Do unto others as you would have them do unto you [SPLIT]

[Kulindahr]

^ But it's not in the Bible.

Actually it is: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you", and "Regard others as more important than yourselves".

Everyone would prefer that others don't do things that could be harmful -- the only issue is that they may be too obtuse to admit that wearing a mask reduces risk to others. But even if the Golden Rule isn't enough, the second stricture has to be: if others are more important than yourself, and others think that you wearing a mask keeps them safer, then you wear a mask.

 

[belamyi]

Re: 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

Actually it is: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you", and "Regard others as more important than yourselves".

Everyone would prefer that others don't do things that could be harmful -- the only issue is that they may be too obtuse to admit that wearing a mask reduces risk to others. But even if the Golden Rule isn't enough, the second stricture has to be: if others are more important than yourself, and others think that you wearing a mask keeps them safer, then you wear a mask.

Ok, "they are not: masks are not in the Bible" You have all those stupid rules about fish, shrimp, pork, not sharing the seat with Felix Fox and what not, yet...

I've always wondered how that tenet fares in regard to masochists: it is flawed basically because it relies on the feelings and ultimate subjectivity of others or, even messier, of a supposed majority (what majority? is the will and whim of "the majority" always the best drive for a general and moral rule?).

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

Ok, "they are not: masks are not in the Bible" You have all those stupid rules about fish, shrimp, pork, not sharing the seat with Felix Fox and what not, yet...

Ah -- I see the confusion: you're addressing what were rules for living in a theocracy where those rules were meant to make it clear that the people were "set apart" from other nations as though they were ever supposed to be universal. As the prophets make clear, the people were supposed to figure out that what the rules were really about was to love God through loving one another and were supposed to draw the principles from the rules -- and the principles are to be universal.

I've always wondered how that tenet fares in regard to masochists: it is flawed basically because it relies on the feelings and ultimate subjectivity of others or, even messier, of a supposed majority (what majority? is the will and whim of "the majority" always the best drive for a general and moral rule?).

Ah, but it doesn't say "Do unto others that which you would have them do to you", it says "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" -- it's not about "what" but about "how". It thus involves some work: the masochist doesn't treat others as though they enjoy pain, he finds out what it is that they enjoy and do that. It's easy to miss this in a culture where it is assumed that everyone desires the same treatment, but that assumption has never been true in the first place. This was actually recognized by first century B.C. and first century A.D. rabbis, so when Jesus said it it was nothing new.

A simple example is one I heard made by a Four Square (Pentecostal) Church pastor: if what comforts you is hugs, that doesn't mean you hug someone who needs comfort, it means you find out what comforts them and do that -- and if hugs actually creep you out but someone needing comfort gets comfort from hugs, you give hugs. That's a very simple illustration, but it shows the intent of the rule, that we are to learn to step outside our comfort zones and "into the shoes" of others, making their needs more important than our own, that we are to stop seeing the world merely through our own eyes but learn to see it through the eyes of others.

 

[belamyi]

Re: 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

Ah -- I see the confusion: you're addressing what were rules for living in a theocracy where those rules were meant to make it clear that the people were "set apart" from other nations as though they were ever supposed to be universal. As the prophets make clear, the people were supposed to figure out that what the rules were really about was to love God through loving one another and were supposed to draw the principles from the rules -- and the principles are to be universal.

Ah, the confusion! You are talking about the sequel's interpretation of the prequel, not about the sense of the original Old Episode.


See, it's like with...

 

[belamyi]

Re: 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)

Ah, but it doesn't say "Do unto others that which you would have them do to you", it says "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you".

Which is exactly the point of a maso dreaming to having someone pleasure them... so?

It's easy to miss this in a culture where it is assumed that everyone desires the same treatment, but that assumption has never been true in the first place. This was actually recognized by first century B.C. and first century A.D. rabbis, so when Jesus said it it was nothing new.

A maso cares about WHAT pleasure he receives, no matter how and, of course, no matter what or how the others may feel about it, as long as the pleasure is received.
You almost read as if you were mixing up masos and sados.

It's easy to miss this in a culture where it is assumed that everyone desires the same treatment, but that assumption has never been true in the first place.

Which is closer to my point, it being that there can not be any common point in some ideal moral desire, just like there is no common point in any taste, desire or will for anything else: nobody, and certainly no group of nobodies is alike to the others... that's the glory of diversity. Actually, that rule at the start of this... discussion derives from an era in which everybody was supposed to be or follow some "natural" common rule, something that even today in the age of (supposedly) diversity, is still followed and, therefore, in frontal contradiction with that newer promotion of diversity... which turns out to be, is reduced to mere frills on actual uniformity and, ultimately, on old same morals.

 

[LarsVenice]

The "Golden Rule" is very flawed. It should instead say "Treat others as they want to be treated - not as you yourself want to be treated." But this is NOT what it says.

 

[Kulindahr]

Re: 2019 Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2)


Ah, the confusion! You are talking about the sequel's interpretation of the prequel, not about the sense of the original Old Episode.


See, it's like with...

You're calling half the Old Testament a "sequel"? That's an interesting way of looking at it.

 

[Kulindahr]

The "Golden Rule" is very flawed. It should instead say "Treat others as they want to be treated - not as you yourself want to be treated." But this is NOT what it says.

No, the deterioration of the English language is what is flawed: "as" doesn't mean the same thing as "like" even though people use them that way. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" means just what you wrote, or at least it did for centuries.

 

[aethelreddansforth]

I think it just generally means "treat others well". Most like to be treated well, so it stands as a practical principle.

 

[Kulindahr]

 

[FrodoTX]

The secret to a happy and fulfilling life.... Don't be a Dick