How do I get over this?

[drunkenmoron]

Hi people, I'm starting to go crazy so I thought I'd try and get some advice with this... I'll try to keep it short.

I started the final year of my course at a new uni at the beginning of October, met this guy and we hit it off instantly. We gradually started spending more and more time together, to the point where for the last month, we haven't gone more than an hour without speaking to each other.

I generally spend all day with him then either make arrangements to meet him the next day and talk to him online all evening, or he stays at my place, same bed, essentially inches away... he doesn't attempt to lay far away from me. This is happening more and more often, we flirt with each other, we tell each other everything. I'm totally in love with him... the issue is, he's got a girlfriend and is apparently 'straight', I'm in the closet, but I've never felt this way about anyone before.

He is very gay acting, from some of his mannerisms, his voice, some of his tastes and whatever. Someone asked me if he was gay while we were out, which when mentioned to him made him go crazy about it for hours. I met a girl when I was out the other night and have been texting her... he constantly brings her up in a sexual manner in almost every conversation we have, as if he's being kind of passively jealous, overcompensating for his jealousy by going OTT with the whole thing.

Essentially I'm just wondering what you guys think, whether he might be gay, whether I should try to tell him how I feel and if not, how I can get over what I'm feeling? It's driving me absolutely insane, I can't carry on like this but if I lost him, I don't know what the hell I would do... I've never had a friend like this, the guy's my soulmate

 

[Seasoned]

Welcome to the forum. If you analyze why you're in this predicament you can only come to one conclusion. You're in the closet. So, no matter what course of action you now take things might go badly for the relationship. Nonetheless, I think the best course of action is to out yourself to him. From what you describe of his reaction to being thought of as gay I don't know that your disclosure will go smoothly. Flirting with him is just going to prolong the uncertainty.

I hope you don't lose him, but unless well-being is involved or risk of incarceration possible, honesty in all relationships will generally serve you well. You'll avoid these types of crossroads.

Best wishes and good luck.

 

[looseliam]

Been there... bought the button... (and it was hot)

I would first suggest making your sexuality known. From there one can gauge his reaction and make some assumptions.

If you're keen on him, make it subtly known; compliment him, etc.

From my experience, it would seem to me he's a bit curious and with the right, safe environment he may be willing to open up. How much? I couldn't say.

(oops, I just saw seasoned got here before me - please excuse some repeat information)

 

[TurdPuncher]

oh boys! to the origional poster, you have committed the classic gay 'fuck up your life, mistep' of falling in love with someone you haven't a clue to, as to their sexuality, or more likely, that they are straight.

we've all been there, done that, have the ratty old tee shirt to prove it at least 3 or 4 times over. whats so sad is that younger gay men don't learn from our mistakes and pain, and feel the compulsioin to subject themselves to the same pain many of us went thru years ago.

the first thing you need to do is to come out as gay to him. sorry, but there is no excuse you can give us that will make it any less imperative. you're a homo, deal with it, and come out to him. more than likely he is not, but at least you've put your cards out in front of you for all to see, and for those who see, to fall in love with you.

closeted men who refuse to come out of the closet always have these kinds of relationships over and over and over again. isn't it too painful to ever deal with again? so come out of the closet. celebrate your dick loving, knob slobbing, anal pumping, sexuality, and thus get mom and dad to support you thru this tough time.

 

[MascutarHero]

Only way to find out is asking or telling who YOU really are, you just can't assume because of all those things, thats just going in the typical "gay" category.
Good Luck with any decision you make

 

[KaraBulut]

This is happening more and more often, we flirt with each other, we tell each other everything. I'm totally in love with him... the issue is, he's got a girlfriend and is apparently 'straight', I'm in the closet, but I've never felt this way about anyone before.

There's a lot of stories like yours on the forum- a closeted guy lusting after a close straight friend who is not completely available.

The only way to get to the honesty of your friend's situation is to start dealing with the dishonesty of your own situation.

That means coming out. To yourself. To your friends, including him.

But don't do it in hopes of getting with your friend. Do it to stop the deceptions and to have a normal life.

 

[drunkenmoron]

Thanks for all your replies,

I'm really not in a good place to be coming out to anyone right now. This guy's my only friend down here... I don't think he'd end the friendship if I came out to him, but I don't want him to feel like he can't stay at mine after we go out, or that we can't do the things we enjoy as 'straight guys' (working out together, playfighting etc.)

I've actually come out before when I was 15 to my step-sister's boyfriend who I really liked, and also thought was gay. He'd kissed a guy in a club before and after telling him, he told my sister and she arranged for us to kiss eachother so I could find out how I felt, which looking back on it was weird on his part. I couldn't go through with it, I went back in the closet and let it be forgotten as teenage curiosity.

