Some Advice Please

[Corny]

I’m just a regular guy – I like rock music, cars, technology and such and there just doesn’t seem to be anyone (locally anyