Lets just say it: The 1% took all our fucking money! Deflation looms.

[Kyanimal]

O.K.! I'll admit it! This is really ALL My fault!

Several weeks ago, I decided to take a look at my 401K results. I noticed that the aggressive managed fund, I was completely invested in, was not doing quite as well as several funds on their own.

SO ... I broke things up, and diversified into small cap, medium cap, and indexed funds, while still holding onto a portion of the general managed fund.

The only problem with that was, they were all Pimco!

Moments after I'd entered my changes, which would take a while, Bill Gross, a vaunted "One Percenter", left Pimco for Janus! With MY "Luck", that just figured! Pimco immediately lost a huge percentage of it's value! Bill absconded with my bucks!

Following that inevitability, because I made a change (karma), the global economy went into free fall!

Sorry about that!

Now we all have to wait until the (hopefully) rising tide will, again, lift all boats, no matter what their size.

 

[peeonme]

O.K.! I'll admit it! This is really ALL My fault!

Several weeks ago, I decided to take a look at my 401K results. I noticed that the aggressive managed fund, I was completely invested in, was not doing quite as well as several funds on their own.

SO ... I broke things up, and diversified into small cap, medium cap, and indexed funds, while still holding onto a portion of the general managed fund.

The only problem with that was, they were all Pimco!

Moments after I'd entered my changes, which would take a while, Bill Gross, a vaunted "One Percenter", left Pimco for Janus! With MY "Luck", that just figured! Pimco immediately lost a huge percentage of it's value! Bill absconded with my bucks!

Following that inevitability, because I made a change (karma), the global economy went into free fall!

Sorry about that!

Now we all have to wait until the (hopefully) rising tide will, again, lift all boats, no matter what their size.

I just wish that they would leave my dinghy alone!

 

[Kyanimal]

I just wish that they would leave my dinghy alone!

I wish my dinghy worked as well as it did when I was Younger!

 

[peeonme]

And, in the "end" it's all about the American dinghy, the envy of the world!

 

[bankside]

The U.S. is the Most Overworked Developed Nation in the World – When do we Draw the Line?

The woman who lives next door works longer hours than I do and gets paid more probably than my guy and I put together. But she also has more leisure time than us. While we're mowing the lawn and vacuuming the carpet and walking the dog, she's reading a book while her landscapers rake leaves, her housekeeper straightens up the kitchen, and the other neighbours' kid walks her dogs for pocket money.

Paid employment is hardly the whole picture of "effort."

 

[Benvolio]

Free INTERPRISE made America great, not free trade, the US constitution provides power to congress to levy tariffs, this was put in place to keep a balance of trade with the rest of the world.

As odd as it may seem I have no trouble with cars from Japan or Korea, Ford, G.M. and Chrysler did not flip off the American worker and move their plants over to Asia. Japan and others beat Detroit at it's own game with better products, made on their shores.

What I have a problem with is when I by a washing machine that has always been know to have been made in the US, then after a year it breaks down and the repair man lets me know that they started making them in China a year before I bought mine and that they aren't "as good".

So we the fat lazy Americans, get screwed when the jobs go to China and we get screwed when the inferior washing machine is shipped back to our shores, might I add that the savings that the manufacturer experienced are not reflected in a lower price on that damned washing machine.

It is the job of the US congress to represent it's constituents, if that means keeping Americans in a standard of living that makes the rest of the world emulate us that's fine by me, they can strive to find greatness, build a better mouse trap, you don't have to do away with the middle class of one nation to lift the poor of another.

The success of foreign autos and the foreign production of the appliances are great victories for the labor bosses. They waged war against the employers and won the war. Unions are an idea whose time has come and gone. They had a brief period of success in the 50s and 60s, but they didn't know when to stop squeezing. Now the high paying Union jobs are largely a thing go the past, never to return.

 

[peeonme]

Before I call it a night and go to bed I have to say that there is a certain irony in the argument that has been made stating that the only way to bring up the standard of living for one group is to bring down the standard of living for another.

In the USA, the conservatives constantly accuse us liberals of wanting to "take" from the wealthy and just "give" it to the poor.
Yet, the same conservatives have no trouble in thinking it's just fine to take from the middle class, pull the rug from under their feet let them lose their homes and adjust to a standard an income way below what they WORKED their way up to so they can raise the standard of living for another people in another country.

Can we get real? It's all about money, more money in the hands of fewer people, no middle class, anywhere. Just the rich and the workers.

The wealthy seeing the world as it's plantation, seeing the workers as their property.

I retired, you would think that I would just shut up about the injustice and live out my days, but unfortunately for me it's not the way that I am wired, life would be easier if I could dummy up and pretend that globalization is the best thing since sliced bread.
I hope that I never reach a place where I say "fuck it, who cares" because that's the attitude that allowed our leaders to sign NAFTA,
GATT and enter the WTO.

