I don't want to be gay

[Seasoned]

The hardest person you'll ever come out to us yourself. I joined this forum as moderator after being asked. Some of my posts were noticed because I think the unfairest thing about being gay is having to figure it out alone and in secret. Over the years I gave said to all who are close to me that I would accomplish a lifetime of work if I could make things easier for one gay person struggling like you are and I did.

I spent a lot of my teen years crying quietly, alone in the bathroom and then forcing myself to laugh do it wouldn't look like I had been crying. This was no small task as we were a family of nine and just had a bath and a half. But I remember crying and then the cover up laughter, which was all in silence.

I didn't want to be different. I wanted to do what I was expected to do. I didn't understand why my older brother's PLAYBOYS did nothing for me.

I was extremely introverted and afraid and didn't know there was another person like me on earth. My family delighted in calling me a sissy, gay still meant happy and fag still referred to a cigarette. Queer was the word I would hear a school, but it was an all-boys Catholic school in the early 60's and pretty civilized and the world was still naive in a lit of places. The guys would sometimes corner me to ask me questions, trying to get a something, but I wasn't sure what. That's when I developed a great wit and sense of humor. I'd say something funny and they'd back off.

I got married to a young woman right after college. We both went to graduate school and we had two children. I thought if my fantasy life grew stronger I'd be able to take "the cure," and get on with life.

I'm not sharing all of this to make your post all about me, but I'm sharing my life story up to the point of how I denied what you are currently feeling because I didn't want to be queer.

You've gotten some advice here to just be yourself and everything will be all right. I can repeat that as well, but by knowing some of my back story you might be able to realize that, like you, I was at my wits end and didn't want to be different. I am proof that it can happen and I'll tell you how it happened to me.

While I was married and beginning to get more curious as to actually wanting sex with another guy instead of just thinking about it and masturbating. I made an appointment to see a therapist. I walked in telling him I was ready for the shock therapy cure. Honest to god! He laughed at me. When I asked him what I was supposed to do, he told me to accept myself. I cried all the way home.

I'm going to stop my story here to interject that your words hit home. We live in a heterosexist society and are expected to be straight. Rather than hearing that gay is the other normal, which we would if we had gay loved ones as part of our family or extended family, we hear something quite different and internalize all that fear and distortion.

Not every gay person encounters self hate, but each one figures out they aren't made to find a female and settle down.

Fortunately after tens of thousands of years of bullshit we happen to be alive in a more enlightened era where same sex couples are a part of society with kids and all. If you are writing from the Western world your government can't take action against you. Entire countries, some of them Catholic countries have legalized gay marriage.

The hurdle now is you. Millions have gone before you under great duress. Thousands and perhaps millions have worked on all of our behalves to bring us where we are today. We can't possibly all like one another, but we fight for one another and we understand one another. I know I am connected somehow to your struggle and now perhaps because you found JUB and received responses you will begin to understand that there is comfort and strength for you in that connection and will serve you in times of dispair like you are facing.

We fags are no sissies. It takes courage to admit we are different and due the same rights and privleges as everyone else. Don't mistake anger at being different with fear to admit that you are.

You will never be alone and you can create a dream of a life for yourself being yourself. I did, so I know that you can.

Welcome to JUB. I and others would welcome private messages.

 

[TorontoBoi]

My advice would be to accept it sooner than later. Because once you realize there's no changing yourself, you'll look back at the years you lost (making friends, relationships, sex, etc).

However, I know what you mean and sometimes it feels really unfair that we've been given this gay life without choosing it. The gay culture is extremely difficult to live through and sometimes I feel that being straight would have made my life far easier. I think many would agree (or deny) that truth...

 

[Seasoned]

Let me add a postscript to my unusually long message. My hope for every gay man is the realization of the positive side of being gay. Straight white men may have the edge in the Western world, but at what price? We are free from narrow constraints and have much more freedom of expression. If you get past the bullshit, the world is really our oyster. An out gay man can pick his likes, dislikes and have freedoms that most straight men will never experience. The grass is pretty green in our back yard.

 

[fetaby]

Thank you for all the advice. This is been something I've been struggling with for years now and I'm all but convinced myself I couldn't tell anyone, but despite that I had to break and put this out into the nether.



