Need for advice

[G-Lexington]

Hey, haven't we met?

Just wanted to add a bit more to the running dialogue. I know some guys, early in their questioning-sexuality phase, think that if they're gay, they won't like women. At all. As if to be gay is to be misogynist. And yeah, there's a couple gay guys who are like "Girls? Ew - icky!" But that's not true of most of us. I've got plenty of female friends. Some of them are quite attractive. At least two of them, I'd venture to say, are fucking gorgeous. I can see that, I can recognize that, I can even tell them that.

But that's it. They don't make me horny, I don't want to have sex with them. They're just my friends.

Lex

 

[Stitch627]

it was an usurper

 

[Stitch627]

Did I use the word "disgusted"? If so, I shouldn't have. It's not the actual way I feel.
I'd say that sometimes I feel it isn't right or the way I should behave.

Do you feel that doing this is turning you into a gay ?

Yes, I think so

 

[Stitch627]

I can well understand what you are saying.
This is what used to happen with me. I'd get horny and watch some gay porn. Straight afterwards I would feel angry with myself and say, 'right, thats the last time I'm ever doing that. Watching this gay stuff is making me gay. I don't want to be gay. I'm not like those gay guys. I want to get married and have kids'.

I must admit. It's sort of what I feel.

Welcome hotcock! I'm glad to find someone feeling the same way as I do.
I understand so much all you've just said, so I think we may help each other.
Btw, I've just answered u in PM.

Just finished the 24 season premier.

never seen any episode...

I never just lived for the moment and for the next step rather than living 10 years ahead of now.

I can't imagine how my life will be 10 years ahead of now. I've never been able to think forward. Probably because I don't know what I want right now.
But on the other hand I believe I have a "dream vision" of what I'd like.
And that's also part of the problem, for I often dream things as they should be and I'm generally disappointed.

I can say though that whenever I look at a guy or watch gay porn, I do not have any emotional attraction to the guy.

but can one have emotions for a guy on a screen??

I completely agree with you that I won't find out until something actually happens physically or emotionally

This is so true. But it is so difficult at the same time. On the one hand I think I won't find out until something happens, but on the other hand I also believe nothing might happen until I do not feel more comfortable with who I am. I feel I'm at a deadlock.

I thought the exact same thing. The last thing I would want to do is start a marriage or family and be shallow enough and be "friendly" with another guy since it appears to me as cheating. However, from reading stories and such, it appears that married men sometimes jerk off with other married and single men. I'm not sure if that would be cheating since it just seems like two close friends bonding and enjoying each others company on a more personal level than just regular friends.

I don't know ... sounds weird to me ...
what difference do u make between:
- being "friendly" with another guy = cheating
- being close friends and jerking off together = not cheating

 

[tominstl]

Stitch you are in the same boat that many if not most of us have been in at one time or another. I know I might be echoing some of the previous comments, but you need to focus on a few fundamental lessons to learn for yourself.

1) It seems to me that you spend a whole lot of time thinking about what other people might think. When you enjoy gay porn until you suddenly think that you are doing something wrong and switch away from it, you are really saying "I am not supposed to be doing this." But really, by whose standards? When you try to fit yourself into a certain role (bi, gay, straight,e tc.) it seems to me that you are trying to fit yourself into how you will be "seen" by others.

2) You have to start from a place of understanding that you are who you are and as long as you are not desiring something which would hurt someone else, then whatever you are is all good. Of course, you have to learn who you are and that only happens by experience. You are in a new city with new people and not carrying your whole past into every encounter. Meet people and be open and honest. Lots of them will not be interested or have issues...ok fine, move on to others. Meet people as friends and from the start just be yourself. You will find that you will naturally tend to gravitate into groups of similar people. With those, have fun and experiment. In todays world, if you find that you always end up stopping yourself out of fear, then try first meeting and chatting online extensively with someone and talk about all these things before meeting. (easier to talk when first anonymous.)
3) Look back over your life and see if you can find repeated patterns of avoiding revealing yourself to people. Generally, if that is happening, then you are afraid of being rejected for something that you feel and are ashamed of. Like all the guys here have said, you do not need to be ashamed of being gay or bi and there are lots of people that will love the fact that you are. If you are not able to look at your life analytically, then find a counselor to help work through all that in an organized way.
4) Give yourself some credit for being open and sharing of your feelings here. That took some strength, and it really is a great first step to taken on the issues responsibly.

 

[Stitch627]

Stitch you are in the same boat that many if not most of us have been in at one time or another.

