Looks like everybody's gonna get shafted after all. Someone just emailed me saying to read the bill or at least a summary of it, because the bill will increase taxes on 80% of Americans, not just those making over $400K or couples making $450k.
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Getting Closer To A Fiscal Cliff Deal
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xbuzzerx
CE&P Secret Police
Just FYI 99% of e-mail forwarded political e-mails from friends/coworkers/that lady at little league are turbo right wing, and deficient in reality.
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
From Slate: The Slatest!
Yes taxes go up on everyone. The Payroll tax feeding Social Security goes back to 6.2 percent or a 2% raise. There are no details on what incentives are cut between the two income benchmarks. However the bill raises only 600 Billion in revenue and slashes 3.7 Trillion in revenue that would have been gained if the cliff had simply occurred.
Still the EITC and Child Credit remain for impoverished families. SO the absolute bottom of the American economic scale will see no increase that they actually feel.
So the long and short is we gave up a tax increase that would be a quarter of our deficit to accept an increase in revenue of one fifth that amount. Yet we had to begin somewhere with paying our bills and as the economy rebounds it will be in future congresses that we need to raise the marginal rate on all to pay the rest of our bill.
Yes taxes go up on everyone. The Payroll tax feeding Social Security goes back to 6.2 percent or a 2% raise. There are no details on what incentives are cut between the two income benchmarks. However the bill raises only 600 Billion in revenue and slashes 3.7 Trillion in revenue that would have been gained if the cliff had simply occurred.
Still the EITC and Child Credit remain for impoverished families. SO the absolute bottom of the American economic scale will see no increase that they actually feel.
So the long and short is we gave up a tax increase that would be a quarter of our deficit to accept an increase in revenue of one fifth that amount. Yet we had to begin somewhere with paying our bills and as the economy rebounds it will be in future congresses that we need to raise the marginal rate on all to pay the rest of our bill.
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
Yeah i agree. It is exactly what we needed. Head in the right direction. Now the left wont like it but Obama said he would entertain cuts once taxes were raised so you will see the white house facing a lot of lefty criticism very soon. Spending is out of control. Again a balanced action where each side takes some thing they don't like and agree to get some things they desire to cut... then after 2014 hopefully the democrats regain congress, the economy gets into full swing in 2015 and taxes get raised to get us back to a satisfactory level of debt.
and unlike Pelosi and her $100M stash - Boehner has only $4M
kudos to him for having some balls after all
it will likely be off with his head but it was the right thing to do
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
Oh yeah defense is bloated. by my count we need to shed 250,000 military jobs so that means easily losing half a million defense industry jobs. However it has to be a ten year plan. No way it would be fair to those being dumped or to the economy to dump 3/4 of a million onto the job market.
and unlike Pelosi and her $100M stash - Boehner has only $4M
kudos to him for having some balls after all
it will likely be off with his head but it was the right thing to do
I always felt Boehner was agonizing over not being able to accomplish anything. I hope he retains his speakership to be quite honest. While he is only showing glints of bi-partisan greatness and if re-elected will probably return to the normal tea party punching bag. Yet the debt ceiling and budget talks are right around the corner. Cantor is next up to bat and that speakership would be tragic.
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
Hearing mixed info today. Couple of thoughts before I head out.
The deal purportedly not only raised only 600 Billion or fives days operating budget.... it also cost 4 trillion... I have yet to find if that 4 trillion cost referenced is talking about the 3.7 trillion in Clinton era tax rates that will now be permanently Bush tax rates for those below 400-450.
The best example I heard was what Biden apparently said in the Dem caucus. He said take it as a stepped approach. First debt cliff netted a trillion in cuts, second cliff nail biter netted 600 billion but contained no cuts, so then the final stage should be in the next 60 days. Which still has the fiscal cliff trillion dollar spending cuts looming.
So really we will have to see if republicans figured out they could have had a much better deal last summer and perhaps they should work during working hours and not be obstinate. Equally Senate Dems and the President need to rapidly and publicly put their deal on the table.
The deal purportedly not only raised only 600 Billion or fives days operating budget.... it also cost 4 trillion... I have yet to find if that 4 trillion cost referenced is talking about the 3.7 trillion in Clinton era tax rates that will now be permanently Bush tax rates for those below 400-450.
The best example I heard was what Biden apparently said in the Dem caucus. He said take it as a stepped approach. First debt cliff netted a trillion in cuts, second cliff nail biter netted 600 billion but contained no cuts, so then the final stage should be in the next 60 days. Which still has the fiscal cliff trillion dollar spending cuts looming.
So really we will have to see if republicans figured out they could have had a much better deal last summer and perhaps they should work during working hours and not be obstinate. Equally Senate Dems and the President need to rapidly and publicly put their deal on the table.
