rights, practiced my art, saved money, was an excellent friend, and occasionally went to Church. And I was still proud of being gay.

I don't do much of the former stuff any more, though I'd kill for a joint right now:-), but I worry when when we begin equating pride with a puritanical behavior and thnking one should be ashamed to be a slut. (Who exactly is looking at all the pics on JUB? Or do you just come for the posts?)

REMEMBER: The modern gay rights movement was started by a bunch of drunk drag queens at the Stonewall Inn in 1969 while all the proper gays hid and took the oppression!

  • I don't drink, and the most I've ever drank was a single vodka and coke.
  • I don't smoke, in fact, I've never taken a single drag.
  • I have never taken any illegal drugs.
  • I rarely take even medicine.
  • I don't buy 42'' televisions that cost £1000.
  • I don't have an Xbox 360 or a Playstation III.
  • I don't sleep around. (I've only ever slept with one person)
  • I shop at Primark - £4 a shirt, thank you very much!
  • I go to gay bars because I *can* be myself there.

I know an awful lot of straight guys who, if that was a checklist, would score 0 on that thing. I'd score full, and most gay guys I know would score pretty highly on that.
 
REMEMBER: The modern gay rights movement was started by a bunch of drunk drag queens at the Stonewall Inn in 1969 while all the proper gays hid and took the oppression!

As someone who was born on the exact evening when the above event took place and only a few miles away, I would be ashamed to say that I am not proud to be gay.

:pride:

It may have taken me a while to come to accept and embrace my true self. However, there was never a point that I was ashamed of my feelings. It was just a matter of being comfortable letting others know and not giving a damn what people said and thought of me anymore.
 
As a fellow gay Coloradoan, welcome!

And yes, there are homosexuals in every single category you mention. Most? All? Forget it. And I don't consider that slutty/drug-addled gays give gays a bad name. I just do my part to give gays a good name.

Lex
 
I have been with my bf for 4 years and we don't sleep with anyone but each other.
I don't drink or do drugs.
I pay all my bills on time but my bf would go for the new pair of pants-lol.
I think it's sadder when young gay guys think they are Britney spears or Lindsay. I do see the older guys try to be younger but all men do that. I personally do not like younger guys and find them annoying-gay or straight.
There is good and bad people but you need to take them as people and not group them like say ALL gay men this,or ALL black people that,etc.
I would like to know though why all kids are wearing their pants past their butts tied tight with a belt? WTF?!
 
I'm not ashamed at what I am though there is a cultural stigma hanging around me. Also, the only reason why I would want to be straight or bi is so that I can father children!!
 
Can you actually back up those characterizations you are making about gays? Certainly that has not been my experience of people I know who are gay.

Even if what you said were true, why do you need to be bothered by (or ashamed of) other people's choices?

Presumably you fall into the 'some exceptions' category (LOL). Aren't you being a bit arrogant in thinking that you are such a minority?

Don't go to McDonalds if you are looking for a gourmet meal. Don't assume that the other patrons at McDonalds don't know the difference or go only there to eat.

Not really in context with anything: everybody dies alone.
 
Gay is a million different things, the good the bad and the not so pretty. So is straight. Just celebrate who you are and try to be the best person you can be.
 
No, being gay is who I am and I am not ashamed at all.
 
We all experience stereotypes, but it's up to us whether we want to make them generalizations despite the fact that we know better.
 
First off let me say hello from Colorado.

Please let me give a few examples.

Gay Bars- Why is it everyones trying to be something their not? My favorite example of this is middle aged men trying to appear young. Its so transparent its almost embarrasing. There is only one reason for this. Why cant they be who they really are, a middle aged man looking for a hookup with a younger guy.

The "whore" factor- Goddamn gays sleep around alot! Why is it Gay people in general (not all) cant hold a meaningfull relationship to save there lives? My best friend is approaching 50 and he will most likely die alone due to poor decisions(his words) in his past. He is a sad deppressed man.
Substance abuse- It is so widespread in the community I personally believe this is an epidemic amongst gays.

Irresponsible- This one really gets to me. Given the choice of paying the light bill or buying a new pair of pants to go to the bar in most would choose the pants. Shamefull. Not many gays out there are in a position to even support themselves.
These are just a few reasons(i have many) I am ashamed to be gay even though few if any are who I am. But straight people have this image in there eyes that this is how gay people are, unfortunatley they are correct for the most part. I have no doubt there are exceptions but as a whole-nope.

Again, this is not a bash thread.


GAY Bars: All the hook up places around the globe are the same, when it comes to the meat marketing strategies. Why do str8 dudes flash $100K wrist watches, wear those very funny touppees and are deep in debt for that big red sports car outside... Because, no matter, who, where and when, the meat market strategies are always the same. And they work... Yeah, it is all very transparent, but if you want to fuck with a middle aged dude, who might make it worthwhile your time and energy, there you go. If you don't, you just move on. People of both sexes and of all sexual orientations have been doing precisely the same, for thousands of years. I am as ashamed of it as the rest of the society is...

The WHORING Around factor: We whore around, because we can. For that very same reason, the dog licks his balls: he can. Until the advent of Judaism, male sexuality freely permeated whole human society. Men whored around for millions of years and there is very little doubt about the fact that we have been mostly hard-wired by the evolution to do so. If you wish to uncritically subscribe to the Judeo-christian doctrine of shame that ought to be associated with human sexuality, do so. Many a shrink and most of us with stock in psycho-pharmaceutical companies will thank you for every dollar, we are making on your beliefs that will frustrate you and drive you nuts, so that we can drive our Bentleys and indulge in every luxury there is... You are ashamed, so you pay...

Irresponsible: I sure do not think so... If you start studying the power of the pink pound and pink dollar, you'll see that most gay dudes own significantly more than str8 dudes with equal stations in life. GM's Jaguar has not been spending millions of $$$ to attract the gay dudes simply because they really like us... We can pay and we do pay. Poor Bible reading devils can't afford them, so they don't... Yeah, some dudes are just plain, ole stupid. The gay population is a whole is not. Au contraire... We are wealthy and proud.

SC
 
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