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right to life -- NOT

jackoroe said:
It's called IPAB and it's very real. Seems that a good number of democrats are in opposition and want it repealed.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obamas-bureaucratic-vision-medicare-spending_557412.html
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Thanks Jack.

Whenever someone gives a link to read what shaped their view of the topic, I always see who wrote it and how it was written.

Then Obama launched into a breathtakingly demogogic attack on Ryan's plan in the speech.
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Now the debate over IPAB has been muddied somewhat because they were an inspiration for Sarah Palin's "death panels" rhetoric that the lords of conventional wisdom so disproved of.
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Do you think Mark Hemingway may be a little biased? He was given something called a "Gold Award" from some right-wing organization called the Phillips Foundation.

http://www.thephillipsfoundation.org/

This article reminds me of something you'd hear on Hannity or O'Reilly without the yelling.

Okay, if you want to believe in this, you go ahead.

Forgot to add:

What does this have to do with the original topic? The thread started out about the cheering during the tea party pagent and then it was derailed into an "Obamacare" / IPAB discussion....

"well, look at what YOU guys are doin'.....".

*sigh*
 
Yes, there is a bias. It doesn't alter the facts, however. There are also a number of democrats who want this repealed. Now are they also biased or acting honorably? As a lawyer friend of mine says "Depends on if your buying or selling."

http://www.benjaminrushsociety.org/...al-democrats-buck-obama-call-for-ipabs-repeal

And as to the topic, the right to life should bar the government from deciding what medical care I can get as IPAB will.
 
Mark Hemingway worked for the National Review.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/172878/very-special-obama/mark-hemingway

National Review is conservative commentary. They christened themselves the "Home of the Conservative Intellectual". (That's an oxymoron if I've ever heard one.)

http://www.nationalreview.com/

Mark Hemingway writes a scathing commentary article mentioning "Obamacare" is bad. Doesn't surprise me. It's expected. :rolleyes:

I suspect if I read every article in the National Review about Obama, Obamacare, Democrats, liberalism, progressivism.... all I would read is how it's all wrong.

Obama isn't your enemy..... the republicans are.

And should we get back on topic?
 
jackoroe said:
Perry wasn't bragging.

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=/&gl=US#/watch?v=fXH7Z6M4vOs

Good for him! Don't kill people in Texas, or you'll be killed in return. That's as it should be.
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I didn't say he was bragging.
But apparently the fear of the death penalty is not deterring people in Texas from committing acts that send them to death row via the stats of the executions.

He is proudly saying don't do this in Texas or you will be killed. But why isn't the big tough guy's routine backing down the numbers on death row? Why are they still doing so many violent crimes instead of thinking "Oh no not in Texas we will end up on death row. we better head to Massachusetts to do our killing and maiming"

The yahoos all start applauding like its some form of "no trespassing" sign keeping them safe and thats bullshit.

I'm not stating rather I believe or don't believe in the death penalty what I am saying is its not a deterrent and doesn't scare or back desperate and deranged people down,.......... and Texas if fucking full of them.
 
chrisrobin said:
If it's in "The Weekly Standard" it must be true.
Please define a good number of democrats.
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Well, to a Republican, a good number of Democrats would be none.



devilgrin.gif
 
vulgar_newcomer said:
I didn't say he was bragging.
But apparently the fear of the death penalty is not deterring people in Texas from committing acts that send them to death row via the stats of the executions.

He is proudly saying don't do this in Texas or you will be killed. But why isn't the big tough guy's routine backing down the numbers on death row? Why are they still doing so many violent crimes instead of thinking "Oh no not in Texas we will end up on death row. we better head to Massachusetts to do our killing and maiming"

The yahoos all start applauding like its some form of "no trespassing" sign keeping them safe and thats bullshit.

I'm not stating rather I believe or don't believe in the death penalty what I am saying is its not a deterrent and doesn't scare or back desperate and deranged people down,.......... and Texas if fucking full of them.
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Well, it's backed down the number of real stupid murderous people by 200+ and that's what I like to call a good start.

As to deterrence, it's scientifically provable that recipients of the death penalty don't ever commit a crime again.
 
It is also proven that the death penalty cost much more to enforce than a life sentence.

But how do you make a statement that Texas makes decisions to save life everyday and also be the greatest taker of lives.

BTW I am actually a supporter of the death penalty. Some creatures do not need to be alive whether it be due to natural defect that causes a deadly mental condition or whether the conditions of their life caused them to be un-reform-able.

I just find it an odd dichotomy that Perry would claim to be the valiant white knight of life except of course when he is killing.

What is he Dexter?
 
jackoroe said:
Well, it's backed down the number of real stupid murderous people by 200+ and that's what I like to call a good start.

As to deterrence, it's scientifically provable that recipients of the death penalty don't ever commit a crime again.
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Typical conservative, rewriting the ancient axiom of justice, to read:

Let a dozen or so innocent people be executed, as long as we get a few score guilty ones.
 
JayHawk said:
It is also proven that the death penalty cost much more to enforce than a life sentence.

But how do you make a statement that Texas makes decisions to save life everyday and also be the greatest taker of lives.

BTW I am actually a supporter of the death penalty. Some creatures do not need to be alive whether it be due to natural defect that causes a deadly mental condition or whether the conditions of their life caused them to be un-reform-able.