Cantor is a weasel to the nth degree - his voting record speaks for itself
and I have seen him on a handful of cable news programs - he generally hides but occasionally appears - and when he does - he's a major turd who looks and sounds the part of a used car salesman (no offense to CE+P car salesmen)
says nada ever and is basically an obstructionist
i actually feel for Boehner - Woodward's book said that JB worked very hard - if not effectively - to work with Pres. Obama - but that he was surrounded (by infidels) - love the word infidels
Cantor as speaker would be tragic - another good word
haven't heard anything from Chris Christie on the debt crisis/fiscal cliff btw
and I have seen him on a handful of cable news programs - he generally hides but occasionally appears - and when he does - he's a major turd who looks and sounds the part of a used car salesman (no offense to CE+P car salesmen)
says nada ever and is basically an obstructionist
i actually feel for Boehner - Woodward's book said that JB worked very hard - if not effectively - to work with Pres. Obama - but that he was surrounded (by infidels) - love the word infidels
Cantor as speaker would be tragic - another good word
haven't heard anything from Chris Christie on the debt crisis/fiscal cliff btw
just read that Boehner told Harry Reid a thing or 2 in response to Harry's "word is out" on JB that he's a dictator
Harry Reid is a piece of shit and if I saw him I would tell him to go fuck himself too - after tripping him of course and then laughing at him - then taking his wallet
Boehner has his flaws but character analysis is not one of them
Go JB
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...ations-john-boehner-harry-reid_n_2394725.html
Harry Reid is a piece of shit and if I saw him I would tell him to go fuck himself too - after tripping him of course and then laughing at him - then taking his wallet
Boehner has his flaws but character analysis is not one of them
Go JB
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...ations-john-boehner-harry-reid_n_2394725.html
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^^^
Boehner can tell McConnell to go "fuck himself too" as far as I'm concerned. McConnell participated in dividing the republicans in the House.
I repeat, this was a stupid bill, it does nothing but raises taxes and most importantly kicks the can down the road again. The bill did nothing about the deficits. Obama is worthless as a leader -- he doesn't see the big picture, he just sees politics. Even Richard Nixon through all his faults saw the big picture.
Obama broke his promise not to raise taxes on those under $250,000. Oops! It's ok, dear leader, the chosen one, the one we've been waiting for can do anything he wants.
Yeah ... one more thing .... have a good vacation in Hawaii Mr. President. Any of the Obamallegiance concerned about the carbon footprint?
Boehner can tell McConnell to go "fuck himself too" as far as I'm concerned. McConnell participated in dividing the republicans in the House.
I repeat, this was a stupid bill, it does nothing but raises taxes and most importantly kicks the can down the road again. The bill did nothing about the deficits. Obama is worthless as a leader -- he doesn't see the big picture, he just sees politics. Even Richard Nixon through all his faults saw the big picture.
Obama broke his promise not to raise taxes on those under $250,000. Oops! It's ok, dear leader, the chosen one, the one we've been waiting for can do anything he wants.
Yeah ... one more thing .... have a good vacation in Hawaii Mr. President. Any of the Obamallegiance concerned about the carbon footprint?
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
Everybody loses in this game. Of course the house was offered spending cuts more than once but was too entrenched in the no new revenue concept that they gave a pass to very worthwhile changes.
Still kicking the can but EVERYBODY has the perception that the reason the can is kicked is because of republicans. Just consider that they gave on a increase in taxes after twenty years of standing against tax increases and all they got for contrition was exactly nothing YET they were offered plenty. What an embarrassing lack of leadership from the GOP.
See how that works Jack? One can pretend that compromise means the other failed all day long but guess what happens when they fail? We all lose.
Still kicking the can but EVERYBODY has the perception that the reason the can is kicked is because of republicans. Just consider that they gave on a increase in taxes after twenty years of standing against tax increases and all they got for contrition was exactly nothing YET they were offered plenty. What an embarrassing lack of leadership from the GOP.
See how that works Jack? One can pretend that compromise means the other failed all day long but guess what happens when they fail? We all lose.
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
No word on the cliff deal but he did lay the failure to pass Sandy Relief squarely on Boehners plate along with the obstructionalist republican majority in the house. (Paraphrased from his words not mine.)
The sad thing is ALL of us are onto these freaking clowns (both red and blue) and we as a nation know the things that need to occur. So elected leaders... get to fucking work.
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When is Obama going to sign the bill passed last night by the House?
Will he wait until he gets back from vacation?
Will he wait until he gets back from vacation?
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All Americans got screwed last night and not the good kind of screwing.
We dug ourselves deeper into bankruptcy. It's all about politics and getting elected -- not about what's good for the country.
xbuzzerx
CE&P Secret Police
This may possibly be the first thing I've seen you say that seemed reasonable and not irrationally steeped in one-sided reasoning. And I agree insofar as what's been going on is entirely not about what's best for the country.
xbuzzerx
CE&P Secret Police
That's exactly what Obama has said multiple times. It's one thing to just bitch about spending in a vaccuum as if money just flies out the door and goes to absolutely nothing. When you actually talk about what needs to be cut to reduce spending even Republicans don't want to attach their names to suggesting anything. I haven't even seen the Republicans here in CE&P mention anything but some elements of defense.
JayHawk
Rambunctiously Pugnacious
I still prefer to think of it as a three part plan. I know... LORD do I know that republicans on here are loathe to give any credit or admit anything has ever gone right in the last four years BUT the last debt ceiling debacle was solved by making 1 trillion in spending cuts. The next obstacle where the obstinate parties HAD to make a decision was on the first and the republicans caved for tax increases. NOT the increases we need entirely because that will come from tax reform. However it was a step in the right direction.
The next deal will be republicans playing with the world economy for as long as they dare and potentially killing our markets if you follow Lyndsey Graham. I predict the democrats will make an offer that has cuts but includes more tax increases. Then the republicans will balk at a good deal and end up with a shit deal after they have ruined the worlds economies. All the while making a very strong case to the world that we are too irresponsible to be the worlds currency.
All the ire and anger and mean words you can type doesnt change the fact that we need to cut spending and already have... and we need to cut more and raise more revenue. Cutting services is not an issue that will be widely discussed.
