Reassessing JUB

[NameTaken]

Yeah, I probably shouldn't have done that! Oh well, I've been tyring to do that since htne though! <3

 

[Jadin32]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I like your stunt of "walking away" from threads once you realize that you have no argument or have been trumped!



Looks like some people have had their OWN arguments turned against them!

Some people think they have "won" or are "right" because the other person quit posting/arguing/walked away but In my case.......if I think the other person's opinions are just the equivalent of white noise...I put them on my ignore list!

Some people; mostly bullies think no matter what ....they are right!
I just think they are insecure individuals with too much time on their hands so I am through with the whole mess! BYE
Doesn't mean they are right in the argument.... It just means the whole bantering back and forth has grown tiresome. I don't have the time!

 

[NameTaken]

Some people think they have "won" or are "right" because the other person quit posting/arguing/walked away but In my case.......if I think the other person's opinions are just the equivalent of white noise...I put them on my ignore list!

Some people; mostly bullies think no matter what ....they are right!
I just think they are insecure individuals with too much time on their hands so I am through with the whole mess! BYE
Doesn't mean they are right in the argument.... It just means the whole bantering back and forth has grown tiresome. I don't have the time!

You see, normally I would agree. Except for the fact that he said he was done for purposes other than time (and he said so AFTER the debunking of his point). So kthxbye.

 

[mike_n_herrin]

Firstly, a little name calling is not attacking. And did it ever occur to you that they were just trying to voice THEIR opinions and YOU took it the wrong way? Probably not or you would have realized there is no reason for a thread like this.

As for the "troublemakers" I fear that you feel that anybody who voices an opinion that does not match your own and is not afraid to back down when you confront them about it is a troublemaker.

I thought the rules said you were not allowed to call other people names. I don't see it there now. But this is the root of the problem. A lack of respect for other people. When you call someone a name other than their user name you need to look at the reason why one is doing it. generally speaking it's a form of insult. it is often a disparaging comment, which to me is in fact an attack. now if you are calling some one "hunny bun" or something like that, then that is generally not an insult, although i know a number of gals who think it is when it comes from someone they don't know.

as i have said a gozzlion times here, there is a way to state your opinion without sounding insulting, belittleing, arragant, etc. the very language you are using influences how someone takes your post. there are of course smilies to help one decipher what someone is saying but they are not used that much. the phrase "not afraid to back down when you confront them" suggests an elevated coversation something that has risen beyond a freindly disscussion. that is when the insults start flying around and it's sad.

 

[blackbeltninja]

Mmmm... there does come a point where earnest debating and argument merely becomes simple farting against thunder if nobody conceded the point.

Not that it makes it right, but that's kinda the point where everything moves down a notch in my opinion. Far as I'm concerned, you can only make your point politely so many times before you either walk away or get forceful. I don't tend to walk away, though.

-d-

 

[blackbeltninja]

^Indeed, it's the last ditch attempt.

But when you've put forward the best arguments you can possibly come up with, all nice and neat and well-ordered and logical, several times in several different ways and still the other person puts 2 and 2 together to make 5, what else is left?

Agreeing to disagree is a complete waste of time - usually means one or the other or both of the people arguing are being pig-headed.

I think there's a time and place for both approaches. While I do try patience and eloquence first, and for as long as I think it necessary, I didn't earn a black belt to see the certificate sitting on my wall. Sometimes, just sometimes, the forceful approach works best.

-d-

 

[mike_n_herrin]

.. i already have many points for refusing to back down.

I dont throw mud, but i will question and debate a point if i can disprove it - as i am doing here.

Respectfully, one doesn’t get points for “not backing down.” I would suggest that you got points for “slinging mud.” To use your term. Or you insulted someone or made a personal attack. this is a problem. If users don’t have common ground on what constitutes an attack or insult or whatever, then folks are of course going to get points for things they don’t think are attacks.

Now having said that, one needs to know what the FORUM and MODS view as a personal attack, insult, slur, or whatever. So if you’ve gotten points for it once, theoretically one should have an understanding of what the forum’s definition is now and avoid it in the future.

 

[mike_n_herrin]

i didn't mean to imply you were knocking the point system.

if you are getting repeat points for something like "baiting" which could be kind of undefined, you might ask the mod who has given you points for it if they could help you understand better what baiting is and attempt to avoid the points in the future. if it's coming from the same mod every time you may have reason to dispute the baiting issue, but if you are getting it from multiple ones then probably not.

 

[snapcat]

Joe, you are welcome to post in CE&P anytime you want to post there. We ask only a few basic rules be followed. Don't personally attack anyone or make derogatory personal references which diminish the debate. We ask that you stick to the topic of the thread and cite your sources when used. And of course we ask you to adhere to the rules that JD & Seth have established that apply to everyone here.

I'm sure I'm not the only one in CE&P who considers you part of the "family" there. You are intelligent, write clear and concise posts which sum up your opinion, and you argue your point well. There have been times when you would have been better off taking a break from the computer. But you're not the first one who has posted while angry, and I daresay that you won't be the last.

One of the nice things about CE&P is that we move on to new topics regularly, and we don't hold grudges on old topics. It's a debate forum, tempers will flare from time to time.

