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Crazy L.A. Bans Plastic Grocery Bags and Imposes a 10 Cent Charge on Paper

Jack Springer said:
Sorry, if you can't restrain yourselves in proper use and disposing of trash bags and you need the government to tell you what you can and can't do on a very simple matter.

Maybe your local government can come up with more ways to interact within you personal life.
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Yup, here's the paranoid right wing whining about how "the government is pushing us around" and telling us what to do.

We should be able to do whatever we want! Fuck those speed limits. I want to drive 100mph through town and not wear a seat belt. If I want to murder someone when who is the government telling me I can't? Let me and my factory pollute all I want. If I want to dump toxic chemicals in the water I will. Putting a filter on those smokestacks belching out fumes is only hurting profits and destroying jobs. Regulations kill jobs.

But I'm gonna tell women what to do with their bodies. It's to protect babies. And teach only creationism in schools, if there are any schools left.

Springer, this is an EPIC FAIL of a thread but that's nothing new for you.
 
It's a matter of economics: the damage to the environment is a legitimate cost that has to be considered. A more proper approach would be to tax the producer, but since the producer most likely lies outside the jurisdiction of Los Angeles, they have to make do.

Ideally, given the damage all petroleum products do to the environment, there should be an extra tax on oil to cover them.
 
Love this

the JUBBERclubbers are saying "why is this an issue" or "let them use re-useable bags"

LOL

Let's face it - environmental re-useable bags are a great thing but you're more likely to see them used by limousine liberals not lower middle class and poor people - right? can we agree on that?

so this is a poor person's tax - right ?? can we agree on that?

so why are we doing this again?

George Clooney's shopping lady can afford (his money) to do this when she's shopping for HIS groceries

but not when she's shopping for HER family with HER money

stupid is as stupid does
 
chance1 said:
Let's face it - environmental re-useable bags are a great thing but you're more likely to see them used by limousine liberals not lower middle class and poor people - right? can we agree on that?
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I have to ask if you even GO to supermarkets or have BEEN to a supermarket in the last 5 years. Reusable bags are already in common use just about everywhere and guess who is using them?
 
LuvFindsAndyHardy said:
I have to ask if you even GO to supermarkets or have BEEN to a supermarket in the last 5 years. Reusable bags are already in common use just about everywhere and guess who is using them?
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I do actually

stop n shop (my fav) and key foods (closer)

i have the stop n shop ones but not the key foods ones

and yes people do use them

but no it's not everyone

and i'm real comfortable based on my shopping experience and general know how with the idea that this is a "poor person's tax"

and will impact the less well off the worst
 
Rolyo85 said:
Yeah, People in Indiana are using reusable bags all over the place.
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good for indiana - go hoosiers ;)

people are using them - that's not the issue

the issue is having to pay for non re-useable bags

sounds like extra profit for the greedy supermarkets ;)
 
Kulindahr said:
It's a matter of economics: the damage to the environment is a legitimate cost that has to be considered. A more proper approach would be to tax the producer, but since the producer most likely lies outside the jurisdiction of Los Angeles, they have to make do.

Ideally, given the damage all petroleum products do to the environment, there should be an extra tax on oil to cover them.
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It's really hard to believe that you were ever a libertarian.
 
Jack Springer said:
It's really hard to believe that you were ever a libertarian.
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Funny you can't recognize a libertarian argument right in front of you. What you're after is propertarian, which as you do exalts property over liberty. Libertarianism believes in responsibility, and manufacturing items which result in environmental damage is not responsible. The propertarian, OTOH, doesn't give a rip if his products drift about and kill things or harm other people, and will fight to make the law serve him and to hell with anyone else.

The House Republicans are for the most part propertarians. But in the end they favor a tyranny as dangerous as that of any government: tyranny of the corporation. It was no accident that the libertarians who threw the original Tea Party targeted the cargo of a ship belonging to probably the world's largest corporation of the time.
 
GiancarloC said:
Sorry you don't care about the environment and the fact that many of those bags end up in the ocean... even if they are disposed of properly. Typical republican talking points. You take an obvious non-issue and attempt to make it into an issue so you gain some political points, but at the same insult poor people.
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if insulting them helps them buy MORE groceries for their money instead of paying for bags that should be free .......

then it's a good thing

love the liberal POV here - limousine liberalism on display for all to see

LOL
 
Californians as a general rule recycle many items that would otherwise go to landfills. This is the next step, even though it is slower than other countries. Many in my neighborhood were already bringing their own reusable bags. What's the big deal? It will save on costs for the store. It takes very little effort to bring your own reusable bags. It takes a long time for the plastic bag to decompose and many end up on the beaches and in the ocean. Recycling is mandated in California but many people have been doing it for years.
 
GiancarloC said:
Typical republican talking points. You take an obvious non-issue and attempt to make it into an issue so you gain some political points, but at the same insult poor people.
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Indeed. It's funny that the same people who are up in arms about the poor "poor people" having to spend $10 for 10 reusable grocery bags seem to be the same people saying "what's the problem" in requiring people to spend a $100 or more to exercise their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to vote. Seems a little skewed.
 
prudyprudestein said:
Californians as a general rule recycle many items that would otherwise go to landfills. This is the next step, even though it is slower than other countries. Many in my neighborhood were already bringing their own reusable bags. What's the big deal? It will save on costs for the store. It takes very little effort to bring your own reusable bags. It takes a long time for the plastic bag to decompose and many end up on the beaches and in the ocean. Recycling is mandated in California but many people have been doing it for years.
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Thanks for making the point.

It is a personal responsibility to reuse or recycle the garbage bags. If we legislate things like this -- what is next? -- bring your own glass or cup to the drive-thru?

Personal and corporate responsibility is the answer -- not government interference.

Look what Walmart has done in regards to removing extra packaging in their stores. They gave there vendors an ultimatium -- reduce product packaging by a certain percentage or else they would look for other vendors. Walmart may have done it for selfish reasons -- reducing their garbage costs and employee time spent prepping product for the shelf, and more shelf space for more produc.

Hate Walmart all you want - but they have done more for reducing the the garbage in landfills than anyone else. BTW ... when was the last time you saw on story in the MSM about this? My guess never.
 
LuvFindsAndyHardy said:
Indeed. It's funny that the same people who are up in arms about the poor "poor people" having to spend $10 for 10 reusable grocery bags seem to be the same people saying "what's the problem" in requiring people to spend a $100 or more to exercise their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to vote. Seems a little skewed.
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No one spends $100 to be able to vote .... where's your proof?
 
I live in Los Angeles and so happy that this is happening!!

I have been using Reuseable Bags for years! The markets that I shop at will also give you a 'bag discount' when you bring your own!
 
What a pile of crap about it being unfair to poor people.

I grew up poor. We used re-usable bags that were made from cotton sugar sacking. We have a neighbour on a very fixed income. She has used re-usable bags she made herself for years.

The 'poor people tax' argument is bullshit. What you should be promoting for the poor is an end to unnecessary over-packaging and wasteful bagging that they are paying for every time they go to the store.

But Springer et al. You have no problem with the poor paying high prices for low nutrition processed foods in a supermarket in order to puff up Nestle Corps bottom line, but encouraging a system that would result in lower landfill costs for all taxpayers is anathema.

You guys just slay me with your Faux 'compassion'.
 
This is one of the reasons why I'm glad I moved out of the city and into the burbs. I used those plastic bags for my dog's shit. Now I can just take my dog about 50 feet behind the condo and he can shit in the woods. No more baggies!
 
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