I basically completely cut ties with people who may find out something embarrassing about me, or something I'd otherwise rather they didn't know. I move around the country constantly for a 'fresh start', I haven't felt truly happy in probably 3 years and not for a very long time before that... when I spend time with this guy, I feel really happy, but time apart from him kills me inside.

I can't come out. I'm looking for a way to get past these feelings to make our relationship a healthy one and allow me to be happy again.

The issue is, I find myself slipping up on stuff. Today he told me he 'can't be held responsible for what he does when he's drunk'. I replied saying 'I'll keep that in mind', he questioned what I meant a few times and I just told him 'next time I smack you in the mouth when we're pissed (this has happened once or twice) I won't need to apologize, because I wouldn't be responsible'. I'm not sure if alarm bells rang in his head or what, but I can't just come out with things like that... I've generally been great at keeping everything closeted, but I just blurt stuff out to this guy.

 

[Ganoderma]

hi Drunkenmoron,

First of all, welcome to JUB and feel free to ask as many questions you like. Quite a lot of people over here are able to give you their insights and ideas about what you should do. People are different, and its therefore likely that opinions / advice offered here will also not equal.

That being said, I agree with the others. You must tell this friend that you are gay, as this current friendship leads to a dead end.

I would like to tell you that you are right now lying to him, and lying to such a good friend is never a good idea. So tell him, or otherwise this friendship will end soon. I feel very sorry to tell this to you.

Would you mind to tell us a bit more about reasons why a uni student like you (apparently not living anymore together with your parents?) is not able to tell his best friend that he is gay?

What's that for uni? Are there only homophobe students / staff? Excuse me very much, but I don't see the point why you should stay in the closet.

Are you 100% sure that no one at that uni (and around) has never thought about your sexual orientation? Hey man, you don't have a girlfriend, you are 20+, you have a close friend with whom you behave 'gayish'. Are there no girls around you? Girls tend to think (and to Talk) about this kind of issues. "Drunkenmoron is gay, yeah, I am sure of that, because..."

Im 55, so way older then you, but there are loads of guys over here of around your age who will be able to tell you that staying in the closet really sucks.

So tell your friend, he has the moral right to know, and then you can see how he reacts.

This guy has a girlfriend, and guys with a girlfriends are assumed to be straight, unless they have told you something else. So 'gay behaviour' [whatever that means] does not count.

Are you 100% sure

Would you like to have such a good friend who was hiding / lying about such an important part of him? Do you think that's good / honest?

Best wishes, and feel free to ask people over here for advice.

I know very well you must take some tough steps, but its the only way to solve some of your issues.

 

[drunkenmoron]

hi Drunkenmoron,

First of all, welcome to JUB and feel free to ask as many questions you like. Quite a lot of people over here are able to give you their insights and ideas about what you should do. People are different, and its therefore likely that opinions / advice offered here will also not equal.

That being said, I agree with the others. You must tell this friend that you are gay, as this current friendship leads to a dead end.

I would like to tell you that you are right now lying to him, and lying to such a good friend is never a good idea. So tell him, or otherwise this friendship will end soon. I feel very sorry to tell this to you.

Would you mind to tell us a bit more about reasons why a uni student like you (apparently not living anymore together with your parents?) is not able to tell his best friend that he is gay?

What's that for uni? Are there only homophobe students / staff? Excuse me very much, but I don't see the point why you should stay in the closet.

Are you 100% sure that no one at that uni (and around) has never thought about your sexual orientation? Hey man, you don't have a girlfriend, you are 20+, you have a close friend with whom you behave 'gayish'. Are there no girls around you? Girls tend to think (and to Talk) about this kind of issues. "Drunkenmoron is gay, yeah, I am sure of that, because..."

Im 55, so way older then you, but there are loads of guys over here of around your age who will be able to tell you that staying in the closet really sucks.

So tell your friend, he has the moral right to know, and then you can see how he reacts.

This guy has a girlfriend, and guys with a girlfriends are assumed to be straight, unless they have told you something else. So 'gay behaviour' [whatever that means] does not count.

Are you 100% sure

Would you like to have such a good friend who was hiding / lying about such an important part of him? Do you think that's good / honest?

Best wishes, and feel free to ask people over here for advice.

I know very well you must take some tough steps, but its the only way to solve some of your issues.

Thanks for the reply.

You've really gone and put the fear of God in me with that post... I wanna start by saying that I don't agree that it's anyone's business to know my sexual orientation. In my opinion, anything to do with sex is up to the individual whether or not to share with anyone else. I mean, would you tell someone who has a certain sexual fetish that they have to share it with their friends or else they're lying to them?

