Not being around my best friend makes me sick....

[silpmn]

I met a friend like early this year or late last year...I knew who he was and I'd seen him around and stuff, but I never really talked to him because I'm really shy and don't really talk to new people.

It wasn't really an instant friendship...but we did connect. It took a while before we became good friends. Then a couple months ago I went to his house (I'd been there several times before) and we really, really connected (nothing gay). But we realized that we have almost everything in common, and we feel the same way about almost everything. He even told me that I'm the only person he feels he can trust in 4 years since his best friend betrayed him or something.

We talk about really deep stuff. We are both very strong Christians, we feel the same way about relationships, we talk about sensitive stuff that most guys don't talk about, etc. And recently I just told him that he is one of the best friends I've ever had even though I haven't known him for long, and he said he wanted to tell me that same thing, but he was afraid I wouldn't feel the same way. And recently I told him the same thing basically, but I told him that there's something really special about him.

We are both very quiet and hardly ever talk about our problems with people, but we do with each other. And when we see each other, and like twice before we leave we give each other a good hug...like a long hug. One time he didn't let go and said "Don't let go...even if that's weird." And whenever I'm leaving he always says he's about to cry cuz I'm leaving.


When I am with him everything is okay, and I feel amazing. But when I leave I go through withdrawal and I get depressed the couple days after. I already have stress problems and depression and anxiety, so I get trouble breathing and stuff...but when I hang out with him and then leave, I get a horrible sick feeling in my stomach. Like we hung out a little last night, and all this morning I've just felt awful, I can hardly eat. I think I'm getting a stomach ulcer because of him

I can't imagine my life without him, and to "break it off" with him, I would have to explain why, and that would be two bad things because I couldn't be with him, and then everyone would think I'm gay.

Now...I've never thought of myself as gay really. I know it sounds like I'm in denial, but I can explain. I almost think of myself as a sensitive straight guy with a male fetish...I know that sounds weird, but I think that's what it is. Because I've always looked at gay porn, but when I actually think about having sex with a guy, I actually don't think I'd rather do that over a girl. Also, relationships with guys just grosses me out (no offense). I think my thing with being attracted to gay porn could maybe have something to do with the fact that at a very young age I saw female porn. So that's why I don't consider myself gay...bisexual probably.

I think that maybe I'm just experiencing a straight friendship that is deeper than any I've ever had, and nothing more. MAYBE in a world where no one minded gay relationships...MAYBE I would be in a relationship with him...but for some reason, like I said earlier, it's hard for me to think of being in a romantic relationship with a guy.

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that we were texting last night about our problems and stuff, and he mentioned that a problem he was having earlier involving a girl is getting better (he liked her but she didn't like him so he just accepted that they weren't going to be together). And then I asked if there's anything else he needs to talk about and he said that there's some problems that are very confusing...now, I'm not a psychologist, but when people use the word "confusing" for feelings, it usually means they're questioning their sexuality or something. I dunno...this is all so weird.


Should I just take it for what it is? I mean, if it feels amazing to be at the level we're at, why would I need to take it further? I just don't know what to do about the times when I'm not with him and it makes me physically sick...it's hard.

P.S. I'm sorry for the ENORMOUS message -_-.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Let's take care of some groundwork first.

You look at gay porn exclusively. You think about having sex with guys. You've fallen for your best (male) friend, and you're hoping he has feelings for you, as well. There's several terms for where you're at, but let me use the most common one.

Gay.


That's dictionary definition right there. You can call it anything you'd like, but pretty much everyone else is gonna just call it "gay".

I think the rest of your post explains your position even further. Honestly, you sound scared to death of the term "gay", at least as it applies to you. You're worried that breaking things off with this friend of yours would make "everybody think you're gay". You're even sound worried that the people here - 99.9% gay and bisexual men - might think you're gay, so you hastily explain that you're not.

You think MAYBE if you lived in a world where nobody minded gay relationships, you might take a step here. Really? Nobody? What if five people objected? Would you throw over your happiness because five people on this planet would find it distasteful? Ten? A thousand?

Let me put it this way. I'm gay. Yeah, I like contact sports and dress like a slob, but me likey the dick, so I'm gay. I live in Colorado. Perhaps you've heard it referred to as "the Hate State". Must be horrible living here as a gay man, right? Wrong. I've lived in neighborhoods that have been both really gay and really straight, with my partner, as a gay couple. And you know who cares? Nobody. I don't have people picketing my home or telling me I'm heading to hell. My co-workers know, my neighbors know, my parents know, everybody knows. And nobody cares. Are there people in this area who object? Probably. But I don't care about them. I don't seek them out, and I'm sure as hell not going to live my life because they've got an issue with it.