I have to agree with what Gen. Alfie said earlier. Hot Topics can be especially mean-spirited at times. Although the general membership can't see it, I can tell you with certainty that Hot Topics generates more warning points than CE&P. I would actually have to go back and look to see the last warning I gave in CE&P, it's been that long. Generally, when I post in a thread in CE&P people listen to what I'm saying and act accordingly.

I also agree with Zeremonie who stated that posts that receive warnings should be visable to the general membership. As it stands now, discipline is a private matter and I never discuss one person's warning with another person. But that privacy comes at a cost, sometimes people aren't aware when we address an issue with another poster.

And here's something for those of you that have received warnings because of personal attacks. Should you ever find yourself on the receiving end of a personal attack then you can rest assured that we will treat that person the same way. An attack is an attack no matter whom it is aimed at.

 

[TriBi]

BTW - for those that seem to think we "don't do anything" about problems in Modland...I just checked back and there have been (as I type) 42 infractions/warnings issued from the 28th Sept till the present moment. That's in just short of a week.

Also - just about every Mod and Admin is represented in those doling out "Tread lightly" (zero point "reminders" and actual "points" warnings.

Oh - and the majority were ""Tread Lightly" reminders - NOT warning points. Of those that did have warning points...most were for Spam or inappropriate content. There were, nevertheless, half a dozen for Personal Insults or Disruptive/Baiting posts.

Just so you know.

 

[blackbeltninja]

But, respectfully offered, that is my point.

The "forceful" approach doesn't work at all in debate. It simply signals the abandonement of debate.

It's like giving up on developing a relationship and just retreating to masturbate. It makes self feels good, but signals a retreat, not a move forward.

Is it any worse than agreeing to disagree, when everyone wins?

I dunno - I don't like the idea of everyone winning. Forceful is when you're basically saying "well, we're drawn in this medium; let's move on to the next one... Play-time is over."

-d-

 

[iflookscouldkill]

I've only been a member since January but I can tell that there are many people that are not here anymore as far as the specific reason I couldn't pin point it. I come here to chill out not have in depth life conversations with people, if I wanted to do that I'd become a shrink or go see one.

 

[The_Reaper]

As a two-year JUB member...

I feel compelled to agree with you.

The problem I think lies with the fact that most of the complaints are usually sent by JUBers themselves.

There is that little "report thread" button, and I've used it a few times. Each to various degrees of success.

Moderators are a great thing to have, and this place would be absolute Pandemodium without them here.

But there are also a limited number of MODs, while there are a great deal of JUBers. I'd argue that a new thread shows up on one of the boards at least every 30 seconds...If not more.

That's a lot of information for anyone to process.

And then there's the complication of long threads. I've guilty to not reading every single post in a long thread...Especially if it's more than 2 pages..

I'm sure more JUBers feel the same way as I, and as such some posts which could attack a member fall through the cracks with only one or two noticing.

If those one or two aren't affected, or don't know the JUBer...I'd imagine they'd have no reason for reporting the post.

The problem lies mostly with members that don't report threads, but also slightly with moderators who are too slow to act on a certain thread or don't react at all.

The only way to solve the problem is either get more moderators, ones that have various time schedules to ensure there's at least one or two moderators online at most, if not all, times.

A report could sit for three hours before a moderator even knows it there.

As for this attitude of attacking...

I'd like to think that I've never attacked a fellow member, but I have argued. Although, I will back down if actually proven wrong and usually offer a handshake when it happens.

We're human beings, we seem to have problems sharing space with others...We'll always find someone who leaves a certain distasteful feeling with us.

The best we can do is try to avoid them, if not ignore them completely...

Either that, or there's going to be a lot of banning coming.

 

[mikemizanin729]

JUB had drama 8 years ago?

I thought the newer members said that was a new thing?

 

[cityboy-stl]

JUB is a great place. Just learn to ignore the drama and you'll be a whole lot happier here. Your browser has a back button and your mouse has a scroll wheel. It's worked for me for 9 years.

 

[LiberoK]

Oh I read the OP (the only post I read) thinking it was a recent post. Didn't question it either since most things that were said about JUB 8 years ago still apply to present day JUB.

If I recall correctly, the older generation of JUBbers yearned for the "old JUB" and reminisced about how much better it was way back then.

Nothing changed.

 

[Cormac135]

This thread could have been written yesterday, same old woe is me brigade, we're all doomed mentality.

 

[Daximus]

Of course Miz would drag this thread back to life. Trolls do as trolls do.

 

[mikemizanin729]

Oh I read the OP (the only post I read) thinking it was a recent post. Didn't question it either since most things that were said about JUB 8 years ago still apply to present day JUB.

If I recall correctly, the older generation of JUBbers yearned for the "old JUB" and reminisced about how much better it was way back then.

Nothing changed.

Yeah I was confused because some Jubbers said that Jub drama only started in recent years.

 

[mikemizanin729]

. Trolls do as trolls do.

Is there a reason as to why you have Paris Hilton as your avatar?

JUB is a great place.

I agree actually. Jub has its moments but it can help people with coming out issues and various other issues in life.