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On-Topic Gay For Trump (Not saying I'm one of them)

Might be worth their while reading this piece from Mother Jones before commenting.

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I'm staunchly anti-Trump, anti-MAGA, but I haven't heard a lot of anti-gay rhetoric.

Most of it has targeted trans people, and draq queens who enjoyed pushing the envelope by using reading times in libraries to shock the straight public. Well, it worked, so congratulations. Mission accomplished.
 
NotHardUp1 said:
I'm staunchly anti-Trump, anti-MAGA, but I haven't heard a lot of anti-gay rhetoric.

Most of it has targeted trans people, and draq queens who enjoyed pushing the envelope by using reading times in libraries to shock the straight public. Well, it worked, so congratulations. Mission accomplished.
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Have you actually been to a drag queen story hour? There's nothing shocking about it.
 
LilBit said:
Have you actually been to a drag queen story hour? There's nothing shocking about it.
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No, I have seen them in full via videos. That the group is there as a poltical support statement is obvious.

The majority of the straight population views drag as deviance when outside night club entertainment. They also have become hypersensitive to all aspects of adults approaching their children, thanks to the internet and the propensity of news media to hype and scare to get viewers. Everyone is a serial killer, etc.

The whole schtick of drag is a burlesque act, correctly associated with vulgarity, obscenity, double entendres and coarse content. Schools and institutions that have children under care are hyper careful about exposing children to objectionable sexual content, right down to enforcing dress codes to remove sexualization of appearance.

Taking a burlesque act and temporarily removing the character's whore persona and pretending the man is suddenly not a sexualized representation is intentionally disingenuous, playing a game of blink with the public. Parents choose when to introduce sexual matter to their children, and pretending crossdressing or burlesque is a less controversial aspect of sex than the birds and the bees is intentionally shocking.

There is a segement of the population that advocates against amost all sexual mores and works to poke them in the eye as a social statement against the imposition of social standards they find chafing and prudish. It is clearly a counterattack.

Further, the association of drag queens witth gays is a trope that is outdated and against equality. The whole point of drag is to tittilate and shock and by that extreme entertain with humor. The act furthers the assumption that there is some raging queen inside gays, wanting to be not just a woman, but a diva. The whole schtick of being an out and proud whore in the act is then conflated in the public mind with transexuals and gays.

The trans people I have met are not out to turn the world on its ear. They are simply trying to survive and fit in as who they feel they are inside, and it's not Mae West.

And gays I have known are largely not wanna be femme fatales. They are men who like sex with other men, masculine or feminine or whatever.

There is an unspoken code in LGBTQ politics that all aberrations from straight are equal. That's not true, and it never has been. There is also some mantra that drag is part of our political coalition for civil rights. To the degree that private clubs have the right to have raunch comedy acts, that is true, but drag is not a sexual orientation, nor an identity. It's an act, even in gay clubs. It can be by a gay man, or not.

We need to stop confusing the whole subject by pretending drag is some sexual preference or lifestyle. When I go to the Shop Rite, I never see a man in drag buying corn flakes. I have seen men in drag in places to be seen, like a mall in Dallas or Atlanta, but they were clearly there to be seen, not going about daily life in drag.

Being nice to kids in a reading time and at the same time pushing a statement about sexuality in a larger conflict with straight America is not a valid or wise strategy for taking a seat at the public table for equality. It is an errant shock tactic that is geared to evoke reactionary response and then cast aspersions for the prudishness. It does and will create a rise in conservatism at the very time that gay acceptance was increasing steadiliy.
 
I think it's a bit of a stretch to imply that Kamala Harris lost the election because of drag queen children's story hours. In the first place, it was pretty much under the radar until the Republican right saw in it an issue they could exploit. A law passed by the right-wing Florida legislature banning drag performances was blocked by a court ruling. Most reports I've heard is that these story hours are quite innocuous, aside from the video you saw. And should something be said that adults find "offensive," remarks which children don't understand or aren't ready for will usually fly over the tops of their heads.

We have to realize that drag queens are part of the community, along with hearing the songs "We Are Family" and "I Will Survive" at every Pride event. Yes, their ubiquitous presence might upset the masculine fragility of some gay males. But doesn't it get tiring to constantly look over our shoulders wondering how all our activities might play to the "straight" community out there who are not in attendance?

From what I've seen there appears to be a sort of evolution in the drag queen community in recent years. No longer being limited to midnight shows in gay clubs, many drag queens are now doing fundraisers for charities and organizations in the LGBTQ+ community, including community centers, churches, and social organizations. In fact, I've seen performances at my local MCC church, where drag queens perform gospel numbers, and donate all their tips to the church fund. Also, there are Sunday brunch performances at restaurants, where drag queens doing gospel are the stars.
 