Your friend sounds like he's in precisely the same spot as you. He's gay, he's in love with you, but he can't bring himself to admit to anything, because you're straight, you're Christian, and you'd turn his back on him. You're both at an impasse, and you have two options to try to get it to move forwards. And no, neither one is easy.

1. Keep proceeding as you have been. You're gonna have to take really tiny baby steps forward. Let the hugs last a bit longer. Eventually, move your hands across his back just a bit as you hug. And so on. But even if he does respond, and your relationship does end up going that way, you'll still be in a position where you don't think you can ever talk about it outside of the bedroom. You'll have to play "friendly straight guys" the rest of your life.

2. Take the plunge. Admit to your friend that you think you may be gay.

Obviously, I'd heavily suggest you go with 2. But not yet. I don't think you're ready. You've got to come out to the most important person first - you.

You've got to be able to look in the mirror and say "I'm gay" without feeling a knot in your stomach. You've got to simply accept the fact that you're gay (or bisexual - fine), and just accept it as part of your life, as much as your height and your birthdate. And I have a feeling that might take some time. But I think it's vitally important that you do so. So give it some thought, OK?

Lex

 

[Txgoodoldboy]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Now...I've never thought of myself as gay really. I know it sounds like I'm in denial, but I can explain. I almost think of myself as a sensitive straight guy with a male fetish...I know that sounds weird, but I think that's what it is.

Now, that's a unique way of putting it.

I think you are both, trying to find a way of dealing with being gay.

I was raised a Baptist, so I know people will try to jump through hoops to avoid accepting being gay.

It is a shame you, both, cannot accept that you are in love with one another and get on with a relationship.

There are a lot of books and websites that can help a Christian understand his homosexuality. You might try www.whosoever.org . Make sure you enter .org, not .com , because .com is a negative site.

 

[rareboy]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Gay as a circus.

And that is a good thing.

Love is more important than gender and sex is sometimes just a biological pleasure response.

No old testament. No apostle Paul.

Just physical pleasure.

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

I guess you guys are right...maybe I am gay, I dunno. I think I'd rather be in a relationship with a girl...but I think now that a perfect guy has come a long I might change my mind, you know?

The main thing is my family...they wouldn't shun me completely, but I know that they wouldn't accept me. It's not a selfish thing, it's TOO selfless...it would hurt them and ruin them. Can't I just be myself, and I just happen to really like this guy, without labels?

Why do we need to label our relationship? Wouldn't it just be easiest for EVERYONE if we just stayed "straight" and if something happens then it happens?

Actually, in a couple weeks we were going to go to some convention in Baltimore with friends...but it might just end up being us two. I'll let you guys know what happens on that trip.

I mean...I would rather just keep this friendship than try to put a label on it, thus probably ending our relationship altogether after less than a month.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

If you fit the criteria, people are gonna put the label on. If you have season tickets to the Chicago Bears, and watch all the away games on TV, and wear a Bears baseball cap, people are going to say "Sil is quite the Chicago Bears fan." And you probably aren't going to fight that. You won't bemoan "Why can't I just like the team, without you having to label me?" In fact, you'll probably tell people this fact - "Yeah, I'm quite a fan of the Bears" - without any problem. You might not like some of the baggage that people like to apply to that label. Maybe you don't down beer in massive quantities or sound like those guys from Saturday Night Live. But that's baggage. A few people are going to think that since you like the Bears, you're like that. They're wrong.

In the same way, you're gay. You're interested in men sexually. That means you're gay. And yeah, the label comes with baggage. Some people might think you love Cher, or you love to gossip, or whatever else. Again, that's baggage. A few people are going to think that because you're gay, you're like that. They're (presumably) wrong.

There's a thread on this website that you really should read. It sounds like you're about three months behind this guy. Hopefully, you can catch up. Get reading.

Lex

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Thanks...I think my main problem is just that I'm thinking if for some reason we DID label it and started "going out" or whatever, then that is inevitably going to end in disaster, ruining our friendship. I love his whole family too...if me and him stopped being friends, I couldn't be friends with his family. I feel like starting something would only end up causing me to lose like 4 friends in the end...and one of them being this guy who is my best friend now.

I don't see any way out of me feeling this horrible feeling in my stomach...I mean, I don't see how "making it official" would help that. We'd still have to do it in secret, and we actually do hang out whenever we get the chance...he's just really busy a lot and our schedules clash, but we seriously do hang out probably every time we can. So I would still have to be away from him for periods of time...the only thing that would change would be that we would both know how we feel.

