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Hey Americans, Good luck with that wall you're building.

bankside

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Good luck with that trade wall you're building. I see you won't be using any Canadian lumber as it goes up. Oh well! ..|
WHEN the United States and Canada first began arguing about lumber, Ronald Reagan had just taken office in Washington, DC, and Pierre Trudeau was prime minister in Ottawa. Three decades later the two countries are still at it. In January American trade officials asked a London arbitration court to penalise exports from British Columbia, Canada’s main source of lumber, for subsidies stemming from the underpricing of timber harvested from public lands.

This is an old—and unproven—claim, and such filings have sometimes led to the United States imposing countervailing duties. This time the huffing and puffing was met by a nonchalant shrug. What has changed is that for British Columbian lumbermen the United States is no longer the only game in town. Asia has become an alternative.

Read the rest of the article at The Economist

I love free trade. And I love new markets. This development makes me very happy; we've worked very hard to develop alternative markets and it is paying off. I'm glad China loves our product and that it's suitable for the growth of their economy as well.. And, oil's next! Pipeline to Prince Rupert :)
 
Trade wall? Considering that hardly anything is made in the U.S. anymore, I don't understand your point. You ever heard of something called the U.S. trade deficit?
 
Wow a 30 year argument! That's an amazing attention span!
 
I'm not too upset.

Most of the Canadian lumber companies also have bought up rights and mills etc. in the US. Can't beat 'em? Buy 'em.
 
About 20 years ago I took a trip to Alaska from Seattle via ferry. I was shocked at the extent of logging that was visible from the water in British Columbia. I always thought of the Canadians as better stewards of the land than Americans. That trip certainly disabused me of that notion. It was sad to see so much clear-cut land in areas of great, natural beauty.
 
Oh no.

Canadians are pigs.

Except that we now have to replant what we take.

So everyone only has to wait another 120 years for crap wood once all the great trees are gone.
 
Two things: starting in the first half of the 1900's, we invented this whole "fighting forest fires" thing, and interrupted a natural cycle of land clearing and renewal. Forests have grown tremendously since then. Overgrown, in some cases.

Secondly, and here's the downside of globalisation, we've been hit with a foreign pest: the pine beetle. Massive tracts of land where every tree in sight withers, turns red, and dies. You can see entire valleys like this on the drive from Edmonton to Vancouver. All of that wood has to go. It's fine for lumber, but if it just stands there it is a huge fire risk.

The point is, huge logging operations can be an indicator of greed, or they can also be an appropriate response consistent with responsible land management.
 
Two things: starting in the first half of the 1900's, we invented this whole "fighting forest fires" thing, and interrupted a natural cycle of land clearing and renewal. Forests have grown tremendously since then. Overgrown, in some cases.

Secondly, and here's the downside of globalisation, we've been hit with a foreign pest: the pine beetle. Massive tracts of land where every tree in sight withers, turns red, and dies. You can see entire valleys like this on the drive from Edmonton to Vancouver. All of that wood has to go. It's fine for lumber, but if it just stands there it is a huge fire risk.

The point is, huge logging operations can be an indicator of greed, or they can also be an appropriate response consistent with responsible land management.

According to Wikipedia, the pine beetle is native to North America. I gather the current outbreak started in the last decade. I traveled in the late 1980s, so the clear cutting I saw was not a response to the pine beetle infestation. Where there was no clear cutting, I only saw healthy trees.
 
According to Wikipedia, the pine beetle is native to North America. I gather the current outbreak started in the last decade. I traveled in the late 1980s, so the clear cutting I saw was not a response to the pine beetle infestation. Where there was no clear cutting, I only saw healthy trees.

OH! I learned something from that.. It was always reported for years as an emerging problem with "Japanese Pine Beetle." However apparently that's not the case:
http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/hfp/mountain_pine_beetle/faq.htm
http://www.mpb.cfs.nrcan.gc.ca/biology/introduction_e.html

Also, forestry practices in the 80's were not well thought out, and you saw the evidence. Since the Clayoquot Sound protests, they've tightened things up and try to replicate more natural patterns of forest growth and tree felling.

We overgrew the forests through fire fighting (thus making them susceptible to pine beetle) and then clear cut, causing erosion, loss of habitat, fugliness, etc. I think we're getting better at it - the 80's is a long time ago.

Here's a more modern operation:
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhb7XHUypJo[/ame]
 
Forestry is MUCH different than in the 80s. Things that Oregon State University School of Forestry, arguably top in the nation, have been finding through research are getting implemented -- often with more opposition from bureaucrats screaming "We've always done it this way!" than from loggers.

The way has been paved by some private companies who have followed the OSU research and implemented findings they thought looked solid. I hunted a few years back in an area where a private company had gotten two 160-acre timber sales side by side. They'd left small clusters of trees, centered around excellent examples of the species, left strips of trees in the canyon bottoms, and left other strips of tree connected so the 320-acre area was sliced into eight different pieces, following the OSU conclusion that clear cuts should be no more than 40 acres. In the areas that were cut, they burned some patches and spread seeds of native meadow plants in a couple, chipped the "slash" (all the wood left behind after dragging out logs) and spread it, made a number of piles of slash, which serve as habitat for a variety of small critters, and left a few stretches where the slash just lay as it was, simulating blow-downs. These were all separated by replanted areas, some of which were planted in alder, vine maple, and other trees which normally spring up when a section of forest is planted, and the rest of which was planted in five different species of trees (Douglas fir, white fir, western hemlock, blue spruce, western red cedar). The planting was done with seedlings of different ages. All of that was derived from OSU Forestry research papers.

For the logging roads they came up with their own thing: instead of leaving a rough rock surface, most of it 3" crushed, they spread coarse river sand over it, just enough so some rock tips were still exposed. Then they seeded it with a mix of two native clovers, a couple of well-established imported clovers, vetch, lupine... and alfalfa.

Deer and elk like clover, but they love alfalfa.
 
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