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Jean Grey is Dead

Rachel always shared a piece of the Phoenix, but she's no longer considered Phoenix. She just has a minor power boost from it. But she's not the avatar.

And I want a real fuckign explanation for why girls at their power levels can manifest the phoenix.
 
i assume it is because the five girls together acting together has the power of an omega mutant.... thats why the phoenix force can attach itself to them...
 
MizuRyuu said:
i assume it is because the five girls together acting together has the power of an omega mutant.... thats why the phoenix force can attach itself to them...
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No. Definitely not. That was shown in New X-Men. Sophie needed Kick to boost their powers when she used Cerebra to fight Quentin. She used all four of the other Cuckoos and was left near death (and Esme finished her off psychically) so they definitely still did not have Omega power levels. It almost killed them to use it so extensively, whereas Emma hardly has a problem with Cerebra and Jean didn't have one either.

I wonder, if Jean comes back, how will she be used in the different titles. Will she become headmistress again? Will she go onto a team and just operate outside? There aren't large groups anymore after M-day, since they pulled in ranks. And trivial things like X-Factor are way too small for her scope of power.
 
i personally wouldn't mind her coming back without pheonix power... and never getting it back either....
 
I stopped buying X-men books around 1999 when Emma started being part of the book. I really stopped even looking through them when Emma mind fucked Scott. I love Jean Grey as much as I hate Emma. If Jean does return than I will also return to the books. I don't care if she is Phoenix or not. I would like to see her leave Scott behind and end up with someone else. Not wolverine though! Who would be a great match for Jean? I haven't been reading the books so I'm not sure what the X-men men are up to dating wise. I think putting her with havok would be a fantastic story! Scott would go nuts!
 
It's not going to happen. The only viable character for Jean is Logan.

Scott is with Emma, Havok is with Polaris, Storm is married to T'Challa, etc.

The real battle was always between her desire for Logan and her love for Scott. If she never went for Logan her third time around it would be unbelievable.

And at this point, I don't think Scott would have Jean back. I think they both know that though they love each other, the issues between them are too great.
 
luminum said:
It's not going to happen. The only viable character for Jean is Logan.

Scott is with Emma, Havok is with Polaris, Storm is married to T'Challa, etc.

The real battle was always between her desire for Logan and her love for Scott. If she never went for Logan her third time around it would be unbelievable.

And at this point, I don't think Scott would have Jean back. I think they both know that though they love each other, the issues between them are too great.
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This is a comic book and anything can happen.You can't really go with logic cause nothing is logical. That's why I love comic books. You never know what will come next.Truly I would like to see Jean have a whole different new life. no scott or logan. I think a new man is just what the doctor ordered. And even if all these couples you mentioned are together they can end at any time.Who would have thought Scott and Jean would end up the way they have? They were marvels second couple.(sue and reed being #1) I just wanna see something fresh with Jean.
 
Sue and Reed are separated because of differences in Civil War.

What I'm saying is that it'd be pretty hard to construct a whole new character who can believably match Jean.

Dropping everything with Logan would be a complete plot gap. There'd have to be some really really phenomenal reason for why she suddenly doesn't care to be in a relationship with him, and short of being a whole new person, I can't see that happening.

Scott and Jean's relationship died pretty well and I think it was always udnerstandable because she was so powerful and Scott just shot lasers out of his eyes, basically. She didn't understand him because she had been through 'greater' things and evils than he had. It was emasculating, and I think everyone int he comic world knew that there wasn't a balance of power there. Scott was the stay at home dad, and Jean was the ball busting millionaire corporate business woman.

But Logan always makes a good foilf or Jean because he can do anything (disgustingly) and he's faced darkness that's somehow equivalent to Jean's.

If they drop all of that when she reappears, it's going to be very fragmented.
 
SUE AND REED BROKE UP?!!!!!!!!!! I had no clue! I'm not reading marvel till Civil war ends. I could not keep track of all the books and plots and didn't want to buy all that. I always liked Marvel but I love DC. I love 52! They were able to make huge changes in one book instead of this Civil war stuff. I'm a hige Jessica Drew fan though. But she seems to be missing from the books. Sorry I got off subject........offtopic:
 
Jessica Drew was working ont he side of Pro-registration but ended up being a double agent for HYDRA, I think. Either way, in the end, she joined up with the underground resistance.

As for Sue and Reed, after Johnny was attacked by civilians and after seeing Hercules get killed by Tony's Thor clone when he said no one would get hurt, Sue couldn't stand it anymore as well as the injustices exhibited upon super humans via Reed's N-Zone prison. So she told Reed ina letter that she loved him and that she and Johnny were joining the Underground and told him that she would leave Franklin and Valeria with Reed in hopes that he'll no longer neglect them and be the man and father he should be.