I haven't lived with my parents for several years and now live on the other side of the country from all my family... I'm probably gonna stay here permanently. I don't know of any particularly homophobic students or staff, my family would all be more than OK with it as well, I don't spend any time around women other than when I'm out.

To answer your first question about why I wont come out of the closet is incredibly difficult. I'll just say that I've got a lot of psychological issues which I'm finally going to hopefully be getting help with, the main thing being a constant uncertainty about myself and what others think of me (constantly questioning everything I do or say, detachment from reality, paranoia, zero self-esteem, anxiety.) If I had to deal with any kind of extra stress about what others think of me and me of myself, I'm not sure I'd be able to handle it... it'd put me in a really bad place for a really long time, it's something I couldn't run away from if I wanted to.

As to whether nobody around me has questioned my orientation, I'd say it's more than likely the guy I'm talking about has, but he's probably the only person. I don't hang around girls, but I generally end up pulling a girl every time we go out drinking. I'm in touch with the last girl I met, texting and whatnot, which has completely screwed me over because I can't get rid of her. She's here for 3 years and I'm bound to bump into her next time I go out, obviously my friends will start wondering why I never hooked up with her, but the guy I'm talking about knows about a lot of my issues so could possibly understand it.

Finally, I couldn't care less if a friend was hiding anything about their sexuality from me, but because I'm hiding something myself, I can't really predict how he'd feel. In a way I wish I'd come down here and been openly gay, but I've got my own prejudices against certain gay people - generally the really obviously campy gay ones - that I couldn't blame anyone else for sharing. Like I said in my previous post, If this guy is straight, I don't want him to feel like he can't keep our relationship exactly the way it is right now. I'm willing to bet this would change if he knew.

I don't mean to come across as confrontational, I just thought I'd make it clear where my head is.

 

[Ganoderma]

hi Drunkenmoron,

Thanks for your extensive and quick reply. No need to worry that your posting might be confrontational towards me, because that's not the case. No way, and I am here in order to try and help you.

I like this kind of extensive replies, as they provide me (and likely others as well) with a much better insight in the real 'drunkenmoron'.

Yeah, so it seems I have some good points.

Your sexual orientation has nothing to do what you are doing with a person.

So you are totally right that it's no one's business if you are top or bottom, if you like anal sex, or not at all, how often you have sex, if you like to have sex with toys (like dido's), and whatever. This means that you have a point in regard to 'a certain sexual fetish'.

But you don't have a point when it comes to the sexual orientation of people: so gay or straight or anything in between (bi, bi curious or whatever).

Please be aware that straight guys with a girlfriend, and guys who marry with a girl 'announce' many times a day that they are straight. Same like your good friend: he is straight (1) because he has a girlfriend, and (2) because he even told you he was straight.

I mean, you don't need to walk around with a cap with an inscripion on top 'I am gay'. That's not how is works. So you don't need to let the world know that you are gay.

But you will need to tell your friend, as your current relation with him is so tight (well, you sleep in the same bed, you have severe problems when you have not talked with each other for an hour or so) that not telling him is awkward (and a ly). You have not provided me good evidence that you don't ly to him.

And how about these girls you meet when you are with him. Hey man, these girls wanna date you / dance with you / talk with you etc, so, apparently, -some- girls like you. Hey man, but you are always with that guy, and when a girl is trying to get contact with you, she will notice that you don't react on her sweet smiles (or whatever). But she will definately see that you smile sweet (etc.) to your close friend. Hey man, girls are aware of that, and you definately show such kind of behaviour.

Well, just tell this girl 'She's here for 3 years and I'm bound to bump into her next time I go out' the truth. 'I like you very much, but I am gay, so we can only be casual friends of each other'. Then she knows the real reason.

Well, and likely she will talk to other girls, and then the news will go around. And you are out, and you don't need to bother anymore.

No need to fear for homophobes because they are not around. And maybe you will then be noticed by a sweet gay.

So how about this scenario?

Excuse me very much, but I am not familiar with your other issues. Apparently, your good friends (and several girls as well?) like you, so please don't think too much about what others think about you.

Best wishes and good luck, and please keep informing us about your situation.