I think I've pretty much always been this way. I mean, I'm on this website, right? I can tell you this very helpful forum isn't the first reason I came here When I was younger I had no concept of sexuality or anything like that, so naturally I assumed there was nothing wrong with me. That everyone was like that. I'm 23 now and more mature and realize the social and mental implications of this are much more severe than I can handle. Like I said earlier, I feel powerless against this. What makes it worse is that I'm normally unphased by social stigmas and bullshit like that, but this is just like kryptonite. I can't get past it at all.

Why it's a bad thing? Like I said in my first post, I feel like a criminal. That I'm not a part of society and never can be. I feel robbed. How can I ever experience life like a normal person? I can't get married like everyone else and have a big happy celebration, I can't have kids and raise a family, I can't enjoy all the intimate things others take for granted in a social setting, it's all so overwhelming.

I can turn to people for help, but that's the thing, I just can't do it. It's like there's a magic spell blocking me from helping myself. I really, really want to tell my bestfriend but I've never been more scared of anything in my life and I'm really ashamed of that. Calling him my bestfriend is an understatement, he's truly my soul mate. We've been through so many things together and I know that even if the whole world turned against me he'd still have my back. But I just can't tell him. It'd be easier to stick my hand into a fire.

I feel that he's being robbed like I am. That he has to deal with something he shouldn't. We can't do normal shit like everyone else, like go to a bar and pick up chicks together. Or talk about things like that. He's normal and I'm an alien and the world will hate him for being friends with an alien. I feel so guilty. Even a few times he's asked me if I was gay, I guess jokingly. I've never dated and never talked about it, so I guess that's why he asked. I'd just dodge it, or try to make him feel guilty for asking. And looking back on that it tearing me apart. But I'm just so afraid that he might think I'm a lesser person, that I'm not a real man and the fact that he has to endure this with me. So, maybe he really does know? My mind is saying, "what the fuck is wrong with you? He wants to help" but myself just puts all these "What ifs" into my head. I think my distrust of him is really affecting our friendship, but why can't I do this? I really don't want to lay all this on him.

You're so fucking smart. I wonder if you realize just how much...


Anyway, true or false. All a person has is their self... What you do with that is your decision.

I think my distrust of him is really affecting our friendship,

But your idea of him being untrustworthy is your own creation. It's an invention of your mind to help cope with a belief that you've invented for yourself.

Many people hold similar ideas, that's true enough. Enough so that their commonality has built up everything in our society. BUT, what's not easily understood is that we do have the choice in which ones we want to believe.

You are gay. You know this is true. Now is just a question of what to do with that knowledge. You could continue to torture yourself by believing that society holds nothing but negativity towards you. And this may very well be the case with the people around you. But it is not universally true. This website is proof of that.

So think of this. You are innocent. The wrongness of your being isn't something you truly believe. But an idea you've picked up from your surroundings. Much the same way that people pick up their religious beliefs from the locality of their birth. But if it doesn't ring true, an introspection easily debunks their validity.

It's really as simple as that. It's a matter of who/what you choose to believe.

Anyway, best of luck to you.

 

[Vagabond]

Thank you all very much. I really was at the end of the road when I wrote that first post, the options were few. But it looks like I made the right choice. I think that ontop of my mistrust of other people, I also mistrust myself. Maybe that's why I am where I am. I know I am a smart person because I make the effort to be that way. I seek the answer. But I just don't know why I can't accept the things my mind is telling me and this is one answer I want to stay hidden. I think I've seen and heard here what I needed to see and hear and it really is true:

You are your own worst enemy. I've been a lot of places and seen a lot of things for someone my age and loved every minute of it, even if some of it I wished had never been. But I think that the journey to myself, looking into myself, is the most terrifying and seemingly impossible thing left. This whole gay shit certainly doesn't help anything. I still don't know what the hell to do, what the hell to make of it. I really am my worst enemy because I know all my worst secrets, all my own weaknesses, and I have all the power to help myself but I can't tap into it.

