Impeachment Inquiry Starts Public Hearings

[Sausy]

It's sad..... wonderful perspective, btw to NotHardup1 about where we are in America today, that indeed we are on a precipice and our very survival as a nation is at stake.

Even Will Hurd, one of the most thoughtful of the Republican Party of today, while criticizing the President's conduct... somehow fails to see, or admit, the bribery and extortion that's absolutely evident in the phone call of July 25. The only reason Ukraine had its funds released to purchase the military aid vitally needed was the whistleblower's complaint had made its way to the House and everything was going to blow up. If not for the whistleblower, Ukraine would be in a very precarious state. Yet as of this point, it appears not a single Republican, save for Michigan Rep. Justin Amash (who left the GOP to become an independent because of his outrage over the conduct of the President and lack of subsequent GOP concern) stands willing to vote for ANY article of impeachment against President Trump. As well, it doesn't look good in the Senate in regards to garnering any Republican support for impeachment as well. Instead we now hear the Republicans willing to treat impeachment both as a circus and with disdain, possibly limiting it to 2 weeks for any hearing and bringing in all the conspiracy theory players the Republican House nutcases want to bring in... put Joe and Hunter Biden on the stand... put Adam Schiff on the stand.... put some member of the DNC with Ukraine background on the stand...put the whistleblower on the stand. What an absolute farce.

Yes, KB... Putin is laughing at us now. He probably can hardly believe just how well his intent to upend American society and turn us against our standards and institutions has worked. I am greatly saddened to see us falling apart and how many people are so damn willing to go along, and point fingers and question those who can see exactly what is going on and make them the villains. Make them the ones who are out to destroy America.

 

[gsdx]

Does anyone else see a march on Washington with people carrying pitchforks and torches?

 

[KaraBulut]

Does anyone else see a march on Washington with people carrying pitchforks and torches?

What is needed is a march to the voting booth.

The most important thing to this crowd is keeping their job. They all say that they're not going to become career politicians (yes, Susan Collins we're talking about you), yet they get into office, become intoxicated with the power and that leads them to focus on raising money and getting re-elected.

If there are no consequences and their seats aren't in play, nothing will ever change.

 

[NotHardUp1]

I predict there will not be any bringing Schiff to the Senate. If the two houses begin dragging one another back and forth, it will break a lot more than just the impeachment process.

Treating a Congressman as a suspect in a trial is pretty stout. There may be no honor among thieves, but I think the Senate and the House are smarter than to do that. God, they had better be.

Senator Byrd's ghost may rise to speak.

 

[NotHardUp1]

Will Hurd is interviewed on Firing Line, and his contention that the Ukrainian officials' denial that they were pressured is sooooooo painful to hear. He says with a straight face that it is disrespectful to them to suggest that they would lie to their countrymen and be subservient to the US.

Honestly?

Get real. Of COURSE they have to lie. That insipid puppet show in New York where Zelensky looked like a dog on a chain with Trump in the other chair was so painful to watch that I still cringe at the memory of it.

Someone stop the shit show. Good grief.

 

[KaraBulut]

We seem to be in this weird place where it's hard to know what is truth and what is part of disinformation campaigns.

Giuliani associate willing to tell Congress Nunes met with ex-Ukrainian official to get dirt on Biden [CNN]

A lawyer for an indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani tells CNN that his client is willing to tell Congress about meetings the top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee had in Vienna last year with a former Ukrainian prosecutor to discuss digging up dirt on Joe Biden.

The attorney, Joseph A. Bondy, represents Lev Parnas, the recently indicted Soviet-born American who worked with Giuliani to push claims of Democratic corruption in Ukraine. Bondy said that Parnas was told directly by the former Ukrainian official that he met last year in Vienna with Rep. Devin Nunes.

Four years ago, I would have read this story and disregarded it as being a conspiracy theory. Now we're in a place where elected representatives like Nunes are such useful idiots, that it's entirely possible that he might have been involved in this... while he was the Chair of the House Intelligence Committee.