 

[warrenxx]

I don't know what advice to give you. He certainly seems to be sending out a lot of positive messages and the huge amount of time spent together would appear to go

beyond normal friendship. However, when you are in that predicament it is very easy to misread the situation. I fell for a guy big time and it got to the stage whereby

I either cooled things off and gradually distanced myself or I told him how I felt. Doing nothing became unbearable.I decided to be brave and told him. I wish I could

say it all ended happily but it didn't. It was instant rejection and he made sure he texted everbody we knew in order to tell them what had happened. I was in the

closet at the time and was outed in spectacular style. The fact he seemed to take great relish (purely my perception?) in doing so twisted the knife still further. It

was a turbulent time for me,that I still don't think, several years down the line, I have properly recovered from. I held a torch to him for years afterwards and the

love I felt never waned. It is a sad reflection on me, but unfortunately you can not turn it off. The moment I told him was the instant it ended. Beyond saying he was

flattered but not interested and not that way inclined, he never actually spoke to me again. I am sure what I felt was not entirely unreciprocated. I am convinced I

couldn't have been so blind. Nobody likes to think of themselves as that stupid! People close to him have hinted that he wasn't as straight as he proclaimed. Which

makes what he did even worse. However, this could have just been an opportunity for people to stir things and get back at him for a grievance they had against him. It

is very difficult to know what is the real truth when you are caught up in such a whirlwind. All I can tell you is what happened and that it absolutely devasted me. If

the guy you have fallen for is closeted like the guy I fell for, may have been, then he too could react in the same way and sacrafice you to save himself. If he is

straight and you tell him your gay he maybe accepting. Telling him you love him is a step too far for most straight guys no matter how liberal. It is a whole different

ball game and you can guarantee they will run a mile and the friendship will never be the same.
You are in a terrible situation and it's a horrible place to be. I truly feel for you. Be careful and I hope what you decide turns out for the best for you. I really

wouldn't want you to go through what I did. If you ask me would I do the same thing again then the answer would be no. I don't trust my own judgement anymore. I think

this time I would just walk away. The pain is intense either way. I just wish there was more happy ever afters.

 

[burke67]

To answer your first question about why I wont come out of the closet is incredibly difficult. I'll just say that I've got a lot of psychological issues which I'm finally going to hopefully be getting help with, the main thing being a constant uncertainty about myself and what others think of me (constantly questioning everything I do or say, detachment from reality, paranoia, zero self-esteem, anxiety.) If I had to deal with any kind of extra stress about what others think of me and me of myself, I'm not sure I'd be able to handle it... it'd put me in a really bad place for a really long time, it's something I couldn't run away from if I wanted to.

I realize this thread began with you and your friend's relationship. It's moved beyond that as you've elaborated more in your responses. Here's hoping posting here and getting responses will help you help yourself.

I'll not say the emphasised portion in the above quote is entirely related to you being in the closet... though it would explain quite a bit of it.

Geographical moves will never solve anything. You can't run away from your head. "Starting fresh" without having accepted yourself is simply a "rinse and repeat" exercise.

It's great to hear you're pursuing therapy of some sort related to you current mindset.

Burke

P.S. Apologies if this comes over as too blunt! I do feel for you and the situation you find yourself in. I've been there, and I know I don't want you to be there either.

 

[drunkenmoron]

hi Drunkenmoron,

Thanks for your extensive and quick reply. No need to worry that your posting might be confrontational towards me, because that's not the case. No way, and I am here in order to try and help you.

I like this kind of extensive replies, as they provide me (and likely others as well) with a much better insight in the real 'drunkenmoron'.

Yeah, so it seems I have some good points.

Your sexual orientation has nothing to do what you are doing with a person.

So you are totally right that it's no one's business if you are top or bottom, if you like anal sex, or not at all, how often you have sex, if you like to have sex with toys (like dido's), and whatever. This means that you have a point in regard to 'a certain sexual fetish'.

But you don't have a point when it comes to the sexual orientation of people: so gay or straight or anything in between (bi, bi curious or whatever).

Please be aware that straight guys with a girlfriend, and guys who marry with a girl 'announce' many times a day that they are straight. Same like your good friend: he is straight (1) because he has a girlfriend, and (2) because he even told you he was straight.

I mean, you don't need to walk around with a cap with an inscripion on top 'I am gay'. That's not how is works. So you don't need to let the world know that you are gay.

But you will need to tell your friend, as your current relation with him is so tight (well, you sleep in the same bed, you have severe problems when you have not talked with each other for an hour or so) that not telling him is awkward (and a ly). You have not provided me good evidence that you don't ly to him.

And how about these girls you meet when you are with him. Hey man, these girls wanna date you / dance with you / talk with you etc, so, apparently, -some- girls like you. Hey man, but you are always with that guy, and when a girl is trying to get contact with you, she will notice that you don't react on her sweet smiles (or whatever). But she will definately see that you smile sweet (etc.) to your close friend. Hey man, girls are aware of that, and you definately show such kind of behaviour.

Well, just tell this girl 'She's here for 3 years and I'm bound to bump into her next time I go out' the truth. 'I like you very much, but I am gay, so we can only be casual friends of each other'. Then she knows the real reason.

Well, and likely she will talk to other girls, and then the news will go around. And you are out, and you don't need to bother anymore.