I got to hang with my bestfriend over the weekend after not being able to see each other for a month. He moved ridiculously far away almost a year ago and we just haven't been able to do things as much as we used to. Fortunately he's moving back in a month or so. But getting to see him has really helped I think. We're both very physically active and obsessed with working out so we got to finally work out together for the first time in forever. What he showed and told me has really opened my eyes. I couldn't perform as I wanted to, and haven't been able to. I know I can lift the shit, we both know the strength is there, but I just couldn't do it. I couldn't tap into it. It's my internal struggle manifested right there for us to both physically see. He said it plainly that there's something blocking me from getting there and that the true challenge to improving my gains is figuring out how to get past that. Kind of made me smile. Life isn't a total bitch, I guess.

Like I said, the questions are still here, even though you've all provided me the answers. I still don't know where to go with this, how I can ever accept that I might be a genetic fluke or something, that we all are, even though our blood is as red as theirs or that I'll be a novelty to the people close to me that just don't understand, or that I'll forever be on the outside looking in. I know it now, I am gay. But what exactly that means I have no fucking clue, or I don't want to. I still don't want to be gay. If I had the red pill and the blue pill in front of me, and the red one made me straight, the blue one made me gay, I'd snatch that red pill, melt it in a spoon, and inject that shit straight into my heart. And I mean no offense to anyone by saying that. I hope that I can see things from your guys' point of view sometime in the very near future. I think you guys are supermen. I can lift weights, so fucking what? You guys have managed to destroy the barriers that have brought me to my knees, looked into places a human being should not have to look, sought the truth, and tamed it with your bare hands. I will always be in awe of that. I still just can't do it, I still hate it, I still don't want it, I still don't know where to go, but you guys have made one road a head much brighter than it was before. Thanks again.

 

[fetaby]

You are your own worst enemy. I've been a lot of places and seen a lot of things for someone my age and loved every minute of it, even if some of it I wished had never been. But I think that the journey to myself, looking into myself, is the most terrifying and seemingly impossible thing left. This whole gay shit certainly doesn't help anything. I still don't know what the hell to do, what the hell to make of it. I really am my worst enemy because I know all my worst secrets, all my own weaknesses, and I have all the power to help myself but I can't tap into it.

So smart...

But do you realize that the flip side of that coin is also true? You are your own worst enemy, BUT you are also your only ally.

You need to study the fundamentals, starting with good and bad. Where do these ideas come from? How do they apply to ourselves?

The idea that something is either good or bad is of course subjective. Murder is good to a murderer, as much as getting caught is bad.

You hold the idea that being gay is bad. Until you let go of that idea, you'll never be good.

But how you say? By acknowledging your right to existence as a gay man. No one asks to be put here, gay, straight, whatever. We all have problems, gay straight, whatever.

I know it now, I am gay. But what exactly that means I have no fucking clue, or I don't want to.

And this is what I'm talking about. Being gay can mean one of two things. What you decide it means, or what you allow others to tell you what it means.

You don't want to because you fear rejection and disapproval. But you've gone a step further and decided to reject and disapprove of yourself. There's nothing internal about being gay that is negative. All the negativity is associated to it from outside influences. It is your choice to listen to them, or listen to yourself.

It's sooooo simple. When you see a guy and your shorts tent up, listen.

 

[paatreides]

If I had the red pill and the blue pill in front of me, and the red one made me straight, the blue one made me gay, I'd snatch that red pill, melt it in a spoon, and inject that shit straight into my heart. And I mean no offense to anyone by saying that.

No offense taken here. And I have to give you big props for that statement. Truly. If every one of us was being completely, bare-souled honest, we'd all admit to having that same thought at some point as we attempted to come to terms with our sexual proclivities.

Nobody makes a concious choice to be made to feel like a second class citizen, to be ridiculed, mocked, attacked, bullied, or otherwise dealt horrible blows to our self esteem. Unfortunately, as you know, we didn't - and still don't - have that choice to make.

You know what steps you need to take - the first was to admit it to yourself and you've done that.

I can't or won't lie to you; step two will be difficult as well. But you must accept yourself and (it's true) learn to love yourself. Once you accomplish that, the next step will be easier - that will be telling your best friend. And with each step it gets better.

