Chaotic on and off relationship

[sixthson]

I'm afraid neither of you knows what love is. I hope you find the real thing some day. This is not it. If you have this kind of relationship early on, don't expect it to improve. I know you want someone to encourage you to pursue him, but that is not what you really need.

 

[Disturbance]

Even if you love each other, I think you should be both adults enough to face the fact that love in itself is pretty often not enough to make a relationship work.

 

[eastofeden]

But the thing I can't handle is being on the back burner while he "tries it out" with someone new. As much as I would like the future to be better with us, putting me in fucking time-out is torture. I don't ever text him first lately, he always contacts me first, and I don't get why he is contacting me if he's got a new bf, because we always end up fucking, kissing, cuddling. I think not replying for a while will make him wonder what's going on and maybe he just needs to lose me again in order to put things in perspective. Or I just need to quit.

He is training you to be emotionally, psychologically and physically addicted to and dependent on him. I can tell you one thing...he wouldn't bother unless he can see you are already pre-disposed to such a relationship so basically you are in the process of being owned.

There are all kinds of dominant and submissive relationships that don't involve mental or emotional or physical abuse.

Choose wisely!

 

[brokegayguy]

I appreciate all the responses. For everyone saying "walk" and "quit", I hear you. It's just kinda hard to do when two people say they love each other and one person says "wait and be friends and we'll get there after".

You are never going to "get there."

Ever.

 

[james88]

I hope you're able to read this and see how dramatic and unnecessary it all is.
He can tell you anything he wants. He loves this guy? Does the other guy know about you? Does he lie to this other guy about who he's with and what he's doing? Does the other guy think they are in an exclusive dating scenario?

And if this man you love can lie to someone he "loves" what makes you think he wouldn't lie to you?

Yeah, the other guy knows about me and is pretty suspicious. And yes, he lies to the other guy when he's with me. And yes, the other guy thinks they're in an exclusive dating scenario. It's fucked up, I know. And that's a very good point about if he can lie to one person, why not to me. The thing I really don't get, though, is if he doesn't love me or want me, then why does he keep texting me and keep me around.

Disturbance, I think you make a really good point too. Maybe that's it. I took too long, so that's my fault, but he's also being too childish and mind-fuck-y to make it work.

 

[james88]

He is training you to be emotionally, psychologically and physically addicted to and dependent on him. I can tell you one thing...he wouldn't bother unless he can see you are already pre-disposed to such a relationship so basically you are in the process of being owned.

There are all kinds of dominant and submissive relationships that don't involve mental or emotional or physical abuse.

Choose wisely!

I agree with this very much. I had a feeling that's what he's doing, as that is what a power-obsessed person would do. Although, he's admitted to being "addicted" to me too - which is awesome - literally addicted to me and addicted to my ass. The kind of sex that is bound by a very chemical attraction. As for being in the process of being "owned" - I wouldn't MIND being owned by him, if it was actually normal, mutual 'ownership', like an actual relationship - but he's only trying to own me psychologically. Probably as revenge for how I unintentionally did that to him in the spring when I was holding him at a distance. But this feels like unfair punishment.

brokegayguy - I could have gotten "there" if I would have said yes to him back in the spring.

 

[LuckysRevenge]

Yeah, the other guy knows about me and is pretty suspicious. And yes, he lies to the other guy when he's with me. And yes, the other guy thinks they're in an exclusive dating scenario. It's fucked up, I know. And that's a very good point about if he can lie to one person, why not to me. The thing I really don't get, though, is if he doesn't love me or want me, then why does he keep texting me and keep me around.

Disturbance, I think you make a really good point too. Maybe that's it. I took too long, so that's my fault, but he's also being too childish and mind-fuck-y to make it work.

He keeps you around because you put up with it and you're a good fuck. Plus you're easy and available.

It's up to you whether you want to be a doormat. Personally I'm not one to judge. If it's what you want, keep doing what you are doing. But in my opinion, you seem like a guy who deserves more.