No need to fear for homophobes because they are not around. And maybe you will then be noticed by a sweet gay.

So how about this scenario?

Excuse me very much, but I am not familiar with your other issues. Apparently, your good friends (and several girls as well?) like you, so please don't think too much about what others think about you.

Best wishes and good luck, and please keep informing us about your situation.

Thanks,

I understand what you're saying, and I do regret not literally turning round and telling people I'm into guys when they mentioned women to me when I first started making friends, but first impressions mean a lot and I didn't want to separate myself from everyone else on my course (all guys) because I happen to be gay. I don't want guys to assume I'm not like them over something that in the grand scheme of things should make very little difference to the way people perceive me. Given my other issues though, I just couldn't do it.

I do lie to my friend, yes, but it feels a little late now to do anything about it unless something spontaneously happens between us. I can't lose the closest friend I've ever had... I want my feelings for him to disappear so I can have an awesome friendship with him, but obviously it's not that simple. I don't want him to think I've been letting him stay round for my 'sick pleasure', because that's not the reason at all.

Just to explain a few more of the reasons why I think he's probably gay - without meaning to generalize or cause offense - he told me he's never got on with guys and all his best friends have been women. To add to the 'him going crazy about being called gay' thing, it wasn't that he was putting down gay people, it was that he was frustrated that someone thought he was gay because he used to get bullied for it all the time when he was younger, as did I. More recently, he keeps bringing sexual innuendo into our online conversations. He told me to 'fap' when I told him I was bored and often brings up what I'd be doing sexually with this girl, tonight he was messing around and called me something, I told him 'you wait til tomorrow' and he replied with something about me 'splurting on his face' .

I don't mean to ramble, but we were at a bar the other night getting our usual shots. I usually tip the barman/woman after my first drink because it makes them serve me before everyone else the next time. Anyway, the next morning he tells me he thinks the guy behind the bar was gay and was flirting with me. Later that evening he brought it up again, and tried to make out like I was flirting with him (I wasn't) I said 'if he was then I feel flattered', he replied with something like 'that's gay, I'm not sleeping in bed with you tonight' (jokingly) then happily jumped straight in bed with me later.

As for these girls noticing things, we're not so obviously close when we're out. Yes we spend all our time together and when we go on a night out it's always me and him, but I don't think anyone would misinterpret that as anything more than a close friendship... at least, it hasn't affected girls approaching me and the only person who's sexuality's been questioned by people is his.

I'm not gonna turn around and tell this girl I'm gay. It'd be a bad idea for a lot of reasons and if I was to come out, it wouldn't be to some random bird I happened to spend a night snogging

I'm hoping counselling might sort some of this stuff out, but I also think there may be a chance something might happen between us... it's just destroying me at the moment so something needs doing.

 

[drunkenmoron]

(snipped)

Thanks for replying, I'm sorry to hear things turned out so badly between you and your friend. I understand how easy it is to read into the smallest things when you really like someone, it happened to me before and very nearly ruined a lot of relationships with people. It's insane how powerful something like this can be though, I've never been as hung up as I am now.

I understand what you're saying, but I would really hate to just walk away. This guy is an amazing friend, I've told him things I'd never even think of telling my family - and I'm really close with my sisters. I don't wanna lose this guy and if I did, I'd not only have to drop out of uni, but It'd probably completely destroy me. I've been through too much to be pushed any further... he's essentially the only thing in my life right now that's keeping me afloat.

If I was to come out to him, I wouldn't tell him my feelings for him at all. I'd tell him I like guys, but that I know he's straight and have never had an alterior motive for anything, he's my best friend and I'd hate for him to think differently about anything because of something that shouldn't affect our friendship at all. Trouble is, the risk is still there, even though I'm pretty sure he's in a similar position to me... just that I don't think his mind is.

 

[drunkenmoron]

I realize this thread began with you and your friend's relationship. It's moved beyond that as you've elaborated more in your responses. Here's hoping posting here and getting responses will help you help yourself.

I'll not say the emphasised portion in the above quote is entirely related to you being in the closet... though it would explain quite a bit of it.

Geographical moves will never solve anything. You can't run away from your head. "Starting fresh" without having accepted yourself is simply a "rinse and repeat" exercise.

It's great to hear you're pursuing therapy of some sort related to you current mindset.

Burke

P.S. Apologies if this comes over as too blunt! I do feel for you and the situation you find yourself in. I've been there, and I know I don't want you to be there either.

That doesn't come across as too blunt at all, the reason I even looked into counselling was because I posted on another forum about this issue with my friend when it first started out and it gradually became more about my psychological issues than anything. All posters there advised me to do it, but given my previous history of detaching myself from anyone who knows my flaws, I'm not sure how well it's gonna go.