With Sue on their side, I'm pretty pleased with the ability of the Underground to remain safe.
 
luminum said:
Jessica Drew was working ont he side of Pro-registration but ended up being a double agent for HYDRA, I think. Either way, in the end, she joined up with the underground resistance.

As for Sue and Reed, after Johnny was attacked by civilians and after seeing Hercules get killed by Tony's Thor clone when he said no one would get hurt, Sue couldn't stand it anymore as well as the injustices exhibited upon super humans via Reed's N-Zone prison. So she told Reed ina letter that she loved him and that she and Johnny were joining the Underground and told him that she would leave Franklin and Valeria with Reed in hopes that he'll no longer neglect them and be the man and father he should be.

With Sue on their side, I'm pretty pleased with the ability of the Underground to remain safe.
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Herc is alive and well, thank you. It was Goliath (Bill Foster) who met his demise. Which brings to mind a question before we return to topic:

If the Thor clone was so out of control that it would kill, it would mean it was of unworthy character. Therefore, how was it able to lift Mjolnir?

offtopic:
 
Thanks for the correction. Sorry about that.

I guess I would guess that the clone is identical without the emotions attached to it that Thor had with all the others or the experiences. That's why he has no restraint--he doesn't care about/know any of the opposition and they're only enemies to him. So he's still worthy or wielding Mjolnir, becaue he 'is' Thor. If the clone didn't mind killing anyone, then there'd probably be a worthiness issue.
 
luminum said:
Thanks for the correction. Sorry about that.

I guess I would guess that the clone is identical without the emotions attached to it that Thor had with all the others or the experiences. That's why he has no restraint--he doesn't care about/know any of the opposition and they're only enemies to him. So he's still worthy or wielding Mjolnir, becaue he 'is' Thor. If the clone didn't mind killing anyone, then there'd probably be a worthiness issue.
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Hmmm, brings up an interesting thought about what exactly cloning entails. But that's a whole other thread.

Probably the point I was trying to make is that (here we tie in to the original thread) there's been so much rehashing of plots and changing of backgrounds and "retconning" that it's highly possible the writers (most of whom these days are so young that they don't even know the true history of these characters) don't even know this aspect of Marvel's Thor character. As much as I disagreed with the sacrifice of Dark Phoenix waaaaaaay back in the original X-men #137, I do think it was an extremely powerful and emotional moment that has now been destroyed by her many subsequent deaths and resurrections.
 
Well, technically, Jean's only had one more memorable death (and it's her first if you're strictly talking Jean and not the Phoenix Force's manifestation as her).

She only came back to life once (Phoenix Warsong) and subsequently ascended, instead of dying again.

Right now, I find Psylocke and Colossus's rebirths to be more rediculous.
 
luminum said:
Well, technically, Jean's only had one more memorable death (and it's her first if you're strictly talking Jean and not the Phoenix Force's manifestation as her).

She only came back to life once (Phoenix Warsong) and subsequently ascended, instead of dying again.

Right now, I find Psylocke and Colossus's rebirths to be more rediculous.
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If you're referring to, I believe X-Men #101, that was never technically classified as a "Jean" death. The fact that Jean was still alive but in stasis and the body that arose from the water on the infamous cover by the recently departed Dave Cockrum was really the Phoenix force was a ret-con created to allow the original 5 to come back together as "X-Factor." I never read Warsong because as I said, I've been a bit disappointed by this repetitive cycle.
 
Oops, sorry, I mean Endsong.

Endsong just existed to give Scott and Jean closure with their relationship since she basically just died and then ascended at the end of New X-Men after she found out about Scott and Emma and they never really talked after that.
 
dr_beat said:
Herc is alive and well, thank you. It was Goliath (Bill Foster) who met his demise. Which brings to mind a question before we return to topic:

If the Thor clone was so out of control that it would kill, it would mean it was of unworthy character. Therefore, how was it able to lift Mjolnir?

offtopic:
Click to expand...

That was the clone of Mjolnir too! (!)

Seriously, It was a technologicall version of it (for what I read about it)

Damn, in Brazil we are still in the House of M and I know about these things #-o I am a huge geek

Can anyone tell me what happened with the real thor and how colossus and psilocke ressurected?
 
BlueLantern said:
That was the clone of Mjolnir too! (!)

Seriously, It was a technologicall version of it (for what I read about it)

Damn, in Brazil we are still in the House of M and I know about these things #-o I am a huge geek

Can anyone tell me what happened with the real thor and how colossus and psilocke ressurected?
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How did they clone the hammer?
Did they have a chip of it to get it's dna? Besides, it's forged from metal, so it wouldn't have dna. How did it get Mjolnir's laser power?
 
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