Facebook Friending Anti Gay Marriage Groups

[metta]

Recently, I have been asked to join some of these groups so that we can see if we can change some minds. Well, I have just joined one of them but I'm not so sure about this. I'm not really into confrontations or arguing with people. Do you really think that it is possible to change any of these peoples minds? The comments on these groups are pretty nasty and bigoted, not just about gays either. I think that I don't believe in a God makes it even more difficult to discuss it with them.

 

[Achilleus]

There isn't a chance in hell that you will be successful in changing their minds. Don't waste your time.

 

[JasunStrikesBack]

Oh as soon as you start making sense and besting them in a few arguements and changing minds, the mods will ban you.

Don't waste your time.

 

[hylas]

no chance. its almost impossible face to face, its a complete waste of time online.

you could go there and troll a little, of course... but that would make them feel like they are right.

you wanna make a change, spend your energy and time otherwise, there are zillions of possibilities.

 

[BearBoi]

In many years of civil debate with anti-gay people, I have managed to help change the minds of... 2 people.

But those 2 were worth it all, and I feel better for it.

Sometimes it is easy to lob slander and abuse at a faceless, nameless group of people. However, if you can get even one of them to see you as a person, than sometimes that is all it takes for their buried/numb/forgotten sense of reason to kick in.

If you have the time and will to try, I'd commend you for the effort.

 

[hotatlboi]

In many years of civil debate with anti-gay people, I have managed to help change the minds of... 2 people.

It's not that no one's mind can be changed. I think some definitely can be. However people who are against gays so much that they actively organize into groups to campaign against equal treatment for gays (what the groups mentioned generally are) are very rarely going to be open to reason.

 

[frankfrank]

^ hotatlboi said it well - those who are committed enough to actually form into groups [becoming clusters, then planets] have an innate gravitational attraction which probably cannot be overcome.

Cervantes wrote about this metaphorically a few centuries ago, though he couldn't possibly foresee an issue of this type.

Most likely the result will be as effective as jousting at windmills.

Be prepared for some VERY nasty confrontations as well...

 

[BearBoi]

It's not that no one's mind can be changed. I think some definitely can be. However people who are against gays so much that they actively organize into groups to campaign against equal treatment for gays (what the groups mentioned generally are) are very rarely going to be open to reason.

Probably true, but I'd bet that on a place like Facebook there will be a lot of general-users that join the group because they have some fringe-beliefs but nothing solid. I figured that they would be the ones whose minds are not totally closed.

Worse comes to worse, the group kicks/bans you for trying.

 

[metta]

Thanks guys...that is basically the way I was leaning anyways, which is why I did not post anything on their pages. I unfreinded them. I really think that it has more to do with wanting to feel superior to another group than it does the bible. The bible is just an excuse.

 

[hylas]

Probably true, but I'd bet that on a place like Facebook there will be a lot of general-users that join the group because they have some fringe-beliefs but nothing solid. I figured that they would be the ones whose minds are not totally closed.

Worse comes to worse, the group kicks/bans you for trying.

even if there are some users amongst them that could be swayed, you will be up against a shitload of shitheads, who have left the tiny bit of decency they might have had at the door, because its the internet. we all know people are ruder and more cruel on the net, and we all know how hate gets amplified in masses. you, sitting at home alone and facing all that hate, will end up bitter and demotivated. dont waste your energy like that, you are too valuable for that, and there are better ways.

i spent some years as an active member of ncbi, giving workshops to teenagers. now, that organisation is anything but perfect, i left, after all. but its just one of many possibilities. one important thing is that, yeah, you will be facing soul-crushing hatred, but you wont be there alone. you will be there with a network of people who have your back, knowing exactly what you are going trough. its so important!

 

[metta]

Wow.....the level of ignorance from the posters is just over whelming:

"Gay is a choice, you're not born with it. Saying that is like saying, people are born murderers. It's a choice. But we shouldn't hate them for their choice and we don't. One of the main purposes of marriage is to pro-create, and a woman and woman, or a man and man, cannot do that. We do not hate gay people, if you are a true Christian. We just do not like the choice they made, just like how people look down on teenage pregnancy etc. We do not hate the teenager or their child, just do not like the choices they made."

"If people are born sick in the head then I guess it's safe to say animals are too, which is why everyone hates pitbulls etc. This is ridiculous. There is no proof that people are born gay, and if people were born gay wouldn't there be at least ONE animal species that has gays? There isn't...so being gay is a choice. Also, explain to me why there are so many people who were gay, and then became straight? How is that not a choice?"