The kind of desperation I'm feeling for human contact is something I haven't mentioned here. I hadn't cried in over 4 years until I moved down here and met this guy. After a few drinking sessions and him crying on my shoulder, I ended up doing the same a few times after I drunk too much, then I spent a night in which our conversation ended kind of abruptly crying constantly. It sounds pathetic, but I just feel like I need a hug a lot of the time, I haven't had any real affection from anyone in my life for a long time. The last time I did was last year when I slept with this girl a few times. I actually really liked her and could see myself in a relationship with her, but for some reason I couldn't persue it. I think there are more issues than sexuality, it's more of a crippling fear of not being good enough for someone. I couldn't see myself being with anyone, ever... until I met this guy.

 

[Ganoderma]

hi Drunkenmoron,

Thanks alot for your nice and friendly reply and I really feel very sorry about your situation.

I agree with others that it seems likely that you need some professional counselling to cope with your mental problems. Isn't there some couselling offered at your uni? Maybe you should make an appointment with a student counsellor? I tend to give you the advice that you don't wait too long to make such an appointment.

You told me:

I do lie to my friend, yes, but it feels a little late now to do anything about it unless something spontaneously happens between us. I can't lose the closest friend I've ever had... I want my feelings for him to disappear so I can have an awesome friendship with him, but obviously it's not that simple. I don't want him to think I've been letting him stay round for my 'sick pleasure', because that's not the reason at all.

And you told me:

It's just destroying me at the moment so something needs doing.

I would like to tell you that you must make a choice between:

(1): a continuation (=not telling him you are gay) of the current situation soon leading to the end of your frienship with him. That's 100% sure.

I told you before that both of you are walking along a road with a dead end. And the dead end is very nearby. So better stop now. Tell your friend that you are unable to be his friend anymore. You don't need to provide him with any reason. That's the end of the friendship with him, and you will not hurt him. He can go on with his life (and with his girlfriend).

(2): tell him ASAP that you are gay. I cannot predict what will happen. There are 3 possibilities:

(a) see http://www.justusboys.com/forum/showthread.php?t=351718 ("I finally told him I was gay this past Sunday and I could not be more thrilled with his response. He said I am who I am and nobody can change that and he said he will always treat me the same and that he was happy that I put my trust in him.")

(b): he cannot cope with this situation, see the reply of warrenxx ("I decided to be brave and told him. I wish I could say it all ended happily but it didn't. All I can tell you is what happened and that it absolutely devasted me. If the guy you have fallen for is closeted like the guy I fell for, may have been, then he too could react in the same way and sacrafice you to save himself.")

(c): anything between (a) and (b).

So up to you to decide what to do. You will loose your friend when you choose for option (1), and you might keep a very good friend when you choose for option (2).

But you have to do it now / ASAP, as It's just destroying me at the moment so something needs doing. You want to have an awsome friendship with him, but that's simply not possible within the current situation. I feel very sorry to tell this to you, but that's just the truth.


You told me as well:

but first impressions mean a lot and I didn't want to separate myself from everyone else on my course (all guys) because I happen to be gay. I don't want guys to assume I'm not like them over something that in the grand scheme of things should make very little difference to the way people perceive me. Given my other issues though, I just couldn't do it.

Excuse me very much, but I am not very satisfied with this reply. I mean, you don't walk around with a cap with an inscription 'I am straight', so why should people think you are straight when they get to know you? You are a guy, you are one of the fellow-students.

Why should you be separated from 'the other guys' at your uni? You told me the staight ones are no homophobes, so why should they bother? Straight guys who are comfortable about their own sexual orientation don't bother. Hey man, how many male students are on that uni? At least around 5 or so of every 100 male students will be not straight, but gay.

I mean, you don't need to change your behaviour (or what so ever) towards all other people on the uni when they know you are gay. Why should you? Who has told that you should change your behaviour (or clothes, or whatever) when its obvious that you are gay? Excuse me very much, but such rules don't exist.

So excuse me very much, but you don't have provided me with good arguments why it should not be -more or less- known that you are gay.

You told me:

I said 'if he was then I feel flattered', he replied with something like 'that's gay, I'm not sleeping in bed with you tonight' (jokingly) then happily jumped straight in bed with me later.

So this guy has a girlfriend, has told you that he is straight, and does not sleep in one bed with his girlfriend??? Why does he want to sleep in one bed with you? Why?

Hey man, touch him the next night on his arms / legs / head / breast and say to him 'hey u r a nice guy, why don't you sleep in one bed with your girlfriend?', and see how he reacts.

