New Pope Breaks With Basic Foundation of Christianity ... You Don't Have to Believe To Go To Heaven

[Jack Springer]

"The Pope has struck a surprisingly conciliatory tone towards atheists and agnostics, saying that God will "forgive" them as long as they behave morally and live according to their consciences."
......

"The Pope wrote: "The question for those who do not believe in God is to follow their own conscience. Sin, even for a non-believer, is when one goes against one's conscience."To listen and to follow your conscience means that you understand the difference between good and evil."


He said that the "mercy of God has no limits" and encompassed even non-believers, but his remarks failed to impress the Italian Union of Atheists and Agnostics."

From what the Pope says it appears that RC's no longer believe that Jesus is the only way to Heaven. This is a major change from the common beliefs of all Christians. You could almost say that the Pope is no longer a Christian.

It's taking PC to the extreme and abandoning all your beliefs and doctrine. I don't think this will go over well with the everyday RC since most have been taught that RC is the only true religion. I don't think this Pope will be Pope for a long time.

I'm surprised I have not seen this elsewhere.

One of the Pope's assistants has also recently said that priests may be able to marry.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/rel...is-reaches-out-to-atheists-and-agnostics.html[/FONT]

 

[medic1]

Popes cannot be dismissed . They can retire , as did Benedict , though even this is very very rare . It is normally a position that you hold , until the day of his Death .

 

[Yuki Sohma]

Who is this Pope this Pope Francis?

 

[medic1]

Who is this Pope this Pope Francis?

Yes this is Francis..............

 

[kallipolis]

The Catechism of the Catholic Church:

1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c1a6.htm

In other words Pope Francis is merely reflecting the teachings of his church; nothing new here.

Belief in God must be actively revealed in our actions...it is no accident that the two great commandments, command the believer to love God, and love our neighbour...as our self....thus, without loving our fellow human being we cannot love God.

Very many atheists that I know, and have known over the years despite denying the existence of God have proven to me that God works in their life when they sacrifice something of their life to serve the needs of other human beings. Theists do not hold a monopoly on altruistic actions.

There are many married priests within the Catholic Church, there being some 23 distinct Catholic churches in union with The Pope.

Eastern Rite Catholic priests may marry. Monks may not marry. Bishops may not marry. The Latin Rite (Roman) Catholic Church does not permit married clergy, although exceptions are regularly made for married clergy who convert from other Christian denominations to the Latin Rite Catholic Church, enabling them to be ordained though they are married with children.

Mandatory celibacy for Roman Catholic priests is a tradition not a dogma of faith with many exceptions to prove this fact of life.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_Church

Catholics believe that the Apostle Simon Peter was the first pope; Holy Scripture informs us that he was married, and so were most of the original 12 apostles.

 

[palbert]

You can change the ornament atop the Christmas tree but the tree remain the same.

 

[kallipolis]

You can change the ornament atop the Christmas tree but the tree remain the same.

Appearances are in one's own mind for the matter is not the tree but how one perceives the tree reflecting ones own prejudices.

 

[palbert]

Appearances are in one's own mind for the matter is not the tree but how one perceives the tree reflecting ones own prejudices.

I am surprised you cast my post as prejudiced. It is well known it is extremely difficult to change the middle and lower management, as well as workers, so that it executes the intent of top management. Frustration of the "new way" can also be evidenced in top management.

 

[kallipolis]

I am surprised you cast my post as prejudiced. It is well known it is extremely difficult to change the middle and lower management, as well as workers, so that it executes the intent of top management. Frustration of the "new way" can also be evidenced in top management.

The warmth of a naturally, charismatic leader can rapidly change the environment for their flock to note the difference.

To believe otherwise, is to ignore the import of Jack Springer's judgemental response to Pope Francis' refreshing good news.

Preach the Gospel at all times and when necessary use words ~ attributed to Francis of Assisi

 

[Jack Springer]

I'm totally blown away. Christians believe that the only way to salvation is through belief in Jesus Christ. Christians don't believe that being 'good' gets you into heaven.

I know many Catholics who would disagree with the Pope on this.

It just shows to me that the direction the RC was going before and after the Reformation is one that is more away from the true Church.

The Roman Catholic church has abandoned the 'catholic' church.

 

[bankside]

palbert, i am not in the least surprised.