You will be in my thoughts and my prayers (to whatever powers that be) this burden becomes lighter for you to bear and your journey is swift and as painless as possible.

 

[qget12]

Vagabond, let me just say that you've done a better job of expressing many of the thoughts and problems that are also plaguing me. I'm of a similar age (turned 21 there last month) and I feel almost the same as you. It's hard to "accept" something about yourself that you have absolutely no desire be. Like you, I simply don't want to be gay. I understand the mental pain you feel as well, like its OK for others to be gay and enjoy themselves and accept themselves, but when it comes to yourself, the thought of it couldn't be any more terrifying.

I understand the need to be brave. I wish I was braver, but at the same time I don't feel like a coward for not letting it be known to the world. I do immensely respect those that do though. My friends aren't homophobic in the slightest, and would express concern if they heard about something that was truly homophobic, but they are not above referring to things as "gay" and one of my fears is that if I did come out, I would always be the butt of the jokes. Friendly ribbing is extremely commonplace among me and my friends, and I feel like it would be the "go-to" joke in my case. I'm probably making my friends seem worse than they are but I guess a lot of this could be chalked up to them (and me) being stupid and young.

Let me ask you a question Vagabond. How good are you at pretending to be straight? Do you hook up with girls, date, and all that stuff?

 

[bhandsome]

Vagabond, let me just say that you've done a better job of expressing many of the thoughts and problems that are also plaguing me. I'm of a similar age (turned 21 there last month) and I feel almost the same as you. It's hard to "accept" something about yourself that you have absolutely no desire be. Like you, I simply don't want to be gay. I understand the mental pain you feel as well, like its OK for others to be gay and enjoy themselves and accept themselves, but when it comes to yourself, the thought of it couldn't be any more terrifying.

I understand the need to be brave. I wish I was braver, but at the same time I don't feel like a coward for not letting it be known to the world. I do immensely respect those that do though. My friends aren't homophobic in the slightest, and would express concern if they heard about something that was truly homophobic, but they are not above referring to things as "gay" and one of my fears is that if I did come out, I would always be the butt of the jokes. Friendly ribbing is extremely commonplace among me and my friends, and I feel like it would be the "go-to" joke in my case. I'm probably making my friends seem worse than they are but I guess a lot of this could be chalked up to them (and me) being stupid and young.

Let me ask you a question Vagabond. How good are you at pretending to be straight? Do you hook up with girls, date, and all that stuff?

I second this statement.

I'm in this exact same position as well. I would like to add that God made us the way we are, and we can't change that. Whether you believe in God or not is on you, but regardless this is who you are and you can either accept it or be left stressing out for years.

 

[Vagabond]

Let me ask you a question Vagabond. How good are you at pretending to be straight? Do you hook up with girls, date, and all that stuff?

I don't really think I do much pretending. I think if you met me in person, I doubt you'd pin me as a "gay guy". Aside from sexuality, I'm just the same as any other guy. The greatest extent I've gone to is saying, "ya I'd fuck her" when my friends were talking about hot chicks. I think the biggest "sign" is the fact that I don't date and never talk about it. I have done stupid explorative stuff with neighborhood chicks when I was a little kid but since then I've never hooked up with a girl or anyone for that matter. I'd never get into a fake relationship. There's no way I can do that to myself or to another girl. I think women are beautiful, they just don't flip that switch, you know.

And I think this is one of the things I'm afraid of. I'm scared that if I do come out as gay to the people close to me, that suddenly everything about me in the past 23 years just ceases to exist and I become a "gay guy". That' I'm supposed to "act gay". I'm afraid of becoming some kind of novelty, even though these people already know everything about me. The only thing they don't know is what gives me a boner. But suddenly that's supposed to change everything about me? I don't think my parents are homophobic, for example, but I've heard them talk about gay people plenty of times. They seem to think that they're some kind of separate species. "We like gay people" I heard them say one time. I don't want to be liked as a gay person, I want to be liked as their son, the same son I've been for the past 23 years. I hope that makes sense. I'm afraid that my friend and brothers might think of me as less of a man because I'm attracted to other men. One of my brothers is actually openly homophobic. He doesn't know it, but he hates me. It really is a mind fuck. That's why I feel like a criminal. That strange creature of the night is lurking in your midst and you don't even know it. You would never know it if I never told you.