You told me:

As for these girls noticing things, we're not so obviously close when we're out. Yes we spend all our time together and when we go on a night out it's always me and him, but I don't think anyone would misinterpret that as anything more than a close friendship... at least, it hasn't affected girls approaching me and the only person who's sexuality's been questioned by people is his.

Girls don't need to tell you / shout at you that you are -likely- gay, but that does not mean that they might be very well aware about your real sexual orientation. Quite a few girls (but not all of them) have a rather good gaydar, and I tend to think that their gaydar (=gayradar) has already detected you. So they will not tell you (why should they?, please provide me a good reason why girls should tell you that you are gay), but they will know / have ideas / assumptions.

One of your very sweet smiles towards him in a split of a second is more then enough to be detected by a gaydar of females in the above situation.

 

[drunkenmoron]

hi Drunkenmoron,

Thanks alot for your nice and friendly reply and I really feel very sorry about your situation.

I agree with others that it seems likely that you need some professional counselling to cope with your mental problems. Isn't there some couselling offered at your uni? Maybe you should make an appointment with a student counsellor? I tend to give you the advice that you don't wait too long to make such an appointment.

You told me:

And you told me: I would like to tell you that you must make a choice between:

(1): a continuation (=not telling him you are gay) of the current situation soon leading to the end of your frienship with him. That's 100% sure.

I told you before that both of you are walking along a road with a dead end. And the dead end is very nearby. So better stop now. Tell your friend that you are unable to be his friend anymore. You don't need to provide him with any reason. That's the end of the friendship with him, and you will not hurt him. He can go on with his life (and with his girlfriend).

(2): tell him ASAP that you are gay. I cannot predict what will happen. There are 3 possibilities:

(a) see /snipped/("I finally told him I was gay this past Sunday and I could not be more thrilled with his response. He said I am who I am and nobody can change that and he said he will always treat me the same and that he was happy that I put my trust in him.")

(b): he cannot cope with this situation, see the reply of warrenxx ("I decided to be brave and told him. I wish I could say it all ended happily but it didn't. All I can tell you is what happened and that it absolutely devasted me. If the guy you have fallen for is closeted like the guy I fell for, may have been, then he too could react in the same way and sacrafice you to save himself.")

(c): anything between (a) and (b).

So up to you to decide what to do. You will loose your friend when you choose for option (1), and you might keep a very good friend when you choose for option (2).

But you have to do it now / ASAP, as It's just destroying me at the moment so something needs doing. You want to have an awsome friendship with him, but that's simply not possible within the current situation. I feel very sorry to tell this to you, but that's just the truth.


You told me as well:
Excuse me very much, but I am not very satisfied with this reply. I mean, you don't walk around with a cap with an inscription 'I am straight', so why should people think you are straight when they get to know you? You are a guy, you are one of the fellow-students.

Why should you be separated from 'the other guys' at your uni? You told me the staight ones are no homophobes, so why should they bother? Straight guys who are comfortable about their own sexual orientation don't bother. Hey man, how many male students are on that uni? At least around 5 or so of every 100 male students will be not straight, but gay.

I mean, you don't need to change your behaviour (or what so ever) towards all other people on the uni when they know you are gay. Why should you? Who has told that you should change your behaviour (or clothes, or whatever) when its obvious that you are gay? Excuse me very much, but such rules don't exist.

So excuse me very much, but you don't have provided me with good arguments why it should not be -more or less- known that you are gay.

You told me:
So this guy has a girlfriend, has told you that he is straight, and does not sleep in one bed with his girlfriend??? Why does he want to sleep in one bed with you? Why?

Hey man, touch him the next night on his arms / legs / head / breast and say to him 'hey u r a nice guy, why don't you sleep in one bed with your girlfriend?', and see how he reacts.

You told me: Girls don't need to tell you / shout at you that you are -likely- gay, but that does not mean that they might be very well aware about your real sexual orientation. Quite a few girls (but not all of them) have a rather good gaydar, and I tend to think that their gaydar (=gayradar) has already detected you. So they will not tell you (why should they?, please provide me a good reason why girls should tell you that you are gay), but they will know / have ideas / assumptions.

One of your very sweet smiles towards him in a split of a second is more then enough to be detected by a gaydar of females in the above situation.

Thanks for another thorough reply

I set up an appointment to speak to a counsellor at uni a few weeks back, I go there next week, so hopefully I can start talking through some of this stuff, depending on how it goes.

As to there being 2 choices to make, I'm not sure how right you are on the first point. I'm sure a lot of guys who go through this manage to get over it with their friendship intact without coming out. I myself have felt similar to this twice before, the first time it happened, I told the guy but we buried it as teenage curiosity and the feelings quickly faded. The 2nd time it happened was actually with an openly gay guy who I flirted with a lot and couldn't stop thinking about... I didn't tell him anything and my attraction to him went away after a few weeks.