 

[bankside]

I promise you if the US had not signed NAFTA, Canada would have signed the deal with South Korea 20 years ago instead and we and South Korea would be prospering merrily along while the US would be in worse shape than it is now, sulking behind its borders with no access to some of its biggest trading partners, and biggest trading opportunities. It still might happen that way.

If you want to know where US middle class prosperity went, it was not to India or China or Canada or Mexico. US middle-class wealth was fashioned into bombs and then dropped on the citizens and infrastructure of Iraq by Bush Junior.

It is also not in dispute that the wealth of the world has grown hugely, massively, joyously, since 1980. This is nothing to do with dividing up American pie and feeding it to the foreigners. This is not a zero sum game. But no American, even struggling to hang on to a middle class life, can pretend to be hard done by when he compares his situation to someone growing up in most other countries of the world. The US is entitled to its share of that bigger economy, and its citizens are entitled to an equitable distribution of their own personal share of that based on the effort they put in. But, no, there's no way the US middle class would ascend limitlessly forever like it did in the 1950s, until the rest of the world's middle class catches up. It's not real-world.

By the way my washer and dryer are actually from Korea. The car is from Japan. The computer's designed in the States but made in China with Korean parts. I think I'm sitting on an American sofa. And I'm not worried one damn bit that these things were not made in my city.

If you'd rather the computer and the sofa came from Korea too, by all means, please put up your tariff barriers.

 

[evanrick]

I promise you if the US had not signed NAFTA, Canada would have signed the deal with South Korea 20 years ago instead and we and South Korea would be prospering merrily along while the US would be in worse shape than it is now, sulking behind its borders with no access to some of its biggest trading partners, and biggest trading opportunities. It still might happen that way.

If you want to know where US middle class prosperity went, it was not to India or China or Canada or Mexico. US middle-class wealth was fashioned into bombs and then dropped on the citizens and infrastructure of Iraq by Bush Junior.

It is also not in dispute that the wealth of the world has grown hugely, massively, joyously, since 1980. This is nothing to do with dividing up American pie and feeding it to the foreigners. This is not a zero sum game. But no American, even struggling to hang on to a middle class life, can pretend to be hard done by when he compares his situation to someone growing up in most other countries of the world. The US is entitled to its share of that bigger economy, and its citizens are entitled to an equitable distribution of their own personal share of that based on the effort they put in. But, no, there's no way the US middle class would ascend limitlessly forever like it did in the 1950s, until the rest of the world's middle class catches up. It's not real-world.

By the way my washer and dryer are actually from Korea. The car is from Japan. The computer's designed in the States but made in China with Korean parts. I think I'm sitting on an American sofa. And I'm not worried one damn bit that these things were not made in my city.

If you'd rather the computer and the sofa came from Korea too, by all means, please put up your tariff barriers.

tldr i still blame the 1% blame shifting apologies

 

[peeonme]

The success of foreign autos and the foreign production of the appliances are great victories for the labor bosses. They waged war against the employers and won the war. Unions are an idea whose time has come and gone. They had a brief period of success in the 50s and 60s, but they didn't know when to stop squeezing. Now the high paying Union jobs are largely a thing go the past, never to return.

I am not arguing for the union, in my younger days I spent 3 months at an assembly plant, it was mind numbing work, I hated it.
Back in those days the disparity in pay between an auto workers pay and a non union job was minimal. I opted to leave the security of the union and sought a trade as a machinist, after about 4 years of learning I found a good job in a medium sized company in 1980
with shift premium and cola (cost of living adjustment) I made 13.25 per hour, in todays money that would be 38.25.
This was a non union skilled job.

Over the years my skills went one way as I aspired to learn and hone in my skills, my pay went the other way. At one time I made more money than non skilled union workers, it was because our system worked. Union wages are artificial, based upon a threat of a strike and loss of production, hence loss of profit and revenue.

Real wages are based upon the law of supply and demand, if there are fewer skilled works than there are non skilled workers, they are worth more.

However, if you increase the number of workers in a market by flooding the market with products made out side of that market you artificially hold down the wages of the workers, there is no such thing as "free trade". America is seen as the market place to sell, Asia
is seen as the place to produce.

It has become a one way street, make it in China, dump it in America. Americans sooner or later will run out of discretionary income to buy the foreign goods, already some people in the working class drive without insurance, have no health insurance and rent because buying a home is out of reach.

The other nations aren't gaining, America is losing.