 

[hotatlboi]

And I think this is one of the things I'm afraid of. I'm scared that if I do come out as gay to the people close to me, that suddenly everything about me in the past 23 years just ceases to exist and I become a "gay guy". That' I'm supposed to "act gay".

I can understand that but you have to understand that this fear is unfounded and is based on false stereotypes.

Being gay is not "acting" in any certain way, it is simply who you are attracted to. I am a masculine acting guy and haven't changed anything about myself or the way I act by being out, and I don't really know anyone that has.

Nothing ceases to exist except in the minds of extremely homophobic people who define being gay as more than it really constitutes of who you are. And trust me you don't want those people around you anyway since they will be toxic to your wellbeing.

 

[malarcus909]

For the life of me I can't remember where I heard this...or perhaps read about it, but I thought it was a nice way of looking at sexuality.

Aside from things like food, water, shelter and some societal securities I'm sure most people will say that the one thing most important to them is love. Love doesn't have to be romantic or sexual--you can love your mother, father, sister, brother, friend, confidant or even an enemy, but there's someone every now and then that falls into your sights that blows you away.

I think that identifying as "gay" means that only men are able to satisfy this romantic and sexual concept of love while being "straight" means only women (or men for women) can only truly satisfy them.


People don't "act gay" or "act straight" they "act" like themselves. If being true to yourself means that those that you are surrounded by are uncomfortable then it certainly isn't you with the problem. If you want to stay with those people that you describe as 'angry' then you have to understand that it won't be a walk in the park...you will have to work on your relationship with them, but you should never back-down from who you truly are because you'll only be angrier with yourself when you look back at the mistakes you made.


Don't get me wrong...there will be mistakes in mending relationships, but don't make the one mistake that is so obvious--don't turn someone down that blows you away just because you're scared.

 

[makeurowndstny]

You don't have to "act gay." That is a choice. I am gay and out, but I don't act gay. The people at my work didn't know I was gay until some girl asked me out and I turned her down. I play sports, know how to work on cars, etc and hate to go shopping and all the effeminate things. You are who you are. Your sexuality is just a tiny part of you, its not you. Don't let this one thing take control of your life.

 

[qget12]

I don't really think I do much pretending. I think if you met me in person, I doubt you'd pin me as a "gay guy". Aside from sexuality, I'm just the same as any other guy. The greatest extent I've gone to is saying, "ya I'd fuck her" when my friends were talking about hot chicks. I think the biggest "sign" is the fact that I don't date and never talk about it. I have done stupid explorative stuff with neighborhood chicks when I was a little kid but since then I've never hooked up with a girl or anyone for that matter. I'd never get into a fake relationship. There's no way I can do that to myself or to another girl. I think women are beautiful, they just don't flip that switch, you know.

And I think this is one of the things I'm afraid of. I'm scared that if I do come out as gay to the people close to me, that suddenly everything about me in the past 23 years just ceases to exist and I become a "gay guy". That' I'm supposed to "act gay". I'm afraid of becoming some kind of novelty, even though these people already know everything about me. The only thing they don't know is what gives me a boner. But suddenly that's supposed to change everything about me? I don't think my parents are homophobic, for example, but I've heard them talk about gay people plenty of times. They seem to think that they're some kind of separate species. "We like gay people" I heard them say one time. I don't want to be liked as a gay person, I want to be liked as their son, the same son I've been for the past 23 years. I hope that makes sense. I'm afraid that my friend and brothers might think of me as less of a man because I'm attracted to other men. One of my brothers is actually openly homophobic. He doesn't know it, but he hates me. It really is a mind fuck. That's why I feel like a criminal. That strange creature of the night is lurking in your midst and you don't even know it. You would never know it if I never told you.

You see, I'd wager a bet and say that your friends already might have an inkling (or more than) about your sexuality, or at least, they'll know something's up. I say this because well, they're not stupid, and probably think every time you say "yeah, I'd bang her", "you say that, but how come you never seem to do it?". Not that I'm trying to make you feel bad, but if you're not out and saying things like that ^, you are pretending to be straight. Whether you are "acting" straight is a different matter. Like others have said, your fears are not uncommon, but unfounded (not that I would know personally).

