Gay Teen: Stop Bullying or I’ll Sue

[boxerdudeuk]

They should be sued. They will be sued. And they will lose.

i'm sorry - since when was the responsibility of the behaviour of a minor taken away from the parents and layed upon the administrators of a school?

give your head a shake. the parents are responsible for their children's behaviour. NOT the school.

 

[mydrew1]

I feel like the correct course of action would be lobbying the state government / department of education to institute comprehensive anti-bullying programs, not saying "omg, put in anti-gay bullying programs or I'm gonna sue you."

The school should do it voluntary in the first place. The same as employers shouldn't have to be subject to health and safety laws to impose standards.

Safety belts were legal to be not provided with cars remember, but manufacturers insisted it should be up to the customer to pay more for them afterwords and not burden businesses with the cost.

The fact that schools fail to rise to the occasion themselves speaks volumes, like that they DON'T care about suppressing volatile behaviour.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

The School is responsible for the child when the child is in their School.

the school is responsible for the physical well-being of the child insomuch as if their physical being is at risk - the school is responsible to immediately report the risk to law enforcement and be compliant with cooperating in any criminal matters which follow it.

the school is NOT directly responsible for the BEHAVIOUR of a student there. there is absolutely no way to control the behaviour of students. they can only react to it appropriately - and if they act appropriately, they can't be held civilly responsible.

 

[bankside]

I hope people don't misunderstand this kid's point. He's not saying to the school "Make these other kids like me and hang out with me on the weekends."

He's saying "Stop allowing them to make my life a living hell in your school so I can get my studies done and graduate like everyone else."

He has a strong case:

• attending school is not just a right or a convenience or a choice or a privilege; until a certain age, he's probably obliged to attend by the law
• before he reaches 18 years of age, he is legally in the custody of his parents, and his parents are legally required to surrender him to the custody of a responsible adult during the day, namely his school teachers, administrators, principals, etc., all of whom have a duty of care under various laws for his well-being.

For fuck's sake, a kid's teachers could go to jail if they failed to report evidence of sexual abuse, and they certainly aren't boinking the kid themselves, but that doesn't lessen their liability if they know something is wrong.

They don't have to be the direct cause of the problem to be legally responsible for fixing it, and that principle is well-established in the laws of many jurisdictions.

 

[fetaby]

i'm going to be blunt here. let's say i'm an african american male. i'm sitting in a theatre watching a movie. you walk by me and call me a n***er.

should i be able to sue the theatre for your behaviour?

The theater isn't a school. Equate your analogy. If you were both employees of the theatre and he called you that, he'd be fired under policy guidelines.

Children are required to attend school either public or private, or have the equivalent education taught to them at home. Behavior regarding the treatment of others is set up in regards to race, gender, religion. Sexuality now is an unprotected class of existence.

I'm not going to argue that the world does suck, and there are people in it who are bad. You are correct in that they exist. But you are most incorrect in saying that we shouldn't try.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

I hope people don't misunderstand this kid's point. He's not saying to the school "Make these other kids like me and hang out with me on the weekends."

He's saying "Stop allowing them to make my life a living hell in your school so I can get my studies done and graduate like everyone else."

He has a strong case:

• attending school is not just a right or a convenience or a choice or a privilege; until a certain age, he's probably obliged to attend by the law
• before he reaches 18 years of age, he is legally in the custody of his parents, and his parents are legally required to surrender him to the custody of a responsible adult during the day, namely his school teachers, administrators, principals, etc., all of whom have a duty of care under various laws for his well-being.

For fuck's sake, a kid's teachers could go to jail if they failed to report evidence of sexual abuse, and they certainly aren't boinking the kid themselves, but that doesn't lessen their liability if they know something is wrong.

They don't have to be the direct cause of the problem to be legally responsible for fixing it, and that principle is well-established in the laws of many jurisdictions.

i don't see where you're mentioning any responsibility of the parents to ensure their kids aren't abusive fucking pieces of shit when they're at school?

