On Topic Discussion Realists and conversationalists: Last of a dying breed?

[MoufOfKhaos]

It changes its' avatar yet addresses nothing concrete. Swell.

 

[c0nfused]

Enough about me though, I am curious to know if anyone else has the same frustration about the dumbing down of the universe.

Have you read any of my threads? I also said I agree with most of your views in this thread. I was not trolling when I said the hyenas are attacking you, that was more of an observation. About the sex thing though, I don't think sex has any relevance to 'dumbing' down of the world unless people base their lives on going out and having sex every night and doing nothing else. That is a problem.

You seem to be on the path of enlightenment, but you still have some way to go. Don't let the hyenas and evil shrews stop you.

 

[eastofeden]

You have some good points but you lost me with the "morally correct" line of thinking.

You can be who you are and be true to yourself without having to make everyone else "wrong" or somehow less than you are.

 

[Beachguyj]

I agree, people seem to be so into themselves they don't know how to have a conversation. Sometimes I feel like I am interviewing them. But it's a good way to know if people are into you. But some people lack the skills. I had a friend and I always had to initiate the conversations or tell him about interesting things that happened in my week. He went to Disney for gay days for 4 days and I asked him how it was and he told me one brief story, and I had to probe other details out of him. I feel the same in a social group I go to, I say something and they awkward silence happens. I think people are just more self centered now.

if you meet someone and they ask you where you are from ask them back.

 

[dereperez]

I agree there are one-track minded non-conversationalists out there. It can feel like pulling teeth to get any decent response from them. But one of my pet-peeves is people who think they are morally superior or those that making sweeping generalizations. This being an internet forum, you are already dealing with a select group from society. And just like "the real world" there are people who are going to sound like broken records. Associate yourself with many, and you will realize it is not as bleak as you make it out to be.

 

[eastofeden]

I wasn't trying to. I was thinking it over and over about how to word that right when I was typing but it turned out wrong obviously.

Anyways, let's nix the "morally correct" part, that is not even important now. The rest is up for debate.

OK....lets address the thing you said about judgements...and people rating one another on appearance in relation to the decline of society. First thing...it has ALWAYS been that way. Do you have any idea what Victorian Era women did to achieve "beauty"?. A quick look at history will raise the hair on your neck.

I actually don't participate in that...never have...but it DOES work both ways which is what most people miss. I don't think it is any different telling someone they are good looking based SOLELY on their appearance than telling them they are ugly based SOLEY on their appearance. It is exactly the same coin.

I still think people are sexy or hot but never solely because of the way they look...has to be something else. Same with ugly...not based on their appearance...has to be something they do or say that brings me to that conclusion. Never once in my life have I ever looked at another human being and said or even thought they were ugly based solely on their appearance and the same for good looking....I miss that one too.

This does not make me any better or worse than anyone else and has nothing to do with morality. I trust what I "feel" a lot more than what I "see" so I am just being true to myself and it isn't a judgement or commentary on anyone else except for me. For all I know...people that base their opinions on other people's appearance are being true to themselves...but too much of that (24/7) and we will be incompatible...again not a good or bad thing...it just is what it is.

One thing that I keep close to me ...a very wise woman told me this when I was young and it has pissed me off at times and I think it is bullshit quite frequently BUT when I am ready to pay attention...I have found that what you see outside of yourself is often a reflection of what is inside of you. Think about it. If you want change...BE the change.

 

[Beachguyj]

The thing I didn't like about the OP saying was about guys who he says are loose with their moral, or however he put it. I don't care what you do in bed or in a bathtub or in a back room with whatever willing adult partner you choose.

If I'm a slut, so be it, if I can keep it from some people, fine, it they find out about it, then they can choose to be my friend or not.

and far as guys that do drugs, it's so easy to not associate with them.

and yeah online I do write what I think, it's like a conversation, I know some guys spend a long time analyzing every word, but I don't.

 

[eastofeden]

The "rating" thing has gotten out of hand however. I have seen guys rate girls solely based on appearance and it's quite vain and arrogant of the guy to be like that, and vise versa. If people are like that, then they really don't get to know anybody humanly. I see their appearance when I first notice them, of course, but I also take the time to really get to know them and how their lives are. They seem to have it together and it just makes me happy. The part I highlighted is how I am as well, I just have a hard time putting that into words.