I'm just going to do what you said and take it further with VERY small baby steps. If I told him and lost him as a friend...I would get even more depressed than I am. And don't worry, I'm not suicidal or anything...even a couple weeks ago where I was the most depressed I've ever been, I never thought of suicide. I love my life and friends and family too much to even let that thought come up, you know? So this isn't an issue of me being suicidal or anything...it's just that I have a physical problem that comes from this and I want to fix it.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

OK, you're gonna have to give me more info here. Where are you such that you have to do it in secret?

Lex

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Well I'm just saying if we were to have a relationship openly...there's probably no one that would accept it. I don't really think I know anyone that wouldn't make it weird and ruin our friendship.

Okay...basically my main problem here is that when I'm away from him I go through "withdrawal" and get sick and stuff. But like I said, we are very good friends and we spend as much time as possible together. So I mean...I can't really see anything that could change for the good by having a relationship with him...I can only see bad things. I mean, I don't even think I want to have sex with him, I just like being with him. Although if I was given the chance I'm sure I would consider it.

Why would I want to possibly ruin me and his friendship, ruin my friendship with SOO many people including my family, and make a lot of people disappointed and sad? Just so I can put an official label on me and him?

At the off chance something were to happen on this Baltimore trip...then maybe I would consider it. But I mean, I just want to be around him, I don't feel the need to change anything, I like just how it is. I just need to learn how I can not feel so sad when I'm away from him.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Not even sure where to start this time.

What you've described in your first post sounds absolutely nothing like a platonic friendship, no matter how tight it might be. I've got plenty of straight friends, and yeah, they've got BFFs, but theer's none of this "don't-let-go" hugging and withdrawl symptoms. This isn't friendship. This is infatuation. Or, if you will, love. And it appears to be returned.

>>>there's probably no one that would accept it. I don't really think I know anyone that wouldn't make it weird and ruin our friendship.

If other people want to look askance at your relationship, that's their business. It's up to you whether you want to weigh that heavier than your own happiness, and the happiness of your friend.

>>>I mean, I don't even think I want to have sex with him, I just like being with him. Although if I was given the chance I'm sure I would consider it.

So you don't even want to have sex with him...but you're kinda hoping maybe something might happen on this trip? OK, try this - consider it. Seriously. Right now. Pretend you're in your hotel room, and you have one of your marathon hug sessions. And say he moves his hands lower. Or kisses you lightly on the ear. Consider it. What will you do? Because the fact of the matter is - these sorts of things don't "happen". You're not going to be sitting in the hotel room, and suddenly a great gust of wind is going to blow you into his arms. If something happens, it's because both of you WANT something to happen.

>>>Why would I want to possibly ruin me and his friendship, ruin my friendship with SOO many people including my family, and make a lot of people disappointed and sad? Just so I can put an official label on me and him?

Because you're an adult now, for fuck's sake. Which means you're in charge of your life, and you're in charge of your happiness, and your happiness is paramount. Yours and his. Your friends will be "disappointed" if they find out you're gay? Boo fucking hoo. What type of people don't want their friends to be happy? What sorts of people want their friends to live a lie, because they don't want some idealized image of them ruined?

If this was a typical "my friend thinks he's straight but idk" type of thread - and there's a ton of them - yeah, I'd tell you proceed with extreme caution. But this isn't. Your friend has given you every signal in the book outside of asking you to wash his back while he's in the bathtub. You obviously have major MAJOR feelings for one another. And not in a platonic "friends 'til the end" sort of way.

As far as labels go, the only people I've seen who complain about this sort of thing - "why must we put a label on everything?" - are those in your position. Those who can do some amazing twists and turns to show that just because they're attracted to guys, and just because they watch gay porn, and just because they've got a thing for one of their male friends, doesn't in any way shape or form mean that they're "gay". I'm sorry, but that water fowl you got there is waddling, quacking, and looking awfully duck-like - forgive me for wanting to label it a "duck".

The problem isn't that society feels the need to label everything. The problem is that you're scared to death of the label, you feel your entire life will end if it somehow gets attached to you, and you'll do anything in your power to avoid it. And the way I see it, you can either spend the rest of your life ducking it, and no doubt sacrificing a LOT of happiness in your life, or you can accept it. Will you lose some friends? Possibly. But my theory is that friendship can handle something as simple as one's sexuality. If they can't handle you being gay, they're not worth having as friends. Anyone who's friends with you because you're straight and/or have a good job and/or "going places" isn't a friend. They're somebody you hang out with, maybe, but they ain't your friend. A friend is someone who, when you lose your job, helps you with your resume and drives you to job interviews. A friend is someone who, when you get severely depressed, stays up until 4am listening to your problems, knowing you just need a friendly ear. And a friend is someone who, when you tell them you're gay, may take some time to get used to the idea, but decides "That's OK - you're still you".