 

[Sausy]

Of course Nunes would do this... I spit on him and every other House member who peddles the Ukraine is responsible line. You dishonor your country. Hurd, too... come on, he knows better than that. But for whatever reason, out of anyone to go to the wall for and prop up they have to choose Donald Trump, one of the most disingenuous, self-centered, amoral pieces of shit to ever walk the Earth.

 

[rareboy]

Nunes is as dirty as the rest of the Trump cabal.

Another of Putin's bitches. He probably has a lot of shit to hide as well.

Time to bring him down.

 

[NotHardUp1]

We seem to be in this weird place where it's hard to know what is truth and what is part of disinformation campaigns.

Giuliani associate willing to tell Congress Nunes met with ex-Ukrainian official to get dirt on Biden [CNN]


Four years ago, I would have read this story and disregarded it as being a conspiracy theory. Now we're in a place where elected representatives like Nunes are such useful idiots, that it's entirely possible that he might have been involved in this... while he was the Chair of the House Intelligence Committee.

I know they can spell censure and believe he could be impeached, or recalled. What a bombshell.

 

[KaraBulut]

Nunes is as dirty as the rest of the Trump cabal..

I didn't intend to completely derail the discussion about the impeachment hearings to attribute the problem solely to Nunes.

In general, I found Eric Swalwell's questioning to be disappointing during the hearing, especially for a former district attorney. Toward the end of the hearing, Swalwell asked to have a Daily Beast article entered into the record and he went on to accuse Devin Nunes of being complicit with Guiliani in trying to promote the false narrative against the Bidens. This was a really big accusation- he was accusing the ranking Republican on the House Intelligence Committee of being part of the conspiracy that the House was investigating.

Eric Swalwell calls out Devin Nunes over ties to indicted Giuliani pal at center of Ukraine scandal [Salon]

Rep. Eric Swalwell, D-Calif, called out Rep. Devin Nunes, R-Calif., on Thursday over his links to an indicted associate of Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani who assisted with the effort to pressure Ukraine into launching investigations to help President Donald Trump’s re-election campaign.

Swalwell cited a Daily Beast report that Giuliani business partner Lev Parnas helped Nunes arrange meetings in Europe while the former House Intelligence Committee chairman led an investigation seeking to undermine former special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation into the Trump campaign’s ties to Russia at Thursday’s impeachment hearing.

His comments came after Fiona Hill, the former top Russia expert on the National Security Council, hit out at Republicans on the committee who have pushed a conspiracy theory welcomed by Trump that Ukraine framed Russia in the 2016 election meddling case, which she said “clearly advance[d] Russian interests.”

At first I dismissed the Swalwell accusation as being more partisan bickering. However, the Daily Beast reporter is Betsy Swan who is a legitimate journalist, so the story is worth considering. It's important to keep in mind though that Swan is saying that Parnas' attorney is making these allegations and it's not confirmed to be truth.

Lev Parnas Helped Rep. Devin Nunes’ Investigations [Daily Beast]

Congressional records show Nunes traveled to Europe from Nov. 30 to Dec. 3, 2018. Three of his aides—Harvey, Scott Glabe, and George Pappas—traveled with him, per the records. U.S. government funds paid for the group’s four-day trip, which cost just over $63,000...

Parnas’ assistance to Nunes’ team has not been previously reported. A spokesperson for Nunes did not respond to requests for comment...

This week, House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy told a reporter that he believes that Ukraine could have meddled in the 2016 election after Fiona Hill warned them that this was a disinformation story that originated from the Russian intelligence service.

House GOP disregards expert warnings that debunked Ukraine theory helps Russia [CNN]

But to House Republicans, that's all just a bunch of talk.

Asked after Hill's testimony if he believed Ukraine interfered in the 2016 elections, House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy said: "I think they did."

It's like we're watching a cult of people who believe the earth is flat.

Trump and Giuliani have created a false narrative and counterstory because Trump can't accept that his election was tainted by Russian meddling and disinformation. And there's a group of acolytes in the leadership of the Republican party who are disregarding experts and reports from the US intelligence agencies who are saying that this Ukraine story is a hoax that is being perpetuated by the Russian intelligence services.