Nah...the rating system has always been there...it has been practiced by individuals for years...you are just now seeing a concentrated "group effort" thanks to modern technology and the internet and it can be a good thing if you want to look at it in a different light. I can think of a number of reasons WHY it can be a good thing but I will limit it to one....

...I think putting something on the table...up front...gives people a chance to look at their behavior...or words...or actions...where it may otherwise be hidden from them or relegated to the unconscious mind so if what they are participating in is not something they wish to participate in...they have a chance to address it BECAUSE it is in their face.

Some of it is animal instinct...finding the best mate...it is part of every breed of animal on earth and though we may refer to ourselves as "human"...we are the human animal nonetheless and the search for the highest quality mate is part of it. Defining "highest quality" is just different for each of us...as it should be. That is why I don't let anyone else define anything for me....

 

[maxpowr9]

^Even if not done "by the numbers" people will still judge you based on your appearance. Yeah, it sucks when there is an overt display of said judgement (being picked last in gym is a fine example of that).

That being said, you do have control over your appearance. It's why I have zero tolerance for the "woe is me" crowd because most of the stuff they bitch about can be dealt with but they choose not to, particularly weight.

 

[AngelFromAbove]

Oh, ok, sorry about that. What I am mostly after is just the "dumbing down" caused by the media. Reality shows are one thing I am annoyed at. Most of the time, I can't even wrap my brain about what they are trying to say or what the hell they're arguing about. People see that on tv and think they either should be like that or that people are really that way in real life.

There is no "dumbing down" of society. Society is simply evolving and there is a shift in focus. In addition, there is a more instantaneous acquiring of information, even concerning people. People have not changed, in the sense of human nature, it's just now we are more aware as a whole of human nature.

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

There is no "dumbing down" of society. Society is simply evolving and there is a shift in focus. In addition, there is a more instantaneous acquiring of information, even concerning people. People have not changed, in the sense of human nature, it's just now we are more aware as a whole of human nature.

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[Devois]

I'll try to address your first paragraph about based on some anecdotes I've been told, rather than own experiences or research:

What would one of these people today have been up to sixty years ago?
• If he doesn't have a trade, he pretty much works where there's work available. It's not probably something he's particularly proud of doing, but it's necessary, it's steady and it pays his mortgage and the bills for himself, his wife and five children.
• He the only thing he smokes is tobacco. He doesn't take pills, sniff powders or inject anything. He just spends his social life at the pub around the corner most evenings of the week.
• If he lives in town, he might have the privilege of being near a library. He doesn't go there. There are some educational programmes on the wireless. He doesn't listen to them.
• He might be barely literate, but most people just talk in person.

However, there are people, sometimes called the "aspirational working classes", who aren't like that. They read and attempt to broaden their minds. They work together to improve their communities. They encourage some of their children study hard enough to get into grammar school and from there, eventually work in healthcare or education. They want their children to be more financially successful than themselves. They speak proper English, like in the public schools. They listen to classical music. They go to chapel. They have a parlour with their best furniture and china for special occasions. They keep their lawns tidy.
Those are generalisations of course, but the encouragement was there to do all those things. I think the issue there was that the drive to not lead aimless "eat, sleep, drink, fuck" lives was tied to protestant work ethic or at least its successor and that's not sustainable for all of society. I don't how better social engineering could be carried out.


I talked to quite an erudite archaeology student in a bar once. He asked things like "What is your passion?" and "Why do you intoxicate yourself?" and he thought that academics were generally less happy than other people. I was too drunk to give decent answers at that point. I think what makes him different from the other people he was talking about is that he has a passion and he can devote much of his time to pursuing it. Not everyone has passions to speak of beyond the visceral ones. Maybe they can find passions and beyond that vocation, maybe they can't. What they can do in the meantime is get high, watch trash TV and screw whoever's fit enough for them.


As for talking about sex all the time, you have to admit, it's a pretty universal topic. Again, not everyone has other interests to discuss, let alone shared interests. As a matter of fact that student I mentioned above told me how he lost his virginity. I was a bit shocked, but it broke the ice.