Yes probably, I mean yes, but I can't help but feel all alone in this boat

1) It seems to me that you spend a whole lot of time thinking about what other people might think. When you enjoy gay porn until you suddenly think that you are doing something wrong and switch away from it, you are really saying "I am not supposed to be doing this." But really, by whose standards?

Yes, it's true that what other people may think matters a lot to me... ok but on the other hand I'd say f*ck them all. But yes in my opinion and I might sound superficial, the image u have is important.
and which standards? those from the culture, education and society, what you can read in books, what you watch in movies, what you see in magazines, what you see in the street, what other people seem to experience

Meet people and be open and honest.

ok I agree, but it's difficult to be entirely honest. When I meet someone that may become a friend, I'm not gonna tell him/her "you know I'm kinda lost in my life and sexually confused" or if he/she asks me "are u straight or gay?" I'm not gonna answer "well ... i dunno, inbetween ...". Be oneself isn't always easy

3) Look back over your life and see if you can find repeated patterns of avoiding revealing yourself to people. Generally, if that is happening, then you are afraid of being rejected for something that you feel and are ashamed of. Like all the guys here have said, you do not need to be ashamed of being gay or bi and there are lots of people that will love the fact that you are. If you are not able to look at your life analytically, then find a counselor to help work through all that in an organized way.

yeah, I can find repeated patterns. At the beginning you think that's because of this specific environment, the people at that time. But when it repeats, you begin to think that it may be u.
I think I'm pretty good at analyzing myself but I can't manage to draw the conclusions or implement them

4) Give yourself some credit for being open and sharing of your feelings here. That took some strength, and it really is a great first step to taken on the issues responsibly.

that's what I'm trying hard to do

 

[Stitch627]

Stitch, I was just wondering if it is necessary to find a label for yourself, as I think G-Lex said earlier. There are heaps of guys here where the 'door swings both ways' (ie bisexual).

Yeah I know a label isn't necessary, but it's difficult not to think about it.
Overthinking or overquestionning doesn't actually help.

When you say you have feeling issues, are you able to explain in more detail what you mean by that in regards to women ? For example, do you feel you are sexually attracted to women ?

what do I mean by feeling issues?? good question
well I'm not sure I can explain but I'll try...
I think I could sum it all up with this question:
Why have I never really felt for someone?
and the countra-questions would be:
Am I cold-hearted? I don't think so. I'd even say the contrary.
Am I too introverted? well maybe, but still, I could have felt for someone and not have been able to talk to this person about my feelings
Do I have a misconception of what I should feel? I hope not, if so it would be very sad
Am I too picky? yes probably, and at the same time it may be a kind of unconscious defense system
Do I unconsciously avoid feeling for someone? dunno

I'd just like to add this next sentence I found in the thread entitled "Former deniers ... at what point did you submit ?" (I can't submit links yet)
I really could have written it:

I looked back on earlier friendships, and realized how I would get avoidant and distant at the point where I got too close to people.

As for your second question, do I feel sexually attracted to women? good question too
well I don't know what to answer. I would answer yes, I think so. But at the same time, have I ever been really sexually attracted to one girl? can't answer

 

[Stitch627]

Hey Hotcock, thanx for cheering up and sharing the ride in this damn boat!

And wow great post, so true and meaningful. You sound like a very smart guy and I’d even say quite serene. It seems u already did a terrific job on yourself.

And u know in junior high school, I was sort of chubby. So I can understand. I had a lot of complexes. I've changed since then, but I think my complexes still haven’t totally vanished yet.

About the way others can see u, I believe that the main point is actually to work on the way you see yourself. As you said, you’re your worst enemy. On my mind, once you accept yourself the way you are, once you know who you are and what you want, you don’t care that much about the others. But first, you have to reach this point.

I think that we need to get more self-confidence and let ourselves go. I feel I’ve missed a lot and lost too much time. I want to enjoy my life and experiment. I know the questions as well as some answers. I don’t want to think anymore. I now need to find where to begin with and to push myself, which isn’t easy. But I’m glad to talk about it.

I'm not into that. I'm more into the idea of bonding, helping each other out, and arousing each other kind of thing...if that makes sense.

It makes totally sense. That’s so not the way I see things either.

I don't know if any of this helped... Trust me though, I'm still in that boat with you... don't capsize please!! hehehe. We'll work on this together okay?

It helps! It's great to share our experiences.
And even if sometimes I could have said what you say, it’s different to hear it from someone else.
And be sure I'll stay in that boat, I don't wanna capsize and I won't!!

