Out but not Open?

[Lalada]

Right, really quickly here: can we be out, just not openly gay?

 

[Eagle653]

Hi Lalada, I moved your thread to this forum because it probably belongs here and was falling down the page in Hot Topics.

 

[KaraBulut]

Right, really quickly here: can we be out, just not openly gay?

What do you consider the difference to be?

 

[Lalada]

Well that's the thing, I'm not really sure what my own perception is and I want perspective.

I was in class with my friend and we were talking about her cousin, we were also in conversation with a couple guys up ahead, they were turned around and she said something about her cousin's girlfriend.

She's gorgeous, and I said so. I said she was very good looking and my friend pauses, gets a confused look on her face, and simply says "sometimes I wonder about you."

Well I got offended a little. Why can't I say a girl is good looking?

Later that night I talked to her on MSN, and we talked it over. I was bothered about it because, simply, I felt like I was being boxed in about what I can and cannot say.

She said I was uncomfortable being open, but to me that isn't the same as being out.

I consider myself out, but what exactly entails "open"? To talk about guys in public? If I were straight I wouldn't even talk about girls in public. But that's me. I'm secretive and I consider it "rude".

To me, out is not lying about who you are. Open is parading it.

But I want perspective, because at the end of the day, I know how I act in public and in private, I'm self-conscious but it has nothing to do with my sexuality.

So...

 

[hummer7979]

I sort of consider myself out but not open, in the sense that if asked, I wouldn't hesitate to tell someone that I'm gay, but I still feel awkward about bringing it up unprovoked and just talking about guys casually. I think it's just a phase that we all go through, finding our level of comfort.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the way you are, and I think your friends are just trying to figure you out, albeit in an annoying way. I'm not going to tell you what to do, but in my experience, I find that if I am straight-forward and strive toward not always preemptively worrying about how people will interpret what I say, insofar as how it might define me, then they'll eventually accept who I am and deal with sometimes being confused or unsure. After all, actions speak louder than words, and if they're already making their minds up about you, trying to convince them otherwise with words isn't going to do much. I say, just be yourself and don't apologize or make excuses for it.

 

[Lalada]

Thanks for the input, especially you Hummer.

I do talk about issues in the community, and I'm not afraid to bring up gay rights or anything, but I do have some discomfort talking about guys in the open. Am I not "free" as my friend says?

I really think it's a phase and I'll get through it, so I must ask for my friend's patience.

 

[FirmaFan]

For me, I don't hide it when it comes up, but I don't make it everything about me, either. You couldn't look at me and say "yeah, he's gay" but you could ask me "are you gay?" and I would say "yes." Do not think, however, that I attempt to make myself appear straight until confronted, I just am who I am, do what I do, and am "out" as gay as much as I'm "out" about being a democrat. It's really a non issue unless it's appropriate at the present time. Which is why it says on my profile that "only my friends know" because, to everyone else but the people I associate, it means absolutely nothing. Draw your own definitions of how you would describe by status. I just say: I am me.

 

[G-Lexington]

I don't see a difference, really.

"Out" simply means not lying. Being yourself. That means not avoiding the issue when it comes up. Not playing clever "pronoun games" when talking with people ("I'm seeing someone...."). Just talking without worrying if people will "find out", because you don't care if people find out or not.

The only difference between this and "openly gay", as far as I can see, is whether or not you wear gay pride shirts or something. And that's up to you. I personally don't. Not because I'm ashamed, but because they look like crap on me.

Lex

 

[badgerfan]

Right, really quickly here: can we be out, just not openly gay?

Thank you for asking this and bringing it up. I have wondered something along these lines for a long time. Or for me, I kind of wondered what exactly does it mean to be "out of the closet".

My definition of that is being "out" means you are not lying or pretending to be someone you are not, and are not afraid of others finding out you are gay. As part of my understanding/definition, someone who has told almost no one they are gay can be as out as someone who tells every single person they meet and know.

For me that kind of relates or ties into your question. I would guess that being out implies you are not afraid of others knowing you are gay. Being openly gay to me implies you are more upfront and in your face about it.

Where as for me, I do not feel a need to tell everyone about being gay. It is my business and regardless I consider myself a private person to begin with. And I do not feel a need to march in parades or give speeches or advocate for gay rights. I still consider myself out, just not openly gay.

 

[trawler69]

As above I am out in that I don't deny my sexuality and those that matter know about it as with being "Open" about it; I don't go round advertising it as it really isn't an issue, I don't conform to stereo types as I am not stereotypical so those whose gaydar works on stereotypes would never guess I am gay despite the fact that I do nothing to hide it. I am not straight acting or Gay acting, I am not acting at all, just being myself and perfectly comfortable with it. So I guess I am not open in the sense that open is to advertise.

 

[saymyname]

There's no difference. Honestly, it sounds like you still have some hangups about being gay. Or you're just prude (no offence). But when I meet guys and they're like, I'm out, but they won't bring it up "unprovoked", it makes me wonder how ashamed they are. I don't think it should be a conversation piece anything more than anything else, but when we live in a society that assumes everyone is straight, it's sometimes necessary to throw it out there if people are assuming or getting the wrong impression. It sounds like you won't say anything about it unless directly provoked or asked - are straight people the same way about their sexuality? No way. They throw off remarks, usually to do with pronouns, that make it clear that they're straight all the time. Not on purpose, either, it's just how it is. Why should we be any different?

 

[pausanias_usa]

But when I meet guys and they're like, I'm out, but they won't bring it up "unprovoked", it makes me wonder how ashamed they are.

I remember an era of "discreetness" in everything (religion, sex, politics, specifically) but times have changed, not necessarily for the better.

"The gay community" -- whatever the hell that means -- had to be defiantly OUT for a while to get some points made. But is that far different from politics?

For some, being out is almost religion; for some it obviously is about sex.

Yet some of us still remember that it is civic politeness not to get in public discussions of religion, sex, and politics that can cast a pall on the occasion.

(Jeez, I'm old enough to remember Mr. Drucker's store in Hooterville that had that sign, "No talking sex, religion, and politics!" Well, maybe my memory is wrong, 60s tv probably didn't mention sex )

What am I saying? Discreetness need not be ashamedness, but social politeness.

 

[Lalada]

I'm not ashamed of being gay, maybe self-conscious of the way I look, but not being gay.

I realize there's a few things I could've done, but next time I will be ready for it.

Thanks for the input, all.