How do you feel about kids coming out at a young age?

[RobinGoodfellow]

Emphasis mine... RG, it sounds like you're saying that being gay is a bad thing, that you will be ruined for life if you come out as gay, that if you grow and develop in a different way afterward you won't be able to shake the terrible stigma of gayitude.

Clarifying what I meant, then:

No, I'm not saying by any stretch that being gay is a bad thing. How you managed to read that into it is beyond me. Admittedly waiting until 21 may seem like a long time,but I was looking for an arbitrary age when most people have it together, and have been "them" long enough to know who they are, and to have made the realization that they are in fact gay, and not just some variant of the teenage crush, be it infatuation, hero worship, or something else.

Part of my consideration here is that there seems to be a lot of boys that become straight later on; in other words, they had a gay part of their life, and now that's over with. If we're looking at that everyone's sexuality should be a matter for that individual's choice, and we're going to allow for men that were straight but are now gay (and I'm not talking closet cases here), then I see no reason not to allow for the other direction, so to speak. Just pointing out that what we know at 13 isn't necessarily what we know at, say, 18, is all...In short, I think that it's entirely possible to be a gay teenager, but to grow out of that, and that's perfectly natural, allowing for a certain fluid sexuality.

My other consideration is that being a teenager allows you the liberty of making certain mistakes and not having to live with the repercussions afterward. Not saying that being gay is a mistake, but that there is a certain advantage in being a teenage homosexual that an adult homosexual doesn't have; the teenager may have to deal with a few harsh glares for a while, but the adult is going to have to deal with a whole range of responses. Not saying that the teenager is immune from beatings, but I am saying that a certain amount of experimentation is allowed, and a gay teenager should allow himself that aegis for a little while. Sure, it's lying, but even straight teenagers lie about their sexuality in both directions (they tell their friends that they're doing it all the time and act like complete virgins around the parents), so that just makes you fit in.

So what I'm saying is hold off, but not too long. There's a lot of issues to deal with, and a teenager may not be able to deal with them. Also, if you come out too young, you might not be taken seriously, or be forced into a sexuality that isn't you in a few years. You should be allowed your own sexuality, not one that's forced, either way. [Read: Gay not bad, but it is if it's not who you really are, and the same applies for being straight.]

RG

 

[DeMazy]

its gonna be hard to get an objective answer to this question. Alot of guys are gonna sugges the age at which they came out, those who regret coming out too late will suggest an earlier age, and those who regret coming out too young will....well you get the picture

 

[Swellegant]

I still think some of y'all are considering that gays should have to hide for their own safety because being gay is dangerous, and I just don't see it that way: bigots and assholes are dangerous, gay isn't.

I guess I just feel that it's a goddamned motherfucking criminal shame that young men and women ever have to be in a closet. That's fucked up. It shouldn't be allowed in a society that supposedly values its children.

Straight kids have their problems, too, but they aren't forced to tell anyone, to announce at any age, what gender they find sexually attractive. It's fucking unfair that we're made to do so.

What I want to see is a world where nobody ever has to come out because it's just an orientation and not a big deal. And I think we're working towards that, and I hope my niece's and nephew's future children will be able to live in that world.

But we live in this world, and I concede that I don't understand the coming-out thing, flamboyant fairies like me never actually have to come out, and I don't have a very realistic and pragmatic view of what it's like. So I'll let you all be the judge of when a kid should come out.

Anyway, luminum has challenged my thinking, and I'm going to start putting my energy into finding out how we can all help the LGBT youth of the world. In this world they have to be our children if their families and societies reject them.

Makes me want to go out and kill some bigot motherfuckers, though... you know?

 

[gmoney]

its gonna be hard to get an objective answer to this question. Alot of guys are gonna sugges the age at which they came out, those who regret coming out too late will suggest an earlier age, and those who regret coming out too young will....well you get the picture

What you say makes sense.

I'm one who didn't come out 'til my early 40's.

Society has become much more accepting (in general) then when I was a teenager.

It's because of that, that I thought I had some kind of 'disease' that needed to be cured when I was younger.

I think I'd have been much happier if I could have been 'just me' back then.

We still have a long way to go, but I think being able to come out in your teenage years, or even early twenties is much less traumatic than feeling ashamed for what you are and hiding it until you finally see this is how you are wired, and not something you wish would just 'go away'.

 

[Kulindahr]

I might have realized who I was at around 14 if I hadn't grown up in such a repressed environment. Being called "fag" at my schools wasn't just an insult, it was a label that could invite others to beat a guy up.

I can only dream of what it might have been like to have lived where that was different, and I could have been aware, as well as safe if I'd admitted it. I'm almost positive I wouldn't be anywhere nearly so screwed up even now; I occasionally have dreams where I hate myself for liking guys, and they mess up my days tremendously.

I'm stuck at having finally realized who and what I was at an age where I missed the chance to enjoy the beauty of my own body and those of others -- in fact, it wasn't until long after I came out that I reached the point where I realized it was really okay to enjoy my own body, and not some perversion arisen from the depths of hell.