>>>I don't feel the need to change anything, I like just how it is.

Reread your first post, and tell me that again with a straight (ahem) face.

Look, I'm not typing all this because I like harrassing people. I'm typing this because I think you need to read it. No, I don't think you should immediately go to your friend and say, "I'm gay, I'm pretty sure you are too, let's go upstairs and figure out which of us is the top." You're not ready for that. If your friend made a move on you tonight, I'm not even sure you're ready for THAT. You need to get yourself into a better spot first. You need to start accepting your sexuality, grow more comfortable with it, and stop trying to avoid the dreaded G-word. Then, and only then, should you bother thinking about if you should tell anybody, or if you should make a move on your friend.

Lex

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Thanks so much lex...people like me need a harsh response like that. I dunno what I'm doing or what I'm feeling or what...but I need to realize that probably EVERY SINGLE PERSON here has felt the same kind of confusion I am.

I'm just going to let this play out, and keep it where it is, but not be afraid to let it go further. You know? I think that's the best thing for people in my situation to do.

And I asked him about why he said that there are confusing problems in his life...and he went into further details and it doesn't really sound anything like being gay. I dunno though.

 

[rareboy]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

By the way, I hope that you are getting help with your depression and anxiety.

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Thank you very much Rare ^_^. I've been going to church more, going to Bible studies with good friends, talking more about my problems...stuff like that. I'm getting better, and I'm gaining more and more people that I realize have gone through depression and stuff so I can talk to them.

I felt bad yesterday...but I actually feel better today. Talking on here about this problem that I haven't been able to talk about with ANYONE is helping more than you can imagine.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

I guess you won't be surprised to say I'm less than thrilled with your choice of treatments, but we all gotta do what we gotta do. Hoping you come through this OK.

Lex

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Thank you! It's great to see support even if you don't agree, that shows character and shows that you're a good person.

Between you guys and my Christian friends, I have a lot of people who are there to help me. You're the ones I can talk to about my sexuality problems, and they are there for everything else because I don't feel that I can talk about that with them lol.

 

[swarley]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

It almost sounds like you want to like guys without being considered gay which is pretty much impossible. Also have you considered the fact that your depression is rooted in the confusion your feeling right now about your feelings towards guys? It probably isn't 100% the root of your depression, but could it be at least a part of it? I ask this because when i was in the closet, i also felt depressed and as soon as i realized my feelings and came out, it was as if a cloud lifted from above my head and i just felt happier in general.

 

[Caeth]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

you can't separate your sexuality issues from the other issues. they are related. i bet if you come to terms with your sexuality everything else will lighten up.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

>>>Between you guys and my Christian friends, I have a lot of people who are there to help me. You're the ones I can talk to about my sexuality problems, and they are there for everything else because I don't feel that I can talk about that with them lol.

The problem with this, as you no doubt have found out, is that we're going to be pointing you in two different directions. Right now, you can probably walk that fine line, but there's going to come a time when you're going to have to decide which direction would be best for you.

Here's my fear. You've indicated that you tend to not have many friends. I'm thinking possibly you've joined a Christian group, and made some friends there. And that's fine - I have no problem with that. But now you find yourself at a spot where revealing something about yourself could jeopardize your place there. And if these are your main (or only) friends, then you're going to be...well, more than just "reluctant" to put these relationships at risk.

I don't doubt these people's motives, or their status as friends, mind you. But I do think their friendship might be contigent on your sexuality and religious status. Would they be friends with a Muslim who wasn't interested in converting, for instance? I'm certainly not telling you to turn your back on the Church here. My parents are both devout Christians, and they're amazing people. The churh has really helped them shine as human beings. They have no qualms at all about me being gay, they love my partner as much as I do, and to me, they epitomize what exactly a "Christian" could be. But there are many people out there who live their lives both as out homosexuals AND as Christians. I don't want you to feel you're going to have to choose between your sexuality and your faith.

My main concern is with you. That because of your relationships with these people, you won't take a step that I feel is necessary for you to live a much happier, more stress-free existence. Do read the thread I linked you to above. Do read noelie's "Reluctant Homosexual" thread. I think you'll see some correlations. People stuck in positions they felt were impossible. Scared to make a move. Denying what they were feeling. But eventually, taking that step. Moving forward. And how much better their lives got afterwards. And do read this thread on another website about coming out. I think it'll help.

