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Russian Invasion of Ukraine

In response to the transfer of Iranian missiles there is another flurry of meaningless sanctions against parties in Iran and Rxxxsha...but more interestingly, the UK and US are about to announce that Ukraine will be permitted to use ATACMS inside Rooozja. I suspect because of Iran's missiles about to be used on Ukraine.

This may be a tactic to dissuade the Kremlin from using these missiles...but the warning is clear. Rzzia is planning a massive assault on Ukraine in the next month or so and no longer has the capacity to manufacture enough of their own missiles to continue the barrages at the pace they have been.

The distance from Nikopol to the Kerch bridge is 190 miles...the same distance that an ATACM can travel.

Ukraine has summoned Iran's ambassador yesterday to deliver their warning, but likely to no avail. Iran has chosen evil at every step of the way and are looking to do anything to hurt the western nations.

Meanwhile:

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Once again, this is what WW3 looks like. And has looked like since WW2 ended.
 
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WW3 will be when Zelinksy throws a big enough fit to get to use long range missiles inside of Russia and Russia is forced to use nukes. I realize we can nuke them back and destroy them also.
 
ravenstone said:
WW3 will be when Zelinksy throws a big enough fit to get to use long range missiles inside of Russia and Russia is forced to use nukes. I realize we can nuke them back and destroy them also.
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Russia forced itself to invade Ukraine in the first place. The only people "forcing" Russia to use nukes is Russia. Blaming everyone else for Russia's invasion is just a bullshit move and makes you look like you're wallowing Putina's propaganda. Russia can end this war in a week, with no need for anyone else. Russia won't, because Russia is full of warmongering criminals. If Russia uses a nuke, Russia will be the first to die. It's pretty pathetic when your only option is to threaten suicide because your army sucks and is full of thieves.

Russia invaded.

Russia is the aggressor.

Russia broke international law.

Russia murdered infants, raped kids and women, tortured everyone they could catch, and stole everything they could carry off.

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rareboy said:
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Once again, this is what WW3 looks like. And has looked like since WW2 ended.
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It's funny when people think Russian nuclear threats are anything but weakness.
 
Oh how quickly the complaints produce adjudication.

I apologize for personalising my rejection of the hypothesis being proposed.
 
ravenstone said:
I think it's scary that you think Russia will do nothing once American and British long range missiles start blowing up Russia.
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They might.

And it would be the last thing that they do.
 
ravenstone said:
I think it's scary that you think Russia will do nothing once American and British long range missiles start blowing up Russia.
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I think it's funny that they've done nothing they've threatened at all for the past three years. There is a foreign army taking Russian territory and Putin did fuck all about it. What makes you so terrified?
 
rareboy said:
And it it Zelenski. Or Zelensky.

Not Zelinsky. None of us have a fucking clue who that is supposed to be.
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In fairness, everyone and his horse understood, and the media here and abroad spell his name differently, sometimes doubling the Y, etc.

Using a spelling quibble to impugn an opposing view is pure propaganda. The issue is the issue, not some slur to imply stupidity rather than say it explicitly.
 
Ukraine has little choice but to "escalate" the war, meaning to go on the offensive where it counts, on Russian soil.

She is gradually losing the war of attrition and has no presumed help from Russians opposed to the war with it all being far away.

And yes, it raises the stakes for everyone, including the U.S. and Europe.

It is tempting to ask whether Japan or Germany would have used a nuclear weapon in defeat had they the option, but their world really isn't our world, nor are they Russia.

We have no doubt that Putin would use nukes abroad before announcing retreat from Ukraine. He won't allow the territory to be rebuilt and better after being lost to Russia.

We should be supporting Ukraine's escalation. And we, and our European allies, should be exerting tremendous pressure on Russia to not begin the end of our world for a territorial dispute. And if we allow Kiev to fall, we have proven that we have deluded ourselves about the "dissolution" of Soviet Russia. We let Eastern Europe be sacrificed before. If NATO looks the other way now, we'd be making all of them expendable again.

There should be a point beyond which NATO declares war against Russia and forces the crisis overtly, as this is on Europe's doorstep. But Germany will block that, and already has. She views her neighbor as not her problem.

We actually need an international crisis greater than the Cuban missile crisis. We need to be brought closer to the brink to avoid being pushed into the abyss. Everyone NEEDS to believe it is going to happen in order to work to avoid it, not the least of which is the population of Russia. If they believe it, they will Krushnev Mr. Putin, just the way they did after the Cuban fiasco.
 
ravenstone said:
I think it's scary that you think Russia will do nothing once American and British long range missiles start blowing up Russia.
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We are only talking about military targets so blowing up Russia isn’t in the cards but let me ask you something, Russia is being supplied by Iran, North Korea and China now if Putin did use nuclear weapons I think the North Koreans would be thrilled but not the other 2 in my opinion and may even pull back from Putin. Do you think Iran and China would be fine with Putin going nuclear?
 
Norri said:
We are only talking about military targets so blowing up Russia isn’t in the cards but let me ask you something, Russia is being supplied by Iran, North Korea and China now if Putin did use nuclear weapons I think the North Koreans would be thrilled but not the other 2 in my opinion and may even pull back from Putin. Do you think Iran and China would be fine with Putin going nuclear?
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China is never going to openly support Putin in any way they can't deny is war related, or in any way that threatens Western markets. Nuking Europe would directly make their financial problems that much worse. Nuking the U.S. would tank China's economy. What they trade with Russia is dwarfed by comparison, and never was a significant percentage of their exports.

They are more aware of that than we are.
 
ravenstone said:
I think it's scary that you think Russia will do nothing once American and British long range missiles start blowing up Russia.
Click to expand...

Russia has already been told by the U.S. and NATO exactly what will happen if Putin launches even one nuke: their entire military capability west of the Urals will be eliminated, which could be done in less than ten days.

It was Putin's choice to do this to Russia; no one else bears any blame.
 
ravenstone said:
I agree 100 percent, I however think they can also cause major damage to the earth, as well as strike many major cities.
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If Russia hit any cities with nukes it would be the end of Russia, and it wouldn't take the U.S. or anyone else using nukes back to do it. It wouldn't take NATO even a week to gain absolute air superiority all the way to the Urals, a few more days to finish off all Russian military power anywhere in the world, then destroy every major rail hub in Russia by the end of the second week. The only use of nukes might be a half-dozen high-altitude air bursts to generate EMP to wipe out Russia's communications ability.

Afterwards Russia might look something like this:

1726256959454.png

of Moscow would even be allowed to keep as much as is shown in red -- personally I'd take the five southeastern most oblasts in red and give them to orange.

( Guessing at capitals for those new countries: red is obviously Moscow while green's would be St. Petersburg; I'd say blue's capital would be Volgograd and lavender's would be Novosibirsk; for orange maybe Yekaterinaburg?; the only city I know of in the gray area is Vladivostok.)

The big issue would be the nukes; my suggestion would be for the EU to buy all the fissile material and put it to practical use.


[note: the yellow border lines are where existing political subunits were divided; all the white ones are existing borders]
 
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