I'm a gay conservative?

[GhostMost]

That's a well-named philosophy: it sees people as objects.

If they're standing in your way, then yes. I don't see the problem in rational egoism, unless you want to talk about limiting happiness.

 

[Kulindahr]

If they're standing in your way, then yes. I don't see the problem in rational egoism, unless you want to talk about limiting happiness.

LOL

"Limiting happiness" is built into objectivism. Since it's focused entirely on the person, there's no solid foundation for human rights, for example; if people are "standing in your way", you do what pleases you to deal with that -- kill them, enslave them, impoverish them.

It's largely the objectivist strain that makes the Tea Party so ruthless and uncaring.

 

[kallipolis]

LOL

"Limiting happiness" is built into objectivism. Since it's focused entirely on the person, there's no solid foundation for human rights, for example; if people are "standing in your way", you do what pleases you to deal with that -- kill them, enslave them, impoverish them.

It's largely the objectivist strain that makes the Tea Party so ruthless and uncaring.

I would say more, the self serving interest of the person who is purposefully blind to the absolute needs of other human beings to shelter, clothing and food.

This is what makes the Tea Party agenda, and its zealots so dangerous.

 

[Kulindahr]

I would say more, the self serving interest of the person who is purposefully blind to the absolute needs of other human beings to shelter, clothing and food.

This is what makes the Tea Party agenda, and its zealots so dangerous.

That's really just a restatement of what I said -- objectivism is all about exalting selfishness and not seeing other humans a whole lot differently than rocks or trees.

 

[GhostMost]

You all make it out like it's some dictatorship haha, you are making it seem like you're afraid of it haha. It's far from a dictatorship, I'd say the liberal agenda is more of one. Well ask any person in America if they truly are happy by devoting their time to others?
Ask them if they sometimes enjoy being with themselves alone. Ask them if they sometimes like to work to bring food to their own mouths, or if they like having economic security.
Objectivism is really just bringing responsibility only to yourself and no one else. Who says we have to devote our time to other people... A creator? That to me is personal happiness, objecting the views of servitude to others and being selfless, in the liberal sense.

 

[Kulindahr]

You all make it out like it's some dictatorship haha, you are making it seem like you're afraid of it haha. It's far from a dictatorship, I'd say the liberal agenda is more of one. Well ask any person in America if they truly are happy by devoting their time to others?
Ask them if they sometimes enjoy being with themselves alone. Ask them if they sometimes like to work to bring food to their own mouths, or if they like having economic security.
Objectivism is really just bringing responsibility only to yourself and no one else. Who says we have to devote our time to other people... A creator? That to me is personal happiness, objecting the views of servitude to others and being selfless, in the liberal sense.

It's a prescription for a dictatorship, with amoral jungle between here and there. America run on objectivist, propertarian lines would dump us into corporate feudalism rapidly, and feudalism leads to dictatorship. And there would be no guilt for those on top, because in objectivism there's no such thing as human rights.

 

[GhostMost]

It's a prescription for a dictatorship, with amoral jungle between here and there. America run on objectivist, propertarian lines would dump us into corporate feudalism rapidly, and feudalism leads to dictatorship. And there would be no guilt for those on top, because in objectivism there's no such thing as human rights.

Corporate feudalism? We're already in that shit, the whole world is going through modern feudalism, get over it. Objectivism is actually all about human rights, life, liberty, and the big one, the pursuit of happiness. Yes capitalism has it's bad seeds that want to gain control over everything, but then it's the people's duty to force that seed to not germinate and take over the forest.

What if you were making one of the greatest inventions that time has ever seen? It's original, it's modern, sleek, and completely unique. But someone was jealous of your mind and wanted it destroyed. So then as you put the finishing touches on it, he manages to break into your concentration and pursue the invention in the hopes of killing it, what do you do?
Do you let him do it and say oh I'll try to make this again another time? Or do you gain control of the situation and let your passion take control of you? Because merely talking it out will serve no purpose.

 

[kallipolis]

Objectivism is actually all about human rights, life, liberty, and the big one, the pursuit of happiness. Yes capitalism has it's bad seeds that want to gain control over everything, but then it's the people's duty to force that seed to not germinate and take over the forest.

The rugged individualism of the early American pioneer also ensured that his neighbour was taken care of, when they met with rough times, and starvation was knocking on their door.

In this sense self interest ensured that ones neighbour would return the favour should the boot be on the other foot.

In ensuring our own well being we also ensure the interest of the wider community, that determines we should participate in the common wealth of a community's investment in sharing the fruits of our labour.

 

[GhostMost]

The rugged individualism of the early American pioneer also ensured that his neighbour was taken care of, when they met with rough times, and starvation was knocking on their door.