Good luck, my friend.

Lex

 

[silpmn]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

Thanks guys. I see what you're saying. I'm starting to come more to terms with the stuff that's going on in my life, and I DO feel better. I still feel crappy a lot still, but I'm better and it's not as frequent.

For a LOT of gay men who come out, everyone already knew it anyway. Like one of my best friends did...and of course it was shocking to hear it verbalized...but I wasn't shocked one bit. He's very...um...flamboyant I think is the word? I don't mean to offend anyone so sorry if I am...but I'm just trying to get my point across and that's a word I usually hear.

My problem is that I really don't think ANYONE would have suspected I was gay or bisexual. I'm very sensitive, but that's the only thing even CLOSE to the usual "signs" that you see in expressive gays.

I felt happy today because I hung out with this friend ^_^ lol. We hung out with some friends and just went to WalMart and stuff. I did get kind of sad when he left though cuz he had to leave early -_-...I'm hanging out with the other friends that we were with though so that's helping me some.

It's just so weird because I'm not really sexually attracted to him, even though he is cute and handsome...he's not typical hot or anything. So it's more just of an emotional connection and stuff. Although like I said, if he came on to me for real or something I wouldn't push him away, but I'm not like dying to have sex with him, you know what I mean?

So the reason I get sad isn't like me lusting after him and being sad that I can't have his cherry or anything like that lol...it's more confusing. I just get sad when I know that I won't see him or get to hang out with him, or when he leaves. I dunno this is really weird...I've never really heard of any kind of weird relationship thing like this before, and I think that's why it's hard for me because there's not really many people who have gone through the exact same thing I am.

Like I don't want to live a "gay lifestyle"...it's not for me. I love being the "straight" guy I am. It's just this one guy that is changing my life around...I've never really had problems with being in the bisexual/gay closet before, it never bugged me that much really. But it's just when I started to connect with this guy that he F'ed up my head I guess lol.

But I suppose you guys are probably right that the main core of my problem is me struggling with sexuality and stuff. It just seems like this one person is changing a lot of my life...and it's frustrating when something like that happens.

How can I compare this...it's almost like being fine with your boyfriend or girlfriend and then suddenly find out they're cheating on you. That's never happened to me, but I can imagine how it is ^_^. Anyway, I'm just saying that that's probably about how I'm feeling now--my life was fine and I was okay with being gay or bisexual somewhat, and then there's just this huge change that messes with everything you know.

 

[G-Lexington]

Re: Not being around my best friend makes me sick.

>>>My problem is that I really don't think ANYONE would have suspected I was gay or bisexual. I'm very sensitive, but that's the only thing even CLOSE to the usual "signs" that you see in expressive gays.

Like Noelie, I figured I couldn't look any straighter. Yeah, I did have this weird "flourish" in my wrist every time I pointed at something (still do, in fact), but other than that, Lex was straight straight straight. After I came out, my sister admitted she had suspected for years. My parents were somewhat surprised, but not shocked. And none of my friends were really thrown for a loop. They may not have guessed right off, but had someone asked them "Is Lex gay?" before I came out, they wouldn't have said "Not a chance." They would've said "You know, I'm not sure."

>>>Like I don't want to live a "gay lifestyle"...it's not for me. I love being the "straight" guy I am. It's just this one guy that is changing my life around...

I just posted this in another thread, but I'm not sure I covered it here. So let me do so.

There IS no "gay lifestyle".

Coming out of the closet doesn't mean a trip to the spa, an A&F shopping trip, and several CDs of showtunes. (Unless you want ti to, of course.) All it means is that you date guys, and the people who are in your life know it. That's it, that's all. As I said way back in post #2, I dress like a slob, I crank the rock music, I have season tickets to a contact sport. This doesn't make me a straight guy who happens to like guys. It makes me a gay guy who just doesn't have that many stereotypical traits.

Some people like to consider "the gay lifestyle" as late-night clubbing, recreational drug use, and lots of casual sex. And yes, there are plenty of gays that do those things. But there are plenty of gays that don't do any of those things. (I'm one.) It's like going to a (straight) strip club, and calling that "the straight lifestyle". Yeah, there's guys that do that. There's plenty more that don't.

I think you were fine being gay/bisexual because it didn't mean anything before. It's easy to be "gay" when all it means "the porn I download only involves guys". It's a different scenario when other people get involved.

Lex