GOP and tea pary relations Tense over election issues

[BostonPirate]

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...ists-knock-on-gops-door-literally/?hpt=po_bn2

On Monday, leaders and supporters of FreedomWorks - a major tea party sponsor - will make an unscheduled visit to the offices of the National Republican Senatorial Committee, the group that helps elect Republicans to the Senate. And the activists will deliver a message to the NRSC: butt out of the Utah senate race.

At issue: Republican Sen. Orrin Hatch's re-election to a seventh term in 2012.
As FreedomWorks works to deny Hatch an eighth term, the group is infuriated that the NRSC will work to keep Hatch in office.

Will this election stress the relationship of the republican coalition to the point where the tea party may formally become a break away third party?

I think if Bachmann does not win the primary, the tea party voters would pressure her to go it as an independent.

How long will it be before the Bachmann controlled congressional tea party caucus, breaks completely from the GOP? We are already seeing Boehner become possibly the least effective speaker in US history, IMO largely due to their unwillingness to follow marching orders.

 

[CowboyBob]

Parasites always kill their host. I'm waiting for this to happen with the Tea Party. Republicans will want to nominate a moderate so they have at least some hope of winning the election. However the tea party will want an ultra conservative in and they will split the Republican party down the middle. With the Republican party ins such disarray right now this is what will happen.

 

[Centexfarmer]

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...ists-knock-on-gops-door-literally/?hpt=po_bn2



Will this election stress the relationship of the republican coalition to the point where the tea party may formally become a break away third party?

I think if Bachmann does not win the primary, the tea party voters would pressure her to go it as an independent.

How long will it be before the Bachmann controlled congressional tea party caucus, breaks completely from the GOP? We are already seeing Boehner become possibly the least effective speaker in US history, IMO largely due to their unwillingness to follow marching orders.

Not sure what you're trying to get at here BP, but Bachmann has already presented herself as part of the "lunatic fringe," and if she's truly become representative of the "GOP Tea Party Republicans," and considering the current LEADERSHIP of the NRSC, they'd screw their own mothers if they think that they might have a chance at taking control of the Senate.

If the polls say that she (as a Tea Party candidate) doesn't have a chance in hell winning a national election, they'll drop her like a hot potato, and the Tea Party goes the way of the "Vocal Minority.:

Oh the Tea Party will still be there, but THERE and not making policy in Washington.

That, or the GOP (through FOX News, or talk radio) will make their case on behalf of the Tea Party and their Agenda, and then take it out for a spin.

Pending a "Burning of the Reichstag/9/11 terrorist" moment, most rational Americans will shun the GOP and their connections with the Tea Party movement, and any gains that the GOP might hope to gain by connecting with them in 2012.

 

[BostonPirate]

not sure what I'm trying to get at?

It seemed pretty clear to me.

The tea party is going to lose votes and elections for the GOP.

is that concise enough?

 

[Centexfarmer]

not sure what I'm trying to get at?

It seemed pretty clear to me.

The tea party is going to lose votes and elections for the GOP.

is that concise enough?

What were the lines from the 1993 movie "And the Band Played On?"

What do you think? What do you know? What can you prove?

I think that you and I are thinking a like, and we think this because of what we know, but right now I don't think that you and I can "prove" anything.

If it makes you feel better, then call me a skeptic.

 

[BostonPirate]

What were the lines from the 1993 movie "And the Band Played On?"



I think that you and I are thinking a like, and we think this because of what we know, but right now I don't think that you and I can "prove" anything.

its all a guess as to where it will wind up, thats for sure. The future is the future.

I am really interested in this, because I had always assumed that if a third party would spring up with any sort of a sizeable caucus in the current political climate, that it would be the moderates in the center.

It hasn't worked out that way though.

 

[Centexfarmer]

its all a guess as to where it will wind up, thats for sure. The future is the future.

I am really interested in this, because I had always assumed that if a third party would spring up with any sort of a sizeable caucus in the current political climate, that it would be the moderates in the center.

It hasn't worked out that way though .

It's actually kind of scary of you think about it.

One would think that the Democrats, and their Leadership (Including the President of the United States) would be making more of their case toward moderate Americans and Independents, but they're not.

And now here we are, after more than 16 years control of the House of Representatives prior to the 2006 mid-terms by the likes of Newt Gingrich, Dick Armey, and Tom DeLay (the latter of the two I think but can't prove are part of Freedomworks), and NOW most of those Republicans are too "liberul???"

I'm looking to the GOP to get a handle on this, or two things are going to happen; the Republican Party is going to implode upon itself and the Democrats control everything, OR the Democrats are going to say and do nothing like they did in 2006, and 2008, and continue to win because the Republicans are going to make sure that the Democrats can't lose.

At some point in time the Democrats are going to have to step forward and actually *gasp* LEAD!

 

[BostonPirate]

Wouldnt this make the Republicans the new moderates...

in theory, it could

What we have is two groups competing for the same far right voters,trying to out conservative each other, the dems losing traction due to the jobless rate and sluggish recovery, and an ever widening middle unsure of who to vote for in a host of elections.

 

[anchihiro]

Is there no candidate then they would both be happy with?

 

[BostonPirate]

It's actually kind of scary of you think about it.

One would think that the Democrats, and their Leadership (Including the President of the United States) would be making more of their case toward moderate Americans and Independents, but they're not.

And now here we are, after more than 16 years control of the House of Representatives prior to the 2006 mid-terms by the likes of Newt Gingrich, Dick Armey, and Tom DeLay (the latter of the two I think but can't prove are part of Freedom Networks), and NOW most of those Republicans are too "liberul???"