The Republicans in charge in the House and Senate are believing Trump over the experts.

Let that sink in for a moment.

 

[Sausy]

Nunes has been aiding Trump since the Mueller investigation. I would hope Eric Swalwell, whom I generally like, would be absolutely sure of the info and not just make the partisan gamesplaying of Republicans mutual.... but watching Nunes completely make an ass out of himself(though frankly he had others just as gleefully doing Trump's bidding... Jim Jordan for one loathsome example) I have no trouble seeing Nunes having a vested interest in protecting Trump as he has acted nothing short of an enabler and defender.

What was Trump doing this week? Meeting with and in one case dining (Susan Collins and Mitt Romney) with Republican US Senators... indeed coordinating with them on potentially how to play out the impeachment trial the Senate is inevitably going to hold. It's such a joke how this is all going down. An obvious conflict of interest when some of the very jury, the members of the US Senate, are working on how to choreograph the trial with the president. Even defenders of Nixon were never this blatant... the President has also trying to use offers of helping vulnerable Republicans with fundraising, of course it would be provided they support him.

 

[rareboy]

So McGahn must testify.

A federal judge in Washington has ruled that former White House counsel Don McGahn must testify to House impeachment investigators, despite orders from the Trump administration that he not cooperate with Congress.

The decision by U.S. District Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson clears the way for McGahn's testimony, sought by House Democrats in exploring Trump's possible obstruction of justice related to the Russia probe.

Jackson declared in her 118-page ruling that "presidents are not kings" and that "no one is above the law."

https://www.npr.org/2019/11/25/7827...6HLrFm7U6ga-0rZXf7I9WIM0TCr3twuM7ntISx-aQ-8MY

I can see TrumpCo. trying to get this one in front of the Supremes as well.......but doubt that it would be a successful gambit.

Now let's see what he's been holding back this time.

 

[KaraBulut]

Trump has a new attorney who is doing public defense of Trump's actions in the Ukraine investigation.

Guess where she came from...

Jenna Ellis, Esq.

 

[rareboy]

Jesus. Wept.

 

[TX-Beau]

Trump has a new attorney who is doing public defense of Trump's actions in the Ukraine investigation.

Guess where she came from...

Jenna Ellis, Esq.

Great, my laptop just got cyber-clap.

 

[KaraBulut]

Geez, she's like syrup of ipecac.

 

[gsdx]

^ I didn't have to Google 'ipecac'. I already knew what it is.

Almost makes you wish Sarah was still in the saddle.

Almost.

 

[Sausy]

Please Miss Lindsey, put a sock in your faux outrage regarding the FBI probe origins... your show is an embarrassment.

 

[Sausy]

Great move by Judiciary committee chairman Jerry Nadler after the Republicans wasted over 14 hours attempting to add frivolous amendments... he wasn't going to give the Republicans the satisfaction of having the final votes in the dark of night, when few viewers would have the stamina to be watching, but instead set the votes to start about 10am when many more would be tuned in. The outrage among Republicans about a "bush league" move like this is rich... the same bozos who had that march into the SCIF to disrupt one of the hearings and made such a production out of the laughable excuse that the Democratic majority were engaged in akin to a Stalinist show trial... when they were trying to get the facts behind the Ukraine debacle acting in the place of a grand jury type investigation. Indeed, the reason they were doing it was because the Justice Department was derelict in its duty and found nothing of interest and wouldn't even look at some very odd and concerning, at the very least, actions precipitated by and/or suggested by President Trump regarding the infamous phone call between President Trump and Ukrainian president Zelensky and the subsequent unexplained hold of nearly $400 million dollars worth of military and technical assistance passed by Congress and absolutely necessary for Ukraine's defense.

The Republicans, who let this charade drag out over 14 hours, were offended and upset by the move to hold the vote tomorrow? Good... let those useless bastards, those flunkies who do Putin's bidding and make him laugh like hell at us.... let them stew and boil. They deserve worse with the damage they are helping perpetrate on the United States. Poor snowflakes, they're offended. What else is new? Offense and outrage is their life blood.

 

[rareboy]

Absolutely sweet move by Nadler.