I just find it an odd dichotomy that Perry would claim to be the valiant white knight of life except of course when he is killing.

What is he Dexter?
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The proper place for the death penalty for criminals is at the hands of the intended victim, or a rescuer.


The death penalty for murderers is not inconsistent with the protection of life.
 
Kulindahr said:
Typical conservative, rewriting the ancient axiom of justice, to read:

Let a dozen or so innocent people be executed, as long as we get a few score guilty ones.
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I'm sorry, where exactly did I say that?
 
JayHawk said:
It is also proven that the death penalty cost much more to enforce than a life sentence.

But how do you make a statement that Texas makes decisions to save life everyday and also be the greatest taker of lives.

BTW I am actually a supporter of the death penalty. Some creatures do not need to be alive whether it be due to natural defect that causes a deadly mental condition or whether the conditions of their life caused them to be un-reform-able.

I just find it an odd dichotomy that Perry would claim to be the valiant white knight of life except of course when he is killing.

What is he Dexter?
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It costs more because we drag it out over decades. The process needs to be truncated.
 
I heard today's soundbits of Perry and Bachmann proudly proclaiming their Christianity for the day and it reminded me of my own personal experience.

I was studying to be ordained as a deacon in the Catholic Church. I had been denying I was gay since I was 12 following a lecture by my half-sister and a Catholic priest after I was caught jacking off with my brother-in-law's newphew. I went out of my way to "pray" away my feelings and unfortunately became more and more depressed until I was praying to die...but that's another story.

During the preparation for ordination I had proudly proclaimed about how I was "totally pro-life." My good friend, who remains a good friend to this day (and a priest true to his vows of celibacy) was talking with me one day and congratulated me on my absoluteness. He then brought up how I had been a police officer for 10 years as we talked in one of my days of spiritual advice.

"Did you ever have to pull your gun when you were a police officer?" he asked. "Why yes, I did," I replied. He then asked if I was pro-life, how did that reconcile with taking someone's life; was not that life valuable? Or was it of lesser value?

We talked and he saw the picture of my kids on my office desk. He knew I loved my daughter who was 10 at the time. "What would happen if someone hurt your daughter?" he inquired. "What if she was kidnapped and raped" and mentioned a girl to whom that had recently occurred and was in the news at the time. "Would you make your 10 year old daughter have the baby? What about the perpetrator? Would you kill him if you had the chance?"

Our conversation went for some time and I realized that shouting I was pro-life and truly being such a thing was much more difficult. If one wants to scream pro-life and yet execute criminals -- which has been shown to not do one thing towards deterring crime (because the time between action committing the crime and execution erases such efect) -- then pro-life they are not.

The laughter and cheers during Ron Paul's statement has continued to bother me. Where has this country gone that we could even entertain for a second such a thought? And yet I hear "Christian" and "What would Jesus Do" thrown around like rice at a wedding.

WWJD? He'd probably have taken out a whip the other night and laid a few lashes on some asses (and I mean that in more than literal ways) found on the stage. He'd likely have turned over the tables of the debate stands and told them to get out of his Father's house. Funny thing that Jesus guy -- he didn't like the religious of his day who he found to be phony and hypocritical. They were great at telling people how to be "Jewish" but really sucked at following their own rules.

I'm not sure if anyone else noticed the other night but was the audience very white, rather obese, and older? I had a hard time wondering why they would so loudly cheer for cuts to Social Security, health care, etc. since I saw this group as particularly vulnerable to all of the above (and very likely users of everything they cheered to be ended). They did not strike me as millionaires yet the policies being advocated by those on stage would certainly not benefit them; from what I have seen in states like Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, and Indiana -- it would likely cost them new taxes on their pensions and income while lowering them on businesses and wealthy. A "national sales tax" would not hurt the wealthy; they can afford to buy things from places outside the country (like boats, expensive cars, jewelry) and avoid paying taxes. It hurts those who lack that ability.
 
phoneguy2 said:
the candidates did not applaud but could be heard giggling and chuckling as the audience applauded. I suppose that isn't quite as blood thirsty.

In 2009 while uninsured because of corporate greed, I suffered a major stroke. The emergency room doctor attempted to calm my anxiety over being hospitalized with no insurance by telling me not to worry, they were going to take care of me. My neighbor brought me the emergency room bill while I was still in the hospital. Since I was partially paralyzed after being discharged, I was unable to work my minimum wage, part-time job and had no income. The emergency room bill was the first to threaten to sue for nonpayment.

Would the 'acceptable' tea party solution have been for me to just go home, die and not become a 'drain' on the pro-life, taxpaying society?
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Too bad you aren't an unborn 3rd child of an unwed teenager. Then these assholes would picket and work tirelessly to save your life. However, you statistically would be a drain on society your entire life.
 
jackoroe said:
I'm sorry, where exactly did I say that?
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By endorsing Perry's execution record.

Statistically, better than a dozen of those executed were innocent. By evidence, at least one was definitely innocent. More than a few were mentally impaired, as well.

Yet all you could say was how nice it is that all those nasty people had been put to death.
 
jackoroe said:
It costs more because we drag it out over decades. The process needs to be truncated.
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The people who cheer for it tend to be Christians. We could truncate it nicely by applying one of the Bible's rules: two witnesses, whose testimonies agree.

But we could truncate it more by leaving it where it belongs: at the hands of the intended victim(s), or a rescuer.
 
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