The only difference with this guy is that the feeling's a lot more intense, I see him 24/7, and there's a lot going on here that probably isn't part of a normal 'straight' relationship. I don't know if I agree that this relationship is doomed if I don't come out to him, I could just need time for things to get better. Then again, they could also get worse.

On your 2nd point, I think there's a 4th possibility, which is that he feels the same way about me and the relationship moves up a level. In no way am I banking on this right now because there are a lots of ifs and buts, but it's possible.

I understand your dissatisfaction with what I said about when I started uni, this is purely me telling you how I feel in my head. I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying how I feel and felt at the time. I'm not saying I'd change my behaviour at all, I'd be exactly the guy I am now, but it's whether they'd change their behaviour towards me. Not because they'd be homophobic or anything, but because they might feel less comfortable around me. It's the same in a sense to straight guys' friendships with women. I don't come across that a lot, of course in that situation the attraction can go both ways.

I may not have provided you with 'good arguments' as to why I can't come out, all I can say is that it's not the right time or place to be doing it, especially with my head where it's at right now. It could completely destroy me, in fact I see it going that way were I to do it. I need to resolve some of my issues before even considering it, that's all I can say.

Yeah the guy has a girlfriend but we're at uni and she isn't, so he only sees her for a few days each month. The rest of his time is spent with me/talking to me.

I know girls don't need to tell me if they think I'm gay, but I honestly don't think I give off that impression. Me and this guy are constantly glancing at each other, staring into each others eyes or smirking at each other... if people pick up on that and think we're a couple/gay, I honestly couldn't care less.

I think his problem is that until he came to uni he'd spent his whole life on a farm outside a small village in which everyone knows each others business. His dad's quite an old guy who used to be a farmer. He's very old fashioned and wouldn't approve of his son if he was gay. He actually told me that he completely changed his accent when he went to college because people wouldn't take him seriously talking how he did... except the way he talks sounds really gay in certain situations (talking to his girlfriend/housemates, talking on the phone, talking to people in shops) and often sounds really 'whiny' outside those situations too.

I'm pretty convinced he's in the closet, it's just how deep in the closet he is and how much he's willing to open up to me that'll determine whether we ever have a romantic relationship. If things never go further then they are now, I need to get over this before June next year... I'm supposed to be getting a flat with him and his girlfriend

 

[burke67]

DM,

You, yourself, know you're not "relationship" material at the moment. Perhaps, for now, maintain the platonic friendship with your bud. Do not exacerbate your current mental confusion by coming out or on to him.

As to your upcoming counselling...

Do you plan on stating to said counsellor that you are gay?

I, for one, would. Without that particular piece of information being out and in the open I can foresee you and the counsellor running in circles around each other. The counsellor needs this insight into you in order for him to provide the help you need to help yourself.

Cheers,

B

 

[syoBsUtsuJ]

When I was in college, I worked at a Denny's for a spell as a waiter. David was a cook there and going to another university, so we barely had any interaction whatsoever, but he was just too gorgeous to be denied.

I invited him to drinks one night that our fluctuating schedules allowed us a night off together. He knew I am gay, so he was vocal about not going to gay bar. We hit a trendy bar downtown, and while he was playing darts, I struck up a conversation with a pretty girl. I went to the rest room, and when I came back, that girl was telling Dave, "Get the F away from you flaming queen!"

Dave went on and on and on about that for the rest of the night, even after a different bar. When we got back to his place, I finally told him, "Methinks thou doth protest too much." I told him, "You're either repressed gay, or at the very least a bisexual in denial." Long story shorter, we exchanged blow jobs that night!

 

[drunkenmoron]

DM,

You, yourself, know you're not "relationship" material at the moment. Perhaps, for now, maintain the platonic friendship with your bud. Do not exacerbate your current mental confusion by coming out or on to him.

As to your upcoming counselling...

Do you plan on stating to said counsellor that you are gay?

I, for one, would. Without that particular piece of information being out and in the open I can foresee you and the counsellor running in circles around each other. The counsellor needs this insight into you in order for him to provide the help you need to help yourself.

Cheers,

B

I think you may be right there man, I'm gonna do my best to lay off him unless he instigates something. For now, it'd probably be best for me to think of him as completely straight so I don't say anything stupid until I'm getting help. It's easier said than done though, especially when all the signs are staring me in the face.

Yeah, I'm gonna try and tell her in my first session... I mean, I intend to discuss this whole dilemma with her so I guess I'm gonna have to. I've never uttered the words 'I'm gay' before, it's easier for me to say 'I'm into guys' for some reason. I'm really not looking forward to getting upset in the office, but I know that's what gonna happen as soon as I open my mouth