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Healthcare going forward

Nevertheless, most of the 1818 losses are said to be from the repealling of the penalty. That is, from people CHOOSING no to buy insurance because they aren't forced to. And again, 9million fewer will enroll in Medicaid--again, a choice.The Liberal ideology of forcing people.
NOTICE that the CBO is not just doing accounting as we thought they should do. They are making ideological guesses of what people will do. Based on what?
And notice, that Medicaid will continue to be available.It is not like they were abandoned.

That most of the 2018 losses are from the repeal of the penalty was not in contention, I do believe I said that TWICE. The reductions in the Medicaid expansion comes later. Yes it will continue to be available but the funding will be cut and it is very unlikely the States can make up the difference except in a few cases.
 
Slowly some of the more intelligent animals started to notice the words seemed different this morning.

Before:
- All Animals are equal
- We're going to have insurance for everybody
- The government is going to pay for it
- No Animal shall drink alcohol
- No Animal shall kill any other Animal

Now:
- All Animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
- We're going to have access to insurance for everybody, if you can afford it
- The government is going to pay for a LITTLE of it
- No Animal shall drink alcohol in excess
- No Animal shall kill any other Animal without cause

Later a loud commotion was heard from the White House and the animals rushed to see and were stunned. An argument was going on but as the animals looked from face to face of the Tea Partiers, the RINOS, the DINOS and the MAGAs; it was impossible to say which was which.
 
That most of the 2018 losses are from the repeal of the penalty was not in contention, I do believe I said that TWICE. The reductions in the Medicaid expansion comes later. Yes it will continue to be available but the funding will be cut and it is very unlikely the States can make up the difference except in a few cases.

Everone is not equal. Some have to work and pay taxes while others receive the benefits without either.
 
The GOP loves to talk about the market doing better than the government. The trouble with that is they are not consistent, because what they are proposing has little to do with a free market. If they'd at least propose things that would actually make it a free market -- such as providing a way for anyone who wants to become a doctor to go to medical school, and revamping medical schools so more can succeed, etc. -- they'd at least be respectable for consistency, but at the moment they're not.
 
I also find it amusing that they can support Reagan, who essentially imposed an unfunded mandate on hospitals by requiring people to be aided regardless of ability to pay.
I already commented on this before, but I'm keeping this in, if only to get it out of my queue. But, what happens when hospitals start closing?

most of the 1818 losses...from people CHOOSING no to buy insurance because they aren't forced to.
They'll choose not to buy insurance, because they won't be able to afford it. How the hell is somebody who makes $30,000 per year [WHICH, MIND YOU, IS MORE THAN **DOUBLE** THE FEDERAL MINIMUM WAGE] supposed to come up with $14,000+ per year just for insurance at Age 64? Most jobs no longer include health insurance in the "benefits" and older pre-Medicare Americans will be WHACKED under the new plan, as premiums become even more expensive than they were in the Wild West, fend-for-yourself Darwinist days of the 2009 death panels.

Everone is not equal. Some have to work and pay taxes while others receive the benefits without either.
The hedge fund manager does no MANUAL/HARD LABOR whatsoever, and they sometimes don't pay federal income taxes at all.
 
I already commented on this before, but I'm keeping this in, if only to get it out of my queue. But, what happens when hospitals start closing?

They'll choose not to buy insurance, because they won't be able to afford it. How the hell is somebody who makes $30,000 per year [WHICH, MIND YOU, IS MORE THAN **DOUBLE** THE FEDERAL MINIMUM WAGE] supposed to come up with $14,000+ per year just for insurance at Age 64? Most jobs no longer include health insurance in the "benefits" and older pre-Medicare Americans will be WHACKED under the new plan, as premiums become even more expensive than they were in the Wild West, fend-for-yourself Darwinist days of the 2009 death panels.

The hedge fund manager does no MANUAL/HARD LABOR whatsoever, and they sometimes don't pay federal income taxes at all.

If they can afford it to avoid the Obama penalty for not buying, they can afford it when the penalty is repealed.
 
frankfrank said:
They'll choose not to buy insurance, because they won't be able to afford it. How the hell is somebody who makes $30,000 per year supposed to come up with $14,000+ per year just for insurance at Age 64?
If they can afford it to avoid the Obama penalty for not buying, they can afford it when the penalty is repealed.

Fact check:
The max uninsured penalty under ACA ($2,085) is significantly less than the current cost of premiums for a Silver plan (~$5,000) per year.

The penalty’s cost is calculated in one of two ways: You’ll either pay a percentage of your total household adjusted gross income — which you’ll figure on your annual tax return — or a flat rate, whichever is greater. Your tax return will also help you determine your penalty amount.

For tax year 2016, the penalty will rise to 2.5% of your total household adjusted gross income, or $695 per adult and $347.50 per child, to a maximum of $2,085.
Source Source Source
 
Last night everyone seemed to take their focus off the health care hocus-pocus to instead gawk at two pages of President Trump's 12-year old tax filing. I, unfortunately, was attending a National League of Cities conference and watching Paul Ryan on the Fox Business Report (he won't do any other channel for fear of being actually questioned).

The reason that health care and Medicare are being gutted under the Ryancare or Trumpcare plans is quite simple: they need the savings for what comes next. The proposed AHCA -- which is anything but American and everything but healthcare -- is designed to eliminate the nearly $1 trillion in costs to the richest in America. They, under ACA, had to pay to cover the cost of premium support for the most vulnerable -- poor, elderly, pre-existing conditions, etc. In order to mine an even richer harvest, Medicare would be capped and eventually turned into a voucher program. Take a look at Medicare and the population it serves: those with pre-existing conditions, elderly, children, poor. Those populations usually use healthcare services more than those who are young and healthy and just out of school. Do you really think insurance companies want these people? No, and most hospitals aren't that keen either because many come in sicker, require more care, have complications following treatments, and often develop other issues. In other words, you lose money on them.