My advice would be to come out as soon as you can without negative results. If your parents are such that coming out is unsafe at home, it wouldn't be too much, once you're old enough (age varies by state, I think) to "divorce" your parents for cause and find a real family to live with. Doing whatever is available to feel free and be free to be who you are is essential: as the old saying puts it, "This above all else: to your own self be true".

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

Aren't you really talking more about bisexuals who later on in their lives come to realize they are also attracted to the "other" gender? Seriously, how many males have you known who during their teens or 20's were attracted only to other males and not to females, but then by their 40's or 50's were attracted only to females and not to males?

Actually, it's probably not that as uncommon as you'd think. After all, sexuality is a rather complex matter, tied up not only in who we perceive ourselves to be but who we allow ourselves to be.

I'm talking specifically about teen-age boys who are attracted to other boys for whatever reason, and then around late adolescence start finding themselves falling into normal heterosexual patterns. Their initial attraction wasn't necessarily based on their homosexuality, but that they misread queues their bodies were sending them (sexual fantasies about boys all the way to hero worship with sexual submissiveness thrown in). In essence, the boy was never really gay in the first place, but due to his perception of his sexuality thinks that he is and either goes with it or fights it; the boy is acting the sexual role he thinks he's supposed to be in.

The problem is that you're trying to simplify what's a really complex situation for a teen-age boy, and you need to realize that they are a lot of weird things to allow for. Is a boy gay just because he gets a boner in the shower room? Is the boy gay for even fantasizing about a gay sex act? If the boy gets blown, does that act in and of itself make him gay? You even have people that think that the victim of molestation by an older male relative was asking for it on some level; should they also be considered gay? The boy simply doesn't control his body as well as an adult does, and usually doesn't have a clue that a gay fantasy is normal for a straight boy, but thinks that only gay boys have those kind of fantasies.

Again, I'm not attaching ethical value to being gay or straight; all I'm saying is that a teen-age boy should be given the freedom to decide who he is for himself, be it gay, straight, or even bi, and then act on that decision when (and if) the time comes. At the very least, I think they would be more tolerance of those with different sexualities. Some boys are actually gay; that's fine. But we need to realize that the teen-age years are seriously confusing on a number levels, and that hey should be allowed exploration without expectations in order to find out who they are; I just think that's healthier than basing it on arbitrary acts...

RG

 

[Kulindahr]

^

Good stuff.

Maybe the way to go isn't to say, "I'm gay", but to say, "I like boys". If that like changes, it's not an identity change, it's a "like" change, which is a lot less stressful.

 

[Kulindahr]

I just asked a friend this question.

She said, "No, they should be kept in a barrel until they're sixteen."

 

[RobinGoodfellow]

You might as well have stopped typing after that line because that's where you lost me.

Nice bias there. End of discussion.

Heterophobic much? "Normal heterosexual patterns" means the standard "boy meets girl, boy either falls in love with girl and marries her or screws her brains out; look, ma, no boys!"; just as "normal homosexual patterns" would be like "boy meets boy, boy either falls in love with girl and lives with him because the moronic government doesn't recognize their right to marriage or screws his brains out; look, ma, no girls!".

Only a heterophobe, given the context, would have interpreted that as "normal=ONLY ACCEPTABLE SITUATION FUCK THE GAYS!". Yes, I appreciate that "normal" can ALSO mean "relative to the general population", but I didn't say JUST "normal"; by putting "heterosexual" before it, I made it plain as day that I was referring to the normal state of those who are already heterosexual and not those of the population at large (which includes those of a non-heterosexual bent). Seriously; I hate people that look for homophobia or racism because you'll find it every time, regardless of whether or not the person was homophobic or racist. It's just a matter of finding that one little phrase or word that you can misinterpret, blow it up, and make a big ado out of nothing so you can show the others that you can find homophobes or racists. Congratulations! You only think you can read! I hate when I have to type thing in the little words so the kids can read it...

RG

 

[ChickenGuy]

I hate people that look for homophobia or racism because you'll find it every time, regardless of whether or not the person was homophobic or racist. It's just a matter of finding that one little phrase or word that you can misinterpret, blow it up, and make a big ado out of nothing so you can show the others that you can find homophobes or racists.

I couldn't agree more. A lot of my opinions on things are 'in the middle' or nuanced, such as on race, religion, abortion, gay marriage. It becomes very tiresome if you try to explain to someone your opinion but instead people start, figuratively speaking, jumping up and down pointing at you saying RACIST!!!! HOMOPHOBE!!!!

I HATE when people do this - it says a lot more about them than it does about me. It's a method that people use to avoid having any sort of intelligent discussion - instead, they just slap a label on your head and this apparently negates EVERY view you would ever have on any subject. Are they so insecure that they cannot have any sort of debate?

I descibe them as having a form of colour-blindess - they only see black and white, never, ever, the multitude of shades of grey.

 

[luminum]

*sigh

...