 

[hotatlboi]

America is still first in entrepreneurship.

http://www.businessinsider.com/best-country-to-be-an-entrepreneur-2013-8

If you don't like the salary you are making, find a way to contribute something else of value. It's never been easier than today to do so as you can reach the entire world easily.

 

[evanrick]

America is still first in entrepreneurship.

http://www.businessinsider.com/best-country-to-be-an-entrepreneur-2013-8

If you don't like the salary you are making, find a way to contribute something else of value. It's never been easier than today to do so as you can reach the entire world easily.

there are plenty of anti-free market laws on the books, much of them designed to people who pretend to support the free market.
its 1984 folks.

 

[hotatlboi]

there are plenty of anti-free market laws on the books, much of them designed to people who pretend to support the free market.
its 1984 folks.

If you are that convinced that the system is destined to keep you down, it probably will.

 

[bankside]

I am not arguing for the union, in my younger days I spent 3 months at an assembly plant, it was mind numbing work, I hated it.
Back in those days the disparity in pay between an auto workers pay and a non union job was minimal. I opted to leave the security of the union and sought a trade as a machinist, after about 4 years of learning I found a good job in a medium sized company in 1980
with shift premium and cola (cost of living adjustment) I made 13.25 per hour, in todays money that would be 38.25.
This was a non union skilled job.

Over the years my skills went one way as I aspired to learn and hone in my skills, my pay went the other way. At one time I made more money than non skilled union workers, it was because our system worked. Union wages are artificial, based upon a threat of a strike and loss of production, hence loss of profit and revenue.

Real wages are based upon the law of supply and demand, if there are fewer skilled works than there are non skilled workers, they are worth more.

However, if you increase the number of workers in a market by flooding the market with products made out side of that market you artificially hold down the wages of the workers, there is no such thing as "free trade". America is seen as the market place to sell, Asia
is seen as the place to produce.

It has become a one way street, make it in China, dump it in America. Americans sooner or later will run out of discretionary income to buy the foreign goods, already some people in the working class drive without insurance, have no health insurance and rent because buying a home is out of reach.

The other nations aren't gaining, America is losing.

There is no such thing as a foreign market. The number of potential workers in this market is the same as the number of consumers: about 7 billion.

 

[evanrick]

If you are that convinced that the system is destined to keep you down, it probably will.

didnt realize there were so many millionaires in this thread.

 

[EastMed]

Political participation is an important factor.

our representative democracy is not as representative as it could be. Relative to other income groups, the wealthy are overrepresented in the political process simply because they're more likely to participate in it. This means that political debates -- and political outcomes -- are much more reflective of the interests of a wealthy minority than they are of the middling majority.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-is-way-more-politically-active-than-you-are/

 

[peeonme]

There is no such thing as a foreign market. The number of potential workers in this market is the same as the number of consumers: about 7 billion.

Now, let's be real about this, most goods are sold in America, this is the consumer market. Most of these goods are produced in Asia,
the place of cheap/slave labor.

So, in effect, it is easy to conclude that the workers of Asia who produced these goods have been "added" to the market where they are sold, making the workers of the purchasing marketplace less valuable.

I know that we could have a "Kumbayah" moment and believe that the world is one big community, that we are all one, yes just brothers and sisters... but it ain't so.

If that were to be the case the US government would just ask for some money back from the Chinese communist government and it would be done, "here it is my brother" but that doesn't happen, we borrow money from them, that they made in America at Wal Mart and other big box stores and pay them interest on money made in our market, in sales, produced by their market place of workers.

 

[bankside]

Now, let's be real about this, most goods are sold in America, this is the consumer market.

Okay now I get it. The issue here is you're misinformed about the economy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_markets


http://techcrunch.com/2013/01/23/apple-international-sales/

 

[bankside]

Lets be real about this. GM depends on China for most of its sales.

http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/.../us/en/2014/Jan/0114_2013gm-global-sales.html

 

[peeonme]

Okay now I get it. The issue here is you're misinformed about the economy.

No, you don't get "it". I just don't buy the misinformation and propaganda that has been used to get people to go along with so called "free trade".

I know of no other government in the history of mankind that intentionally put it's own people out of work and lowered their standard of living, only the "bought and paid for" guys in Washington D.C.

"Oh, but the rest of the world will do better" this is B.S., the communist government of China has done well, we now are indebted to them, we lost jobs and tax revenue, our cities look like war zones, we can't fix our roads, we borrow money to fight wars that the wealthy make money on, I GET IT.

Our streets are decorated with the homeless, it's common for a worker to qualify for food stamps, we have a piss poor anemic access to health care I GET IT.

You believe in the one world, global trade, screw the American system, I don't.

I am somewhat like the rich guy, I ask myself "if I give it all away, who then can I help?" America has given it away, dropped the soap in the shower of global trade.