Explosions, shootings reported in central Paris

[NotHardUp1]

@NotHardUp1, I think perhaps we are saying the same thing, we must find a way to water down their faith, lure them in to main street society with riches and wealth and alienate them from their family and friends.

Many have walked away from fundamentalism of all faiths when tempted in the proper fashion. Another term for this might be assimilation with others outside of their faith, the burden for that lies with us to befriend these young men and not to reject and hate them.

Perhaps we are. I would argue that the best route to killing enmity in any group is to extend the respect to them that creates the credible pluralism that blunts the notion that violence is the only recourse. We do not have to admire or falsely praise religious beliefs we dislike, but is it so hard to respect the person?

I have little admiration for Mormonism, yet I have no problem extending respect to Mormons. The two are different.

 

[rareboy]

We can go back to who fucked someone's goat without their permission. I suppose then by what you point to with the US support of Israel we should hold Germany responsible in as much as Israel became a nation (again) as a result of Nazi Germany's driving them out or killing the Jews.

I would submit that we can find an excuse for all actions. I didn't get a tricycle when I was 3 years old, therefore I can take out this deprivation on the rest of innocent humanity.

People in a theater or in a sidewalk café become the target of maniac Islamic fundamentalist killers because ______________ . (fill in the blank)

Humanity needs to hold those who kill innocent people responsible, not issue a pass because life has been unfair.
There is no doubt that activities by the USA and other nations were not proper, this gives no excuse to murder in God's name.

Once again...you've leapt to the conclusion that the co-relation between US and its support for Israel is trying to excuse terrorism.
It is not. It is an attempt to remind people what led to the rise of terrorism as an outlet for middle east anger.

And by the way, the founding of the Jewish state and problems in the middle east precedes WWII.

As I wrote earlier, we are, in fact, fighting a 3500 year old tribal war from which there is no escape. Seriously. There is none as long as the Abrahamic sects, including Christians, remain fixated on the Old Testament (and Revelations) and we keep ourselves enslaved to Middle Eastern oil.

 

[NotHardUp1]

I am not of the opinion that there will ever be a peaceful solution to the founding of modern Israel.

The alliance of the West with Israel is most certainly a huge factor in fueling the fires of conflict there, as it always gives Muslims the correct impression that it is not a fair fight. If the Israelis were left on their own to negotiate with their neighbors, they would be forced into at the very least reasonable concessions.

As it is, Israel continues to oppress her captive non-Jewish residents, take more land, and play the victim. And the West hypes the threat of Iranian potential nuclear weapons while remaining silent to Israel's "illegal" possession of her own stockpile. Ignoring that Iran may feel defenseless against Israeli nukes is the norm in Western media and governments. It is a conspiracy of silence.

 

[Telstra]

Sort of off topic but relevant.

Do you guys still remember when you were young (same age as the terrorists)?
I do and religion was a great motivator for the young and the aimless.
So I think religion is useless and harmful and should be controlled.

 

[kallipolis]

Sort of off topic but relevant.

Do you guys still remember when you were young (same age as the terrorists)?
I do and religion was a great motivator for the young and the aimless.
So I think religion is useless and harmful and should be controlled.

That's been tried...without, success...as the raging wars throughout the Middle East evidences, tragically.

 

[Telstra]

That's been tried...without, success...as the raging wars throughout the Middle East evidences, tragically.

I'm optimistic.
China control religion successfully

 

[kallipolis]

China can tell the world that it is a successful super power! The reality is that China's asymmetrical growth and development suggests that this is a real myth. There is huge resentment, not just with the Muslim Uighurs but other rural populations where land grabs arecommon place and a few well connected (with the Communist Party) tycoons end up owning expensive real estate. China is so fragile that the regime monitors every speech,writing,personal preferences,dissent etc. A mature and secure nation would not show so much anxiety....and the Buddhists of Tibet have never been a "terrorist threat" to China's overlordship.

 

[Telstra]

China can tell the world that it is a successful super power! The reality is that China's asymmetrical growth and development suggests that this is a real myth. There is huge resentment, not just with the Muslim Uighurs but other rural populations where land grabs arecommon place and a few well connected (with the Communist Party) tycoons end up owning expensive real estate. China is so fragile that the regime monitors every speech,writing,personal preferences,dissent etc. A mature and secure nation would not show so much anxiety....and the Buddhists of Tibet have never been a "terrorist threat" to China's overlordship.

foreigners living in China have a different views to yours.
Your pessimistic views are from the media and you don't live there.

Example:
serpentza youtuber living in china have a different view.

 

[zoltanspawn]

Example:
serpentza youtuber living in china have a different view.

I looked at his channel, but couldn't find anything about Chinese control of religion. Where?