 

[eastofeden]

I agree with this very much. I had a feeling that's what he's doing, as that is what a power-obsessed person would do. Although, he's admitted to being "addicted" to me too - which is awesome - literally addicted to me and addicted to my ass. The kind of sex that is bound by a very chemical attraction. As for being in the process of being "owned" - I wouldn't MIND being owned by him, if it was actually normal, mutual 'ownership', like an actual relationship - but he's only trying to own me psychologically. Probably as revenge for how I unintentionally did that to him in the spring when I was holding him at a distance. But this feels like unfair punishment.

.

After the punishment...you get a "reward"... until he possesses you...and he will not stop with you because once he owns you he will need to repeat the process with someone else...I know you don't want to hear that but it is true. If he does his job good enough...it will even be YOU who finds the guys for him.

This is how pimps find their whores...exact same circumstances....

Being "owned" can happen without all of that control...so let me ask...is his control intoxicating for you?...or is the idea of someone controlling you that much intoxicating?

 

[brokegayguy]

brokegayguy - I could have gotten "there" if I would have said yes to him back in the spring.

Key word being "could." But that ship has sailed now. Why would you even want to stick around him? He's already got a history of being physically and emotionally abusive, and he's basically sleeping around between you and this other guy, so you know he's not going to be loyal to you.

Next time he texts you or something, repeat after me: "You know what, I've had enough. I refuse to let you keep stringing me along, I'm sick of it. Don't talk to me ever again. Goodbye." Then block him out of your phone and your life.

 

[james88]

He keeps you around because you put up with it and you're a good fuck. Plus you're easy and available.

It's up to you whether you want to be a doormat. Personally I'm not one to judge. If it's what you want, keep doing what you are doing. But in my opinion, you seem like a guy who deserves more.

Obviously I don't want to be a doormat, I want things to chill out and take on a different stride. So I need to quit being available then. But I hope it's not true that he only keeps me around because I'm a "good fuck" and I'm "easy and available". I think there is an emotional reason as well, hence all the kissing and cuddling and mutual admissions of love. If he just wanted someone to fuck, I imagine he would do it with some random guy who he wouldn't feel emotionally conflicted about, and who wouldn't know about his current bf. Like, he could "just fuck" anyone - why an ex-lover?

After the punishment...you get a "reward"... until he possesses you...and he will not stop with you because once he owns you he will need to repeat the process with someone else...I know you don't want to hear that but it is true. If he does his job good enough...it will even be YOU who finds the guys for him.

This is how pimps find their whores...exact same circumstances....

Being "owned" can happen without all of that control...so let me ask...is his control intoxicating for you?...or is the idea of someone controlling you that much intoxicating?

This is kind of freaking me out. But yes, the idea of being his is definitely a turn on now. We've always had that going on a little bit, except now it's like I'm not his main thing. The idea of someone controlling me is kind of a turn on, like I like the idea of having to be "good" for someone and behave, but I guess I'm doing that for him without him even treating me right, whereas to him I'm doing it because I know I'm being punished for pushing him away at first. But anyways, if he were to possess me, I have to admit I think there is also a kind of control and power that the sub partner has... you know? Like, I had control/power over him when he had to work for me. So even if he is to possess me again (like if we got in an actual relationship), no matter what I'd have to always deny him a little bit to get respect, which just sounds like a vicious cycle of power.

brokegayguy - thanks for your advice... I'll consider that. I wanna be a little more subtle.

 

[KaraBulut]

(Bankside, what's INTJ?)

Myers-Briggs Type Indicator

 

[bruce379]

Obviously I don't want to be a doormat, I want things to chill out and take on a different stride. So I need to quit being available then. But I hope it's not true that he only keeps me around because I'm a "good fuck" and I'm "easy and available". I think there is an emotional reason as well, hence all the kissing and cuddling and mutual admissions of love. If he just wanted someone to fuck, I imagine he would do it with some random guy who he wouldn't feel emotionally conflicted about, and who wouldn't know about his current bf. Like, he could "just fuck" anyone - why an ex-lover?