In this sense self interest ensured that ones neighbour would "return the favour" should the boot be on the other foot.

In ensuring our own well being we also ensure the interest of the wider community, that determines we should participate in the common wealth of a community's investment in sharing the fruits of our labour.

I don't know if you were siding with me or not, because I completely agree, that's capitalism what you stated, because you made it sound like a barter or a trade. If you were trying to prove a wrong point to me then I'm not catching it or you didn't do it well.

 

[Queerwitch]

I just hope you're a real libertarian and not a propertarian like most of the claimants to being libertarian in the GOP are. There's a fairly easy test: propertarians believe that corporations have political rights, while libertarians believe only people have rights.

Well, let's see. I work for a corporation that expects us to break our backs, but whenever the subject of raises comes up, they will hear nothing of it. (Forget the fact that costs of living are always going up--screw you, little people!) We work short-staffed more often than not, and frankly I'm a little bit sick of my "masters" making millions from my sweat.. Needless to say, I'm a proud union member. Guess that definitely doesn't make me propertarian.

 

[Kulindahr]

Corporate feudalism? We're already in that shit, the whole world is going through modern feudalism, get over it. Objectivism is actually all about human rights, life, liberty, and the big one, the pursuit of happiness. Yes capitalism has it's bad seeds that want to gain control over everything, but then it's the people's duty to force that seed to not germinate and take over the forest.

What if you were making one of the greatest inventions that time has ever seen? It's original, it's modern, sleek, and completely unique. But someone was jealous of your mind and wanted it destroyed. So then as you put the finishing touches on it, he manages to break into your concentration and pursue the invention in the hopes of killing it, what do you do?
Do you let him do it and say oh I'll try to make this again another time? Or do you gain control of the situation and let your passion take control of you? Because merely talking it out will serve no purpose.

Objectivism is about selfishness. It regards people as objects to be used, or cast aside, or even eliminated. It doesn't care about rights, only about privileges.


Well, I definitely don't "let my passion take control of me" -- that's barbarism.

 

[Kulindahr]

The rugged individualism of the early American pioneer also ensured that his neighbour was taken care of, when they met with rough times, and starvation was knocking on their door.

In this sense self interest ensured that ones neighbour would return the favour should the boot be on the other foot.

In ensuring our own well being we also ensure the interest of the wider community, that determines we should participate in the common wealth of a community's investment in sharing the fruits of our labour.

And in order for such a system to operate, everyone must have reasonably equivalent wealth or means. The moment any significant concentration of wealth begins, the unstated pact breaks down. It also depended to a fair extent on the easy availability of resources.

I maintain that both problems -- the two failings in the present system -- could be solved if we had a rational system of property.

 

[csb999]

Indirectly perhaps addressing a subject I have long considered . Gay liberals vs.gay conservatives . When you think MOST gay men ( and probably 90% + of JUB supporters , this means probably you ) are almost all urban , single and have an above average income and education , these are nature's born conservatives . The republican party in the US , and probably most conservative parties throughout the world , have not historically supported oppressed minorities and sometimes killed them . 40 years ago in most of the U.S. most of JUB supporters could have been jailed and possibly lobotomized for what you did yesterday . So the issue is entirely how much you are still an oppressed minority. That Condoleeza Rice ( in my point - blank hippy Canadian liberal-left-progressive opinion, a monster ) , a black female , could be a republican ( and such a major one ) is the purest victory for the progressive left . Anyone beyond a certain age will be somewhat suprised that she is not a Democrat . I once said , as a joke to a friend of mine , that the final victory will be when the KKK is headed by a disabled black lesbian ,oh ,who's Jewish .

 

[mapiyu]

Indirectly perhaps addressing a subject I have long considered . Gay liberals vs.gay conservatives . When you think MOST gay men ( and probably 90% + of JUB supporters , this means probably you ) are almost all urban , single and have an above average income and education , these are nature's born conservatives . The republican party in the US , and probably most conservative parties throughout the world , have not historically supported oppressed minorities and sometimes killed them . 40 years ago in most of the U.S. most of JUB supporters could have been jailed and possibly lobotomized for what you did yesterday . So the issue is entirely how much you are still an oppressed minority. That Condoleeza Rice ( in my point - blank hippy Canadian liberal-left-progressive opinion, a monster ) , a black female , could be a republican ( and such a major one ) is the purest victory for the progressive left . Anyone beyond a certain age will be somewhat suprised that she is not a Democrat . I once said , as a joke to a friend of mine , that the final victory will be when the KKK is headed by a disabled black lesbian ,oh ,who's Jewish .

Just because gay people aren't quite as oppressed as they were 40 years ago does not mean that they are not oppressed. And the same can be said about blacks and other ethnic/racial minorities.