 

[oakpope]

Online is not reality. It is not.

For once I disagree with you
Online is as much a part of reality as anything. But only a part.

 

[oakpope]

We need more compassion for the world, not just humans. As for talking about "immoral" things, yes they are very pointless, but not amoral. Morals are a construct of the human mind, and therefore do not exist.

Construct of the mind does exist, it's not more unreal than when you see mountains. Eyesight without the brain is nothing but electrical impulse.

And yes we need more compassion towards humankind, and that entails nature preservation also.

The most horrible evil comes first from dehumanizing people and belittling humanity.

 

[c0nfused]

I'll try to address your first paragraph about based on some anecdotes I've been told, rather than own experiences or research:

What would one of these people today have been up to sixty years ago?
• If he doesn't have a trade, he pretty much works where there's work available. It's not probably something he's particularly proud of doing, but it's necessary, it's steady and it pays his mortgage and the bills for himself, his wife and five children.
• He the only thing he smokes is tobacco. He doesn't take pills, sniff powders or inject anything. He just spends his social life at the pub around the corner most evenings of the week.
• If he lives in town, he might have the privilege of being near a library. He doesn't go there. There are some educational programmes on the wireless. He doesn't listen to them.
• He might be barely literate, but most people just talk in person.

However, there are people, sometimes called the "aspirational working classes", who aren't like that. They read and attempt to broaden their minds. They work together to improve their communities. They encourage some of their children study hard enough to get into grammar school and from there, eventually work in healthcare or education. They want their children to be more financially successful than themselves. They speak proper English, like in the public schools. They listen to classical music. They go to chapel. They have a parlour with their best furniture and china for special occasions. They keep their lawns tidy.
Those are generalisations of course, but the encouragement was there to do all those things. I think the issue there was that the drive to not lead aimless "eat, sleep, drink, fuck" lives was tied to protestant work ethic or at least its successor and that's not sustainable for all of society. I don't how better social engineering could be carried out.


I talked to quite an erudite archaeology student in a bar once. He asked things like "What is your passion?" and "Why do you intoxicate yourself?" and he thought that academics were generally less happy than other people. I was too drunk to give decent answers at that point. I think what makes him different from the other people he was talking about is that he has a passion and he can devote much of his time to pursuing it. Not everyone has passions to speak of beyond the visceral ones. Maybe they can find passions and beyond that vocation, maybe they can't. What they can do in the meantime is get high, watch trash TV and screw whoever's fit enough for them.


As for talking about sex all the time, you have to admit, it's a pretty universal topic. Again, not everyone has other interests to discuss, let alone shared interests. As a matter of fact that student I mentioned above told me how he lost his virginity. I was a bit shocked, but it broke the ice.

I agree. It amazes me how happy stupid people can really be. Ignorance really is bliss.

 

[MakeDigitalLove]

It is funny that you 1) Changed your Avatar 2) And in that avatar it is something you need to learn to do with other people.

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

class fa eons ans eons but 1st worlds great amazins alls stoopid cause
* foooooooooooor *

thankyou

 

[oakpope]

What interests me in this thread and more generally is the subject of morality.

It's irking pretty much every one when we interpret Dragononfire's op as him thinking he has moral superiority. The usual, modern, currant is to rebuke that, to tell that everyone is equal, that morality can be subjective.
I'm not entirely convinced.

I stand by some fundamental morals, like 'don't kill a human, for any reason, whatever the circumstances'. I stand by 'equality between women's rights and men's'. Some people, in some countries, may differ. They are so strong in me (the INFP talking ) than it makes me consider that they are superior. I'm convinced humankind would be better with them enforced everywhere.

Am I wrong to consider I am right ?

I'm afraid political correctness towards morality may muddle things too much. All is not morally equivalent in my book.
But it's just my opinion

 

[pat grimshaw]

No "dumbing down"? ...

Yes. These two look like complete morons. The one on the right with the big ears looks like some kind of wombat.

They've taken a pen and doodled on themselves. Mindless. I bet they play with their faeces too.


.

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

Yes. These two look like complete morons. The one on the right with the big ears looks like some kind of wombat. They've taken a pen and doodled on themselves; I bet they play with their faeces too.

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anyway

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thankyou