This is kind of freaking me out. But yes, the idea of being his is definitely a turn on now. We've always had that going on a little bit, except now it's like I'm not his main thing. The idea of someone controlling me is kind of a turn on, like I like the idea of having to be "good" for someone and behave, but I guess I'm doing that for him without him even treating me right, whereas to him I'm doing it because I know I'm being punished for pushing him away at first. But anyways, if he were to possess me, I have to admit I think there is also a kind of control and power that the sub partner has... you know? Like, I had control/power over him when he had to work for me. So even if he is to possess me again (like if we got in an actual relationship), no matter what I'd have to always deny him a little bit to get respect, which just sounds like a vicious cycle of power.

brokegayguy - thanks for your advice... I'll consider that. I wanna be a little more subtle.

This is the reason I'm never into BDSM. It get's too fucked up. Too many mind games.

Obviously for both of you, you both find the sex incredible. The emotional attachment makes it higher and your fucked up mind games increases it much more. Both of you are basically like drug addicts. You both get a high from the sex, the emotional tension and the whatever you guys are into this master-slave dom-sub dynamic. It's a downward spiral now, ladies and gentlemen.

I know it's hard to quit especially if the sex is that good, and the sex is orders of magnitude better than others because of this chemistry, believe it or not, that you have developed over time and is quite intense. But this is analogous to addiction. Do you understand what I'm saying? So extrapolate the downward spiral of your analogous situation.

Bottomline: you need to quit for your own well-being. The more moving parts there are, the more you are liable to get hurt.

 

[james88]

This is the reason I'm never into BDSM. It get's too fucked up. Too many mind games.

Obviously for both of you, you both find the sex incredible. The emotional attachment makes it higher and your fucked up mind games increases it much more. Both of you are basically like drug addicts. You both get a high from the sex, the emotional tension and the whatever you guys are into this master-slave dom-sub dynamic. It's a downward spiral now, ladies and gentlemen.

I know it's hard to quit especially if the sex is that good, and the sex is orders of magnitude better than others because of this chemistry, believe it or not, that you have developed over time and is quite intense. But this is analogous to addiction. Do you understand what I'm saying? So extrapolate the downward spiral of your analogous situation.

Bottomline: you need to quit for your own well-being. The more moving parts there are, the more you are liable to get hurt.

You totally get it. And yes, we both find the sex incredible. I find it incredible to surrender to him, and he loves to "take" me... I'm not normally a bottom and he said he loves the way that I act like it sort of hurts or how it's like I'm surrendering but am not totally okay with it. And I love feeling dominated by him, feeling all of his power in me.

But what I'm trying to do, gradually - and I think this scares him when it's HIS call - like when I admitted I had feelings for him too - is to stop all the sick mindgame power stuff and just kind of both collapse to each other. To give in to each other. But this isn't happening, at least not at the moment, because he knows he has the upper hand right now. But what I don't get is why we can't shift all of this intensity (sexual, emotional, power oriented) into a somewhat-normal relationship. Like, if I would be "obedient" to him as a bf, and he would agree to play nice, then we would be fine - because when we're not having kinky sex, or fucking with each other's heads, we actually get along pretty well and do normal things and have tons of verbal chemistry. All the darker, sexual stuff I'm talking about is underneath - on the surface, we look like that couple that gets under each others skin. When we would go out to bars together, for example, people were fascinated by us and our back-and-forth banter, saying we act like a married couple - picking up on every little thing, all that stuff.

 

[bruce379]

You totally get it. And yes, we both find the sex incredible. I find it incredible to surrender to him, and he loves to "take" me... I'm not normally a bottom and he said he loves the way that I act like it sort of hurts or how it's like I'm surrendering but am not totally okay with it. And I love feeling dominated by him, feeling all of his power in me.

But what I'm trying to do, gradually - and I think this scares him when it's HIS call - like when I admitted I had feelings for him too - is to stop all the sick mindgame power stuff and just kind of both collapse to each other. To give in to each other. But this isn't happening, at least not at the moment, because he knows he has the upper hand right now. But what I don't get is why we can't shift all of this intensity (sexual, emotional, power oriented) into a somewhat-normal relationship. Like, if I would be "obedient" to him as a bf, and he would agree to play nice, then we would be fine - because when we're not having kinky sex, or fucking with each other's heads, we actually get along pretty well and do normal things and have tons of verbal chemistry. All the darker, sexual stuff I'm talking about is underneath - on the surface, we look like that couple that gets under each others skin. When we would go out to bars together, for example, people were fascinated by us and our back-and-forth banter, saying we act like a married couple - picking up on every little thing, all that stuff.