Atheists have made very good points about the ability to be ethical without the need for divine approval, and without reference to a standard of conduct imagined to be divine. We see in Mr. Bergoglio's response a defensive effort to say "Ahh but this conduct is secretly Godly after all." I say "defensive" in that evidently the atheist message that ethics are open to everyone is putting the Catholic [STRIKE]revenue stream[/STRIKE] parishioners in doubt.

 

[Jack Springer]

Would it be accepted if the Pope announced he was an atheist?

 

[kallipolis]

I'm totally blown away. Christians believe that the only way to salvation is through belief in Jesus Christ. Christians don't believe that being 'good' gets you into heaven.

I know many Catholics who would disagree with the Pope on this.

It just shows to me that the direction the RC was going before and after the Reformation is one that is more away from the true Church.

The Roman Catholic church has abandoned the 'catholic' church.

Many theists profess to be Christians whereas, their lives and their priorities indicate otherwise.

Jesus put it this way; “By their fruits you will know them."

For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead.~James 2:26

It is easy to believe, another reality to implement into ones life our need to live our faith in God, through personal sacrifice.

Of course, Jack your reference is the following...read the complete text for it is good works which God prepares for us:


8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.~Ephesians 2

God works through all his human creation, even those who believe, that there is no God....for to believe otherwise, is to deny the omnipotence of God, and the love he has for all human life, no exceptions.

 

[kallipolis]

palbert, i am not in the least surprised.

Atheists have made very good points about the ability to be ethical without the need for divine approval, and without reference to a standard of conduct imagined to be divine. We see in Mr. Bergoglio's response a defensive effort to say "Ahh but this conduct is secretly Godly after all." I say "defensive" in that evidently the atheist message that ethics are open to everyone is putting the Catholic [STRIKE]revenue stream[/STRIKE] parishioners in doubt.

Pope Francis makes it crystal clear that in good conscience even atheists can reflect the will of God, into their life by living the life of the good samaritan not reserved for those who say, that they believe in God....for it is by our deeds that we are known, not by our intentions revealed in the words, I believe.

 

[kallipolis]

Would it be accepted if the Pope announced he was an atheist?

At one time Pope Francis may well have been atheist whereas, today he declares himself to be a theist.

 

[bankside]

Pope Francis makes it crystal clear that in good conscience even atheists can reflect the will of God, into their life by living the life of the good samaritan not reserved for those who say, that they believe in God....for it is by our deeds that we are known, not by our intentions revealed in the words, I believe.

No, this pope asserts this, certainly, but without any clarity, and without any foundation.

 

[sixthson]

I'm totally blown away. Christians believe that the only way to salvation is through belief in Jesus Christ. Christians don't believe that being 'good' gets you into heaven.

I know many Catholics who would disagree with the Pope on this.

It just shows to me that the direction the RC was going before and after the Reformation is one that is more away from the true Church.

The Roman Catholic church has abandoned the 'catholic' church.

The Catholic church has never taught that faith alone in Jesus Christ brings salvation. They have always taught faith plus works are necessary and that the sacrifice of Christ on the cross is insufficient. For them, there is no salvation apart from the mass, the eucharist, etc, etc. However, the Pope is taking it further than this. He is saying that faith is totally unnecessary and that good works are all that's necessary to be right with God, even if they don't believe in Him. He is a heretic, which is not so unusual for Catholic Popes.

Let us not confuse Biblical Christianity with Roman Catholicism.

 

[kallipolis]

No, this pope asserts this, certainly, but without any clarity, and without any foundation.

Says, you, whereas Pope Francis chooses to reflect the Gospel message that justice, and mercy are the perogatives of God whose love for all mankind is never restricted by our perceptions that he favours only those who say they believe.

 

[kallipolis]

The Catholic church has never taught that faith alone in Jesus Christ brings salvation. They have always taught faith plus works are necessary and that the sacrifice of Christ on the cross is insufficient. For them, there is no salvation apart from the mass, the eucharist, etc, etc. However, the Pope is taking it further than this. He is saying that faith is totally unnecessary and that good works are all that's necessary to be right with God, even if they don't believe in Him. He is a heretic, which is not so unusual for Catholic Popes.

Let us not confuse Biblical Christianity with Roman Catholicism.

Dan, nonsense, try educating your self.....by reading scripture without those spectacles built with years of prejudices to warp your field of sight

 

[sixthson]

Oh, I forgot, only you are educated.