 

[JOHN B]

I'm sorry, but I am so sick of this "PC" culture we have today. Look....bullying is just a part of growing up. I was bullied, straight people I know were bullied, ...even adults bully other adults--- (There was an article in USA Today last week, talking about On The Job Bullying)---it happens! But the situation, I feel, is just made worse for those being bullied, by telling them "OMG----SOMETHING HORRIBLE IS HAPPENING TO YOU! AND ONLY YOU! AND IT'S GOING TO AFFECT YOU FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE!!!!".
Protecting people from something that happens to just about everyone some time in thier life, does not allow them to learn how to deal with it......other than teaching them to hide behind a stronger person (or the law) and telling them to "make it go away!".

I know people are going to read into me as being crass and uncaring, but children need to learn how to deal with conflict, not hide/protect themselves from it.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

they're responsible for not preventing the behavior

you. can't. stop. the. behaviour.

teenagers aren't robots. they do what they do. they have their own minds and decision making processes - no matter how flawed those decisions may be.

they can only REACT to behaviour - they can't prevent it.

 

[bankside]

i don't see where you're mentioning any responsibility of the parents to ensure their kids aren't abusive fucking pieces of shit when they're at school?

I don't have to. He can sue them too if he likes. But that doesn't change the liability of the school officials to act positively to ensure a safe environment for gay youth free of homophobic bullying.

you. can't. stop. the. behaviour.

teenagers aren't robots. they do what they do. they have their own minds and decision making processes - no matter how flawed those decisions may be.

they can only REACT to behaviour - they can't prevent it.

His lawsuit can succeed entirely on the basis of the schools' having no effective policy to react to it, never mind doing anything to foster understanding and prevention.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

I'm sorry, but I am so sick of this "PC" culture we have today. Look....bullying is just a part of growing up. I was bullied, straight people I know were bullied, ...even adults bully other adults--- (There was an article in USA Today last week, talking about On The Job Bullying)---it happens! But the situation, I feel, is just made worse for those being bullied, by telling them "OMG----SOMETHING HORRIBLE IS HAPPENING TO YOU! AND ONLY YOU! AND IT'S GOING TO AFFECT YOU FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE!!!!".
Protecting people from something that happens to just about everyone some time in thier life, does not allow them to learn how to deal with it......other than teaching them to hide behind a stronger person (or the law) and telling them to "make it go away!".

I know people are going to read into me as being crass and uncaring, but children need to learn how to deal with conflict, not hide/protect themselves from it.

i agree with you 100%. maybe it's because i'm a canadian and we have a far less "I'M GOING TO SUE YOU!!!" attitude - but it seems there's no common fucking sense left in the united states. people are offended by everything and expect legislation to be enacted to protect them from being offended. you know what? life can be offensive. fucking deal with it. but the day that a school is civilly responsible because you're precious little Dakota called a kid a fag - well that's a sad fucking state of affairs.

if your kid is a disrespectful douchebag - well maybe it's your fucking responsibility to teach the kid some fucking manners and basic social skills - and when he goes to school, he's there to learn. not to have his teacher and the principal be responsible for him being a cunt and taunting another kid for being gay.

 

[JOHN B]

LOL---say that again Mikami, and I'm going to sue you. (just kidding)

 

[fetaby]

I'm sorry, but I am so sick of this "PC" culture we have today. Look....bullying is just a part of growing up. I was bullied, straight people I know were bullied, ...even adults bully other adults--- (There was an article in USA Today last week, talking about On The Job Bullying)---it happens! But the situation, I feel, is just made worse for those being bullied, by telling them "OMG----SOMETHING HORRIBLE IS HAPPENING TO YOU! AND ONLY YOU! AND IT'S GOING TO AFFECT YOU FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE!!!!".
Protecting people from something that happens to just about everyone some time in thier life, does not allow them to learn how to deal with it......other than teaching them to hide behind a stronger person (or the law) and telling them to "make it go away!".

I know people are going to read into me as being crass and uncaring, but children need to learn how to deal with conflict, not hide/protect themselves from it.

Bullying doesn't have to happen, it isn't a necessity of life. Children do need to learn how to deal with conflict, but bullying isn't conflict it's outright harassment.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

It's not because you're Canadian. It's because you're an insensitive douche bag.

i'd rather be an insensitive douchebag who values personal responsibility and common sense than a sniveling crybaby who thinks the world owes him a perfect little insular Narnia in which everyone else is to blame for his own misfortune but himself.