I'm jealous of the sex It reminds me of the the live threesome at the sex party I was watching last night.

Then, communicate it to him. "I don't want this BDSM stuff anymore. Let's stop the mind games and dom-sub routine. Let's just keep the fuck-each-others-brains-out-out-of-this-world-sex we are having. Can you do that? Hey, were not done. Harder hahaha"

 

[james88]

I'm jealous of the sex It reminds me of the the live threesome at the sex party I was watching last night.

Then, communicate it to him. "I don't want this BDSM stuff anymore. Let's stop the mind games and dom-sub routine. Let's just keep the fuck-each-others-brains-out-out-of-this-world-sex we are having. Can you do that? Hey, were not done. Harder hahaha"

Hmm, that's a good idea. I've tried to tell him before that we need to cut out the mindgames, the power struggle, and the skepticism... and we worked on it, but it still came up in the sex a little bit. But maybe it's true - maybe that kind of sex is contributing to the other dynamics. The thing is, I *do* want the bdsm shit during the sex, but it crosses over out of bed too much! So maybe it has to go. I like that idea - and keeping the just generally good fucking. But I'd want it to be infused with commitment and us taking each other seriously - and that's the part he's telling me to "wait" for. But I know he knows we deserve that chance because I've called him out on it very clearly before and he hasn't denied it. So, here is what I'll do: back off in general, no sex for a while. If we do have sex again, it'll have to be when he's single. And then make the sex less bdsm oriented, to try and have a generally healthier dynamic, then consider a relationship. Anyways, this is all assuming that my backing off will even have an effect on him. He texted me today, and I didn't reply at all, so I'll have to see if he starts to feel bad about it.

 

[bruce379]

I'd be civil with him. Not totally ignore him. That's more cruel than saying you broke up with him in his face. You can say hi and reply to his messages just make it clear to him you want to minimize any sexual contact while he's still preoccupied with someone else. You understand that this is harder than just ignoring him. And communicate to him that if you do hook up again BOTH of you need to cut out the bdsm in order to normalize the relationship to something more conventional.

 

[Seasoned]

Now it's a game to see you can back off the most? You are in an addictive relationship and you have the power to stay or not. Keeping away for a time is not the answer because you're both likely to end up in the same place once back together. You may need a 12-step program to break out of this cycle. Best wishes.

 

[KaraBulut]

So, here is what I'll do: back off in general, no sex for a while. If we do have sex again, it'll have to be when he's single. And then make the sex less bdsm oriented, to try and have a generally healthier dynamic, then consider a relationship. Anyways, this is all assuming that my backing off will even have an effect on him. He texted me today, and I didn't reply at all, so I'll have to see if he starts to feel bad about it.

The solution to the mindgames in your relationship is not going to be another mindgame.

There's something innately unhealthy about the behavior- for both you and the other guy.

It's really going to be up to you to break the cycle. And it's something that you may need to seek professional help to do so.

 

[bruce379]

The solution to the mindgames in your relationship is not going to be another mindgame.

There's something innately unhealthy about the behavior- for both you and the other guy.

It's really going to be up to you to break the cycle. And it's something that you may need to seek professional help to do so.

^^^word. like what he said. break the cycle by not initiating another mind-game that will escalate the second time around. that's what's fucking up your relationship right there, and the bad thing is, you're BOTH addicted to it. in my opinion, that's the only thing that's gumming up the works that prevent you from having a meaningful relationship with him. of course, you'd still have to wait out your penalty box period with the other guy in his life, but i think there's a good chance that he'd come around once he realizes you aren't playing his game anymore and no more escalation is going on. tell us how it went.

take a break.

good luck.

 

[maxpowr9]

james, there is nothing complex about the situation. sixthson is right.


(and if it matters, i'm an INTJ)

Yep, as a fellow INTJ, he's a "bad INTJ" aka a sociopath. There will be no love from him EVER! He will delude you into into thinking you love him but the reality is, he only knows how to emotionally manipulate people to get what he wants. When he gets bored with a person, he will move onto another. If you want to associate with a sociopath, you do so at your own choosing but the sympathy train will end.