NB: I will never look at a pizza the same way I used to

 

[Stitch627]

Do you know what Stitch ? I think we're back to the advice that Eagle gave you at the beginning.

I'm thinking about it. I'm going back to the university next week. I'll see...

I know in my case, although I was in denial about my sexuality, I didn't have problems relating to or getting close to women. It was just that I'm not attracted to them.

I don't have a problem relating to women. On the contrary, I'd say that I usually get along more easily with girls. But I've never been one step further.

Stitch one of the major problems you face is your misconception of gays.

it's very likely...

 

[Stitch627]

that's it. I've just made an appointment to the counseling service of my university
next Monday at 2pm
man i was so stressed out...

I've been thinking a lot about all this lately, even though I have still not come to a "decision". But this time, i don't want to bury everything deep down

I found this article about "Handling Insecurity"
w.livestrong.com/article/14655-handling-insecurity/
and even if i wouldn't use this name of insecurity, because I do not feel insecure, i think some parts of what is said apply to me.
So maybe as mentioned earlier, I have 2 issues: "insecurity" + sexual confusion.
I dunno. Is one the consequence or the reason for the other one? Are they separated or mixed up? Do they aggravate each other?

I also found a brochure "I THINK I MIGHT BE GAY ... NOW WHAT DO I DO?" on the website Outproud
and there was this list of question:

If you think you might be gay, ask yourself:

1. When I dream or fantasize sexually, is it about boys or girls?
2. Have I ever had a crush or been in love with a boy or a man?
3. Do I feel different than other guys?
4. Are my feelings for boys and men true and clear?

So, here would be my answers:
1. boys
2. love = no ; crush = I might have had one but not sure
3. yes
4. i don't know what to answer, I'm not even sure to understand the question

And what about the fact that I'm interested in watching gay themed documentary or movies? I mean not porn. I think I try to get another image of homosexuality, different from the stereotypes we are used to, maybe an image with which I could identify... dunno. But it's not something straight guy usually do, is it?
U know for example, in Desperate Housewives, I think it's great to show gay guys with "normal" lifes and behaviors, and not the usual cliche

 

[megustamyn]

It may help you to talk with other guys about the things you're feeling and thinking. There is an organization in New York called Identity House (http://www.identityhouse.org/) that runs both walk-in groups and themed groups.

Anyone can attend an walk-in group (separate groups for men and women). In the walk-in groups guys just talk about whatever comes up. Generally they have an opening round during which each guy introduces himself and says if there is anything specific he wants to talk about. You may choose to pass, or just say hello or give a fake name; whatever makes you comfortable. Then the facilitator, with consensus from the group, will lead a discussion on the topics that have come up. No one is required to participate in the discussion. Some guys just listen. There are guys who attend regularly and others who go only once. You do what works for you. Some guys go for coffee afterwards as a group, others simply leave without speaking to anyone. There is no pressure.

The themed groups are closed groups for which people sign up and commit to attend for the duration of the group, usually 6 to 8 weeks. Popular topics are coming out, dating, and building a gay life. What is offered depends on the demand.

The facilitators are volunteers but they receive extensive training and are required to be part of supervision groups as long as they are active facilitators.

I was involved with Identity House for several years, first as a group participant when I first started to learn about the gay community and later as a group facilitator. It was very helpful to me and many other people I know. It is not therapy, it's simply a place where people can find support from others who are in similar situation. They can provide referrals to therapists for those who need them.

There are other similar agencies in NYC, Identity House is just the one I am most familiar with. Visit their website and see what you think.

 

[Stitch627]

Today was my first session, 45 min
And I must confess I was a little stressed out (ok a lot) and I was no longer sure if it was a good idea. I felt like my mind was empty.
But actually she was not too scary, and I even talked more than what I had expected. I think we talked about all I had in mind, not deeply for sure but I think she had a good overview of my situation.
And, she asked me about relationships and even sexual orientation, fortunately because I'm not sure I would have had the guts to bring that up. So I told her the truth
Hope it's gonna be helpful...

 

[PantryChef]

"I think too much. It’s high time I do something."
Thinking too much beats not thinking at all and I'm sure you have fag hags swarming around you like flies on stink, *since chicks are all into that kind of self-analysis, but honey ...

You made it clear that,*"I must confess gay porn really turns me on."

Don't torture yourself. *If you like a girl, go for it. *If you like a guy, go for it. *Bisexuality is the natural state. If you want a family, find a girl who accepts you the way you are. *They're out there.

Best Wishes