 

[tipmyscales86]

I don't really think I do much pretending. I think if you met me in person, I doubt you'd pin me as a "gay guy". Aside from sexuality, I'm just the same as any other guy. The greatest extent I've gone to is saying, "ya I'd fuck her" when my friends were talking about hot chicks. I think the biggest "sign" is the fact that I don't date and never talk about it. I have done stupid explorative stuff with neighborhood chicks when I was a little kid but since then I've never hooked up with a girl or anyone for that matter. I'd never get into a fake relationship. There's no way I can do that to myself or to another girl. I think women are beautiful, they just don't flip that switch, you know.

And I think this is one of the things I'm afraid of. I'm scared that if I do come out as gay to the people close to me, that suddenly everything about me in the past 23 years just ceases to exist and I become a "gay guy". That' I'm supposed to "act gay". I'm afraid of becoming some kind of novelty, even though these people already know everything about me. The only thing they don't know is what gives me a boner. But suddenly that's supposed to change everything about me? I don't think my parents are homophobic, for example, but I've heard them talk about gay people plenty of times. They seem to think that they're some kind of separate species. "We like gay people" I heard them say one time. I don't want to be liked as a gay person, I want to be liked as their son, the same son I've been for the past 23 years. I hope that makes sense. I'm afraid that my friend and brothers might think of me as less of a man because I'm attracted to other men. One of my brothers is actually openly homophobic. He doesn't know it, but he hates me. It really is a mind fuck. That's why I feel like a criminal. That strange creature of the night is lurking in your midst and you don't even know it. You would never know it if I never told you.

I remember feeling a lot of the things you described here. I was also afraid of the whole novelty thing, that I would be outcasted as the "gay guy", and that after I came out that I would have to "act gay" as if I had something to prove to people.

But then I realized that was all bullshit. You can't control what other people think so you have to learn how to not give a shit how they view you. If they see you as some kind of novelty, it's them that have problems for being so narrow-minded.

 

[pai mei]

i can tell you your parents won't love you as 'the gay son,' they'll love you as their son. love is funny that way. it can't discriminate, even in those depressing cases where the brain is telling it that it should.

you know, you don't have to be the stereotypical gay guy. you truly don't. and the way you act after you come out, and i know you'll get there at some point, will prove that to yourself and others.

that said, i am not overly effeminate either. however, i wouldn't wear things, i wouldn't say things, and i wouldn't watch things based solely on the perception that they were "gay" things when i wasn't out. now that i am out, and i can do and watch whatever i want, i DO indulge in more of the "stereotypical" gay things than i ever did before. if i wanna watch america's next top model over ufc 131, then that's what i'm going to fucking watch. after coming out, I *have* drifted towards being more "stereotypically" gay. not because i feel as if i have to, but because i'm allowed to now.

that doesn't mean i have a high-pitched voice and a limp wrist and don't love sports, it just means i can wear my above knee-shorts, form-fitting shorts, and cardigan and scoop-neck shirt if i damned well please. when you come out, maybe you'll wear the ripped up t-shirt with grease stains on it from working on the truck all day with ripped jeans, but you'll do it because it's what you want to wear, not because you feel as if you can't wear other "gay" stuff.

coming out, and accepting yourself isn't about being the stereotype, or not being the stereotype. it has nothing to do with that. what it is, is allowing yourself to be whatever YOU want to be.

i don't believe you truly have a problem with being gay, you just have a problem with what this might all mean in all the other areas of your life.

it's a cliche, but once you come out, you may still be the visibly hetero guy you are today, but it won't be about being the stereotype, or not being the stereotype, it'll be about being truly free to choose who you want to be, in all the ways that matter. if that turns out to be the exact same person you are right now, then great. then that is exactly what will happen. but when that does happen, it'll happen because it's truly who you are, NOT because you've been avoiding things which might tip people off. because where you are right now in your life, you can't truly say that about who you are. you'll come to realize that someday, and i suspect it'll be someday sooner rather than later, i've read your posts and you're too smart not to get there.