(P.S.: I have not posted to the group....just read some of the posts.)

The group is working on having rally's for a 2010 summer of marriage tour all over the country.
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=360767745882&ref=share
http://www.protectmarriagesite.com/summer_marriage_rallies.php

The original creator of the group says that he/she is an ex-gay. This facebook page has over 266k fans. eeeek.....

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

There isn't a chance in hell that you will be successful in changing their minds. Don't waste your time.

Interesting. I see it the exact opposite way. Yes, talking to some people is comparable to talking to a brick wall (and equally as productive) but you'll never know unless you try, and if you don't try, do you have any room to complain about the problem? (Not YOU, "you" hypothetically).

I recently came into contact with a high-school friend who is currently serving in the military and a staunch supporter of Don't Ask Don't Tell. Just to get under his skin, for weeks I'd post articles, stats and info to his profile, hoping I could educate him and it failed. 7 months after I added him as a friend I made a joke about his fear of showering with openly gay men and it sparked a dialogue that ended in him understanding the other side of this discriminatory law.

Is it worth it? Depends on each individual and their values, some people would stand in line for 4 days to get Star Wars tickets but won't spend 5 minutes making a donation to a human rights organization.

 

[fabulouslyghetto]

@Keaton: Agreed! Straight marriage is disgusting!

PS: If we don't intend to outreach to segments of society that haven't always welcomed us with open arms, we may as well give up the battle for gays rights because, purely by numbers, it would be IMPOSSIBLE to win this on our own.

 

[Achilleus]

Interesting. I see it the exact opposite way. Yes, talking to some people is comparable to talking to a brick wall (and equally as productive) but you'll never know unless you try, and if you don't try, do you have any room to complain about the problem? (Not YOU, "you" hypothetically).

I recently came into contact with a high-school friend who is currently serving in the military and a staunch supporter of Don't Ask Don't Tell. Just to get under his skin, for weeks I'd post articles, stats and info to his profile, hoping I could educate him and it failed. 7 months after I added him as a friend I made a joke about his fear of showering with openly gay men and it sparked a dialogue that ended in him understanding the other side of this discriminatory law.

Is it worth it? Depends on each individual and their values, some people would stand in line for 4 days to get Star Wars tickets but won't spend 5 minutes making a donation to a human rights organization.

Hey Karen,

I do appreciate your point of view, but the example you gave, with your military friend, is a different situation, than that of the OP. It is always easier to convert someone, if you know them. I spent two years as a Mormon missionary, trying to convert people to Mormonism. One of the key things we sought to do, was to "build a relationship of trust." Which simply meant, becoming friends with the person, before trying to convert them.

The OP, was joining these internet groups, an impersonal environment, of the most devout homophobes out there. That's why I don't expect him to be successful, and think he is wasting his time. I think it would be extremely difficult, in that kind of environment, to actually have the meaningful dialogue necessary to change someones mind. So, I'm not against trying to convert people. I just don't think these internet groups the OP joined is the right place to try.

I do believe that we should definitely talk to the people we know, if they have homophobic ideas, and try to convert them to being supporters. Just as you did with your friend in the military.

 

[metta]

What do you guys think about making fun of there Summer Of Marriage Tour by carrying signs asking to bring back stoning of non-virgin women (Deuteronomy 22:13-21), pushing for men to become eunuchs (castrated) (Matthew 19:12) and other bibical things?

 

[GamerBear]

There isn't a chance in hell that you will be successful in changing their minds. Don't waste your time.

Yeah I agree, only thing that can be done is just report them.

 

[RationalLunacy]

What do you guys think about making fun of there Summer Of Marriage Tour by carrying signs asking to bring back stoning of non-virgin women (Deuteronomy 22:13-21), pushing for men to become eunuchs (castrated) (Matthew 19:12) and other bibical things?

Speaking as JUB's resident eunuch, I'm in.

 

[metta]

^eeekss....sorry....(s/b their, not there). I have no idea how I did that. I guess it shows how exhausted I have been lately.

 

[MyReply]

You're not going to change anyone's mind about anything so loaded over the Internet.

 

[Achilleus]

What do you guys think about making fun of there Summer Of Marriage Tour by carrying signs asking to bring back stoning of non-virgin women (Deuteronomy 22:13-21), pushing for men to become eunuchs (castrated) (Matthew 19:12) and other bibical things?

What a lovely idea. I love such little pranks as this.