The ACA was designed to provide premium assistance that would cap what this group could pay (including full subsidy) based on income. Under ACHA, that cap is removed and "free market forces" take over which means they will likely see premiums of $1200 or more per month (based on what we used to see pre-ACA). Imagine if you are making $30,000 and you now have to pay $1200 per month for insurance or eat. Which do you choose? Half your income would be going just to insurance (if you could find anyone willing to write a plan in the first place). My sister used to be in this group. She had had two heart attacks and was paying $900 per month for an "insurance" plan that did not cover any heart-related issues because it was pre-existing. It also did not cover cancer treatments yet she had a history of those as well. Pretty much if she broke a leg or arm, she might get coverage; nothing otherwise. Yes, her cost went up to $1,000 per month under ACA but it covered EVERYTHING. She bitched at first until I showed her how to apply under ACA and she ended with a $200 per month bill. She will certainly not find that "on the open market" under AHCA.

So the dirty secret is that after "saving" the rich $1 trillion with a net overall savings of $337 billion and 24 million more uninsured as well as no Medicaid -- the Republicans will turn to tax reform next! But Ryan must have those "savings" in order to complete the tax overhaul. Mind you this is but "phase I" of the tax reform proposal (the second part would include savings for anyone other than the rich or large business). Phase I cuts the corporate tax rate from its current rate of about 35% to 20%. Two important things to remember: few businesses actually pay this rate because of all the deductions they can take (GE, for instance, pays nothing despite making billions); and the Republicans want to also do this under "reconciliation."

However, in order to do tax reform, the bill needs to be "revenue neutral." If it requires raising taxes or increasing costs, it is subject to filibuster in the Senate and we know where that would go. The $337 billion "savings" is required to get the tax reform bill to neutral -- oh, and add in gutting the EPA (the proposal is to eliminate 3,000 positions, turn clean air and water over to the states for enforcement, eliminate anything related to climate change and only focus on Superfund, Brownfield initiatives, and creating jobs -- right from the EPA Secretary's mouth), gutting Department of Education, elimination of Community Development Block Grant funds, virtually neuter the Secretary of State's office and International Development (except for aid to Israel), and cut or eliminate virtually every other domestic program. The "magic dust" will also be liberally sprinkled showing that the tax reform for the richest and business along with all cuts to anyone else will explode job growth and creation and everyone will be fully employed with tax revenues flowing like manna from heaven.

The Congress can then add $64 billion to the military (which will probably be needed because we won't have any concept of diplomacy), reduce the tax rate to 15% for business, add a trillion to infrastructure (focusing on contracts and business partnerships which usually means money for the well connected), and dismantle any remaining domestic protection programs.

The last time we tried this was under Reagan and Bush II and we saw an explosion in debt and little or no growth in revenues. Who says we need to be able to breath or drink water when we can have jobs, jobs, and more jobs!
 
The other dirty little secrets under the Republican health plan is the elimination of mental health assistance and a revision of thinking on the "War on Drugs." Under ACA, the focus has been on treatment and prevention -- eliminating the need for more costly incarceration which does little except turn petty criminals into much better angry ones but with a pent up demand for everything. We are seeing an opioid epidemic in many parts of this country that is unlike anything in the past. Treatment -- particularly immediate intervention to save the life of the person -- is the most successful way to handle it and cities are scrambling to keep up.

Under AHCA, all treatment assistance would be eliminated. The Republican budget plan and DOJ has also taken steps to reverse support by the federal government for "private prisons" and "for profit jails" taken by the Obama administration. Private prisons are not cheaper and have been shown to be less safe than government-run institutions. But they make money for donors to the Republican party so lets reward them with the new "War on Drugs!"
 
Fact check:
The max uninsured penalty under ACA ($2,085) is significantly less than the current cost of premiums for a Silver plan (~$5,000) per year.

Source Source Source
Not sure what you point is. The elimination of the penalty does not make the premium higher or less. The you can afford it to avoid the penalty you can afford it without the penalty.
 
The other dirty little secrets under the Republican health plan is the elimination of mental health assistance and a revision of thinking on the "War on Drugs." Under ACA, the focus has been on treatment and prevention -- eliminating the need for more costly incarceration which does little except turn petty criminals into much better angry ones but with a pent up demand for everything. We are seeing an opioid epidemic in many parts of this country that is unlike anything in the past. Treatment -- particularly immediate intervention to save the life of the person -- is the most successful way to handle it and cities are scrambling to keep up.

Under AHCA, all treatment assistance would be eliminated. The Republican budget plan and DOJ has also taken steps to reverse support by the federal government for "private prisons" and "for profit jails" taken by the Obama administration. Private prisons are not cheaper and have been shown to be less safe than government-run institutions. But they make money for donors to the Republican party so lets reward them with the new "War on Drugs!"

You paint a very accurate and very, very dark picture in theses two posts.
 
And our Republican "friends" here want the average folks to get their pitchforks aimed at all those liberals who want to wreck America, lol... the GOP is going to ensure its own demise if they get away with all this, because in the end karma is a bitch and will tear them up. The party of "less government" is now a party almost utterly lacking in decency, empathy, compassion and a moral compass. It's bereft whether Trump leads it, or Ryan or Pence or Cruz. And it deserves to rot.
 
The good news is that Trump himself is fucked if TrumpCare passes...or it doesn't.
 
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