 

[HunterM]

Hey Vagabond,
Here's another perspective. What advice would you give to someone who was born with down syndrome? It is not a choice that they could have made. I'm sure they wish they didn't have the disease. What would you tell him with that condition on how to live a productive life?

What advice would you give to his parents? What advice would you give to his brother? Ignore him or love him regardless of his condition?

That are assholes out there who would make fun of him. What suggestions do you have for the down syndrom person on how to manage/react to those situations?

Accept who you are. Surround yourself with supportive and positive people. Kick out assholes out of your life (your asshole homophobic brother). Empower yourself. This is your life, you have control on who to let in and who to let out.

Re-emphasizing a previous poster: we cannot control other people's thoughts, words or actions. However, we can control our own reactions and our path in life. Accept who you are. Empower yourself. Control your own life. Life does get better.

 

[HunterM]

Gay people can still have a family of their own through adoption or surrogate.

Here's the latest news. Adoption by gay couples are on the rise: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/14/us/14adoption.html?_r=1

 

[fetaby]

He doesn't know it, but he hates me. It really is a mind fuck. That's why I feel like a criminal.

It's your mind. You're the one thrusting.

I've said it a few times already, you're the one deciding what to believe. If you believe being gay is nothing but stereotypes, I pity you.

I've got to remember that this is a flame free zone. But the amount of intellectual ignorance that is on display for the sake of emotional stability is overwhelming.

I know all you kids are just trying to grow up and make heads or tails out of a situation that you had no say in. Every gay man here has been in that same situation. I do take offense at being relegated to a substandard stereotypical caricature of what a human is supposed to be. And not because it effects me personally, because it effects you as a gay man as well.

To not take offense is to accept that those statements have some validity, which I will not do even for the sake of your perceived emotional distress. Emotions are not permanent. They come and go. But to keep oneself in a position to be effected negatively by them is the very definition of insanity.

Misery loves company. It loves nothing more than the company of your consciousness.

Until you all stop listening to every bump in the night that tells you being gay is supposed to be a bad thing, you will never be able to accept that you are gay.

You may know it is true, but you will not have accepted it. Because it is impossible for anyone to willingly accept to be something they believe is bad.

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How to get passed it....


1. Find something you enjoy.

2. Do that. Experience the happiness, the fulfillment, the sense of contentment. Enjoy the accomplishment of a task completed.

3. Want those feelings to encompass every aspect of your life.

4. Apply those concepts to the fact of being gay. Experience pleasure in a another man's image, his body. Be his friend, let him be yours.

5. Ask yourself. How something so good, could ever be wrong?

 

[TX-Beau]

Until you all stop listening to every bump in the night that tells you being gay is supposed to be a bad thing, you will never be able to accept that you are gay.

You may know it is true, but you will not have accepted it. Because it is impossible for anyone to willingly accept to be something they believe is bad.

Yup, there is a big fat difference between acknowledging you're gay and accepting it.

What you're going through, thinking, saying is ALREADY extremely stereotypical.

What stereotype would that be?

"...no one knows I'm gay because I'm so damn butch..."

SUGAR, we're never as sneaky as we think we are. Almost all of us said that - because we had issues with being gay, issues with gayness and masculinity - namely that if people know we are gay, they'll thik we're less of a man; and we had accepted the negative stereotypes of gay men that are out there - because we STILL thought being gay was lesser and bad, even after we knew that's what we were.

I've been following this conversation not saying much, but I think it's time to be extremely frank.

You'll never get over this as long as you let OTHER PEOPLE define how you feel about yourself. That's the cowards position, it's your life, take control of it, take your anger and use it as a big fuck you to anyone who doesn't like that.

There is nothing wrong with being a fey, fashion conscious, pretty little fairy. This whole conversation implies there is, because that's exactly what you're running from, what you are afraid people are going to think about you - because YOU think there's something wrong with that, and that will remain true no matter how much you might protest otherwise.

How do I know this, because this is extremely common, and that's always at the center of it.

You have accepted negative stereotypes about gay men - extremely common; you are running from those stereotypes - extremely common; what you do about that is what will truly define who you are.