It isn't just a bit of a stretch. It is a ridiculously naive reductivist and nonsensical position.
 
NotHardUp1 said:
I'm staunchly anti-Trump, anti-MAGA, but I haven't heard a lot of anti-gay rhetoric.

Most of it has targeted trans people, and draq queens who enjoyed pushing the envelope by using reading times in libraries to shock the straight public. Well, it worked, so congratulations. Mission accomplished.
Click to expand...

Project 2025 is full of anti-gay hate. Despite Trump's lies, Project 2025 is the agenda. Next year at this time we will not be here discussing anything because JUB will be gone along with a lot of other gay websites. That is on the Project 2025 plan. And it is not just porn sites. Any site with a gay outreach will be targeted, including sites like Human Rights Campaign, Metro weekly, GLAAD, Advocate, PFLAG, Gay Men's Health Crisis. All of them. Their goal is to stamp out everything that has any outreach to the gay community at all.

That's my prediction. We'll see.

Welcome to the Fourth Reich.
 
Kapos.

One and all.

Because of their wealth they won't blink an eye over the fall of Obergefell...or the broad based campaign against lgbtq people that will literally destroy lives.

They have no moral ascendancy here.
 
They seem to be of the "LGB without the T" variety. They think transpeople are hurting the gay community, but don't realize that transphobia tends to go hand-in-hand with homophobia.

As for Trump, I don't think he's anti-LGBT personally. He's spoken out against Kim Davis, an anti-transbathroom bill and held up the pride flag after the nightclub shooting. The anti-trans stuff is clearly him pandering to the Right's growing anti-trans sentiment. He doesn't hate any particular group, but sure as hell is willing to throw them under the bus for his own selfish motivations. His movement on the other hand, is very bigoted. He appeals to Far right extremacists, Christian nationalists and white supremacists who have no idea he's a grifter exploiting their gullibility. That's why he's hated by Republicans like Liz Cheney and Mitt Romney; they're smart enough to know he's full of shit.
 
The GQP and Trump have been very good at finding things to be afraid of; the trans community being one of them. Their power comes from fear. The reason we have gay marriage and the supreme court rulings we do is because most people either know or have a relative who is LGB. Suddenly, there wasn't fear of "Uncle Tom" because they knew me or know my friends. Heck, my former step-daughter embraced my old roommate and still corresponds with him despite her caustic attitude to anyone not part of the GQP or her hand-raising, scream and dance, religious crowd (I had to block her, it became too much).

The trans community is very small. Most people have no friends or relatives who are trans. Approximately 1.03% of the U.S. adult population, or 2.6 million Americans, identify as transgender and not all of them have had all of the surgery, etc. to fully transition. The GQP made it seem like you could go to school in the morning as Tom and come home at night as Tomasina. Kids were being transitioned and still could bring home passing grades! The friends I know who are trans have been going through years of counseling, meetings, and evaluations. Some may have had the first procedures but even mastectomy data has to be carefully looked at because some women need the surgery TO PREVENT the onset of breast cancer, having undergone DNA screens showing them at high risk. Just like we found after restricting abortions -- many of the "abortions" were not just a casual way of dealing with not using contraception but are because the child is fatally deformed, the mother is at risk of her life, or she is having a miscarriage. The right made it sound like babies were being tossed into the dumpster around every corner; the reality is that many women are dying because of that stupidity.

The process of fully transitioning is long and painful but those I know say it was totally worth it. The challenge is that you may not even know someone is trans and in most parts of the country, it is very likely no one has ever seen or met a trans person. It might be nice if the news media could follow the journey of someone, but it would take more than the 30 seconds usually allotted for a sound bite.

A good book on the subject is "American Teenager; How trans kids are surviving hate and finding joy in a turbulent era" written by Nico Lang. As an ordained priest, I have met Nico and one of the persons in the book. The journey brought tears to my eyes and should every decent person. It was also very eye opening because I, too, was ignorant on the plight of many in the trans community. Too often they are forced into the sex trade because "straight" men love the erotic idea but often then harm the worker because of their own self-loathing.
 
Latimer said:
^
Examples?

Fourth Reich? Unless you've been rounded up, and this site has been shut down, get back to us in a couple of years.
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Denial is one of the things that let it happen in Germany. The patterns and methods are the same. Trump literally quotes Hitler. They're doing the same things. They have a written 1,000-page plan to turn the U.S. into a fascist, neo-Nazi authoritarian dictatorship.
 
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