 

[fetaby]

i agree with you 100%. maybe it's because i'm a canadian and we have a far less "I'M GOING TO SUE YOU!!!" attitude - but it seems there's no common fucking sense left in the united states. people are offended by everything and expect legislation to be enacted to protect them from being offended. you know what? life can be offensive. fucking deal with it. but the day that a school is civilly responsible because you're precious little Dakota called a kid a fag - well that's a sad fucking state of affairs.

if your kid is a disrespectful douchebag - well maybe it's your fucking responsibility to teach the kid some fucking manners and basic social skills - and when he goes to school, he's there to learn. not to have his teacher and the principal be responsible for him being a cunt and taunting another kid for being gay.

You agree that people shouldn't be harassed because of their race and that institutions have a responsibility to try not to let that happen. But why is this protection not afforded to individuals because of sexuality? BTW, doesn't Canada have hate speech laws?

It's nice to shift responsibility on parents and really that's where it does lie, but that doesn't change the fact that schools do have a responsibility to maintain safe environments for all it's students and that includes gay kids.

If the kid is being bullied because he's gay, the school needs act accordingly.

 

[JOHN B]

Oh great, another one of these "who cares about bullying, you PC pussies" fest in the wake of a rash of teen suicides.

BUt part of what I was eluding to in my post, was that ....we make things worse for these teens by constantly putting a "spotlight" on them saying Oh you poor baby! They are picking on you because you are weaker/different than them, and it isn't right! Teens have enough problems without being made the center of attention by well meaning adults. Plus...and I said this in a similar thread a few months ago.....gay teens commit suicide for reasons that might have nothing to do with being gay.......So many things are going on in a teens life. Apart from sexuality.

 

[Ninja108]

Is bullying ever going to be stopped 100%? No it won't but that is no excuse for a school to turn the other cheek and ignore what is happening in front of them.
Time after time, we heard stories of kids who weren't subject to bulliying....they were subject to outright cruelty and humilation while the powers that be did NOTHING..and in many cases today still do nothing.
This kid is fighting for himself and others like him...kudos to him.

 

[fetaby]

i'd rather be an insensitive douchebag who values personal responsibility and common sense than a sniveling crybaby who thinks the world owes him a perfect little insular Narnia in which everyone else is to blame for his own misfortune but himself.

Explain the personal responsibility and common sense of an adult who lets a child be bullied?

 

[boxerdudeuk]

You agree that people shouldn't be harassed because of their race and that institutions have a responsibility to try not to let that happen. But why is this protection not afforded to individuals because of sexuality? BTW, doesn't Canada have hate speech laws?

It's nice to shift responsibility on parents and really that's where it does lie, but that doesn't change the fact that schools do have a responsibility to maintain safe environments for all it's students and that includes gay kids.

If the kid is being bullied because he's gay, the school needs act accordingly.

canada has hate speech laws, but they're not what's being discussed here. apples and oranges. publishing anti-semitic hatred in print or announcing it in a public square on a megaphone isn't what we're talking about in the least.

also, its not bullying against gays that should be an issue, it's bullying. not SPECIAL laws, EQUAL laws. remove the gay part out of the equation completely.

and yes - schools need to address behaviour issues when they arise - if a kid is being bullied and the school knows who the bully is and doesn't do anything to address the situation, be it call the parent or if a real physical threat is identified - call the police - then there has to be accountability.

however, the school can't prevent the actual event. they can only react. call the parents of the bully responsible, maybe have a 3 day suspension - whatever. this isn't rocket science.

but to SPECIFICALLY identify that if a gay kid gets bullied - the school can be sued? fuck that. that's retarded.

 

[boxerdudeuk]

Explain the personal responsibility and common sense of an adult who lets a child be bullied?

you're right - i don't see how a responsible parent could let their child bully another kid either.

see what i did there?

 

[boxerdudeuk]

The School is responsible for the child when the child is in their School.

so as we all know, lots of schools in the US have sponsored lunch programs so that kids who maybe don't get enough to eat at home in the mornings etc at least have a decent meal at noon.

right?

so... why can't the school be sued for NOT feeding the child at lunch? the kid is solely their responsibility while they're at school... right? so maybe now the school should be financially liable should that child have a behavioural issue related to poor nutrition? why isn't the school liable for a child being obese? did the school ensure that the kid got enough exercise during the day? did the kid eat a chocolate bar on school grounds that maybe contributed to being a diabetic? sue the school administration, right?