 

[Telstra]

I looked at his channel, but couldn't find anything about Chinese control of religion. Where?

umm i didn't say he talked about "chinese control of religion" i did.
He has a positive view about China in general.

 

[zoltanspawn]

I guess I'm asking for an example not simply that China is nice or whatever, but that said character is related to its notable repression of freedom of religion.

 

[sixthson]

I'm optimistic.
China control religion successfully

And yet the largest underground Christian church in the world is in China.

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

China can tell the world that it is a successful super power! The reality is that China's asymmetrical growth and development suggests that this is a real myth. There is huge resentment, not just with the Muslim Uighurs but other rural populations where land grabs arecommon place and a few well connected (with the Communist Party) tycoons end up owning expensive real estate. China is so fragile that the regime monitors every speech,writing,personal preferences,dissent etc. A mature and secure nation would not show so much anxiety....and the Buddhists of Tibet have never been a "terrorist threat" to China's overlordship.

long list a "mature" <haaaaaaaaaaaaa nations<haaaaaaaaa wots
* long way gooooooo or short way but worlds cream a moron limiteurds *

anyway

long liv planet earth
_aaaaaaaaaaaHOO_
oooh betta do head count

tinku

 

[peeonme]

Once again...you've leapt to the conclusion that the co-relation between US and its support for Israel is trying to excuse terrorism.
It is not. It is an attempt to remind people what led to the rise of terrorism as an outlet for middle east anger.

And by the way, the founding of the Jewish state and problems in the middle east precedes WWII.

As I wrote earlier, we are, in fact, fighting a 3500 year old tribal war from which there is no escape. Seriously. There is none as long as the Abrahamic sects, including Christians, remain fixated on the Old Testament (and Revelations) and we keep ourselves enslaved to Middle Eastern oil.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_state 1948.

Your attempt to remind people points the blame at the USA and some of it's allies. I am sure that the latest victims of these had nothing to do with what led to the anger of these terrorists.

My point is that there was a time when the youth and others could be recruited by the church https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
Today this would be impossible. Why? Because the church (meaning the body of believers) by in large no longer takes it's beliefs that seriously, people go through the motions but due to public education combined with secular humanism go no further than to attend.

There are exceptions of course, but they are just that, exceptions. To drive young Muslims in to the arms of fanatical fundamentalists by ostracizing them because of their faith only harms society.
The rest of the world needs to win over these young men, water down their faith and lead them in to secular humanism just as it has done to young Christians.

 

[Cormac135]

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

ha

pinku

ha

 

[xbuzzerx]

We can go back to who fucked someone's goat without their permission. I suppose then by what you point to with the US support of Israel we should hold Germany responsible in as much as Israel became a nation (again) as a result of Nazi Germany's driving them out or killing the Jews.

I would submit that we can find an excuse for all actions. I didn't get a tricycle when I was 3 years old, therefore I can take out this deprivation on the rest of innocent humanity.]

That's a pretty gross oversimplification (and sterilization) of about a hundred years of land encroachment and collective punishments against Palestinians.

Yes, many ME regimes evince no actual desire to help refugees themselves and seem to use the abuse of Palestinians as a convenient PR tool. That doesn't change the fact that a fuck lot more is going on than "someone took my tricycle."

 

[peeonme]

That's a pretty gross oversimplification (and sterilization) of about a hundred years of land encroachment and collective punishments against Palestinians.

Yes, many ME regimes evince no actual desire to help refugees themselves and seem to use the abuse of Palestinians as a convenient PR tool. That doesn't change the fact that a fuck lot more is going on than "someone took my tricycle."

You are right, it is gross and simple, just as attacking those who had no connection to what ever these murderers are pissed off about
is a simple but unjust way to show anger.

 

[xbuzzerx]

You are right, it is gross and simple, just as attacking those who had no connection to what ever these murderers are pissed off about
is a simple but unjust way to show anger.

The injustice is on both sides. Except one side has a first world military aided, equipped and partially funded by first world powers who refuse to make any firm stance against their abuses against innocent people. This side, however, has all the proper things like a nation label and a flag, so they are not terrorists when they do it.

 

[peeonme]

The injustice is on both sides. Except one side has a first world military aided, equipped and partially funded by first world powers who refuse to make any firm stance against their abuses against innocent people. This side, however, has all the proper things like a nation label and a flag, so they are not terrorists when they do it.

To look at this objectively is no doubt difficult for either side, right or wrong we are where we are, where do we go from here?
If Nato. forces attack in retaliation it enforces the message that is used to recruit future terrorists. However, repercussions seem necessary.
There has been a long standing policy of not negotiating with terrorist, Muslim groups, that has not worked too well.
I think that trying to win over their youth and bring them in to modern times might be a good start.