I'm looking to the GOP to get a handle on this, or two things are going to happen; the Republican Party is going to implode upon itself and the Democrats control everything, OR the Democrats are going to say and do nothing like they did in 2006, and 2008, and continue to win because the Republicans are going to make sure that the Democrats can't lose.

At some point in time the Democrats are going to have to step forward and actually *gasp* LEAD!

The Dems and progressive organisations are having a hard time expressing their postions, much less get leaders who will take a stand.

Weiner was the only one with balls... and he HAD to go take pictures of them and post them on the internet.

Obama only seems to have a fire in his belly when HIS job is on the line, not the rest of america.... disturbing as well.

Boehner has slipped so far that he doesn't know to count votes before he puts a bill he sponsors as speaker on the floor for a vote, so there are degrees of incompetence, but it seems to me that Rome is burning, and the whole lot of them are kind of in that "so what" state of mind.

 

[BostonPirate]

Is there no candidate then they would both be happy with?

The tea party unseated about 75 people, some of which were republicans in the last house election.

The GOP was placed in the position in some instances, of having to give election funds to people they used cash to fight against in the GOP primary.

I guess the bottom line is that in the staunch conservative parts of the nation? The tea party will try to gain seats.

Hatch may be the first casualty.

GOP dreams of retaking the presidency may be the last casualty.

 

[justdra]

I think The Tea Party is the Democrats version of Independents meaning they will take away votes if things don't go their way.

 

[Tengilethos]

Could it really happen that the Republicans split? Into the Tea Party with the ultraconservatives and a more moderate Republican Party?

 

[Centexfarmer]

Could it really happen that the Republicans split? Into the Tea Party with the ultraconservatives and a more moderate Republican Party?

Sure! Look at how many "Moderate" Republicans; fiscally responsible, but socially liberal "moderates" have already abandoned the current GOP.

Either way with that type of split, the only thing that the Tea Party has to offer is sweet sounding propaganda that gets the ever dwindling 'American Middle-Class' to continue to vote against their own best interests, and the "leadership" within the current GOP scrambling to hold onto power within their own party.

I think that the American Electorate is starving for some leadership, and they're willing to look anywhere to get it, even it means voting for a specious party that seems to speak to their anger against the status quo.

 

[BostonPirate]

I would add, though that the split would be that the tea party and the religious base would follow the Tea party caucus, Versus the reaganites, the Goldwater conservatives, and the old establishment powerwhouse families would retain the GOP.

It seems more likely all the time that if the GOP is to survive this is what it will have to do. A third party just has to choose which of the two larger ones to caucus with as a group.

The independents in congress choose the democrats to Caucus with, and they do that because only the two largest parties assign seats on the committees and sub committees. That is where the power is.

 

[mbamike]

This is great news! This will split the Republican vote and the Democrats win!

A similar event happened in 1992 with Ross Perot, daddy Bush, and Bill Clinton. Perot and Bush split the Republican vote giving Clinton the White House.

 

[T-Rexx]

Could it really happen that the Republicans split? Into the Tea Party with the ultraconservatives and a more moderate Republican Party?

No. America cannot tolerate more than two political parties.

What will happen is what has been happening for 30 years. The Republican Party will continue to move to the right. The rise of the Tea Party is not some bizarre anomaly. It is a manifestation of that party's movement toward the right. It is not coincidence that the Tea Party arose within the Republican Party and that it embraces Republican social values (despite claims to the contrary). The Tea Party represents a frustration amongst some Republicans that the party is not moving rightward fast enough, and that the party is not extreme enough.

The Tea Party will not split the Republican Party because it is the Republican Party. Any 'moderate" version of the Republican Party would disappear quickly, because it would be indistinguishable from the Democratic Party, which has become rather right-wing over the past 30 years.

There is decreasing tolerance within the Republican Party for moderation. Normally, that would be a big problem for a political party in any country. The reason that increasing extremism within the Republican Party has not harmed it is that the nation as a whole has been moving right-ward over the past 30 years. If the nation continues to move right-ward, the Tea Party will become the Republican Party. That would be a dangerous development.

If America should stop moving right-ward, the Tea Party movement will die off.

 

[Kulindahr]

American politics is structured so that only two major parties can survive, and anyone who doesn't like those two just doesn't get represented. The whole point any more is to get people who aren't fanatics about the Big Two to shut up and go away.

So either the Tea Party will complete its takeover of the GOP, or the GOP will die and there will be the Tea Party, or by some miracle, the GOP will wake up, tough it out, and the Tea Party will wither.

Doesn't matter which way it goes; people who actually believe in liberty will lose.

 

[maxpowr9]

I put my money on the Republican Party imploding and being destitute for about a decade. Of course if the Democrats take the wait and see approach like they normally do (see Obama) instead of being more active and conveying how bat shit crazy the Tea Party is, the Tea Party will become the Republican Party and 'Rome' will burn to the ground.

 

[Tengilethos]

Is it really impossible for more than two parties to have power in the USA? Look at Great Britain, they have a similar political system in regards to the election of their representatives. So normally there are only the Tories and Labour. But the Liberal Democrats have managed to gain about 50 seats of Westminsters 650 Seats for 2 elections now, even though they have first-past-the-post in the UK as well.

Of course in the UK they have an independent commission to do their gerrymandering for them. And your governors and (kinda) the president are directly elected, and there are state-wide elections for the Senate. Those would primarily fall to the democrats then by default if the conservatives would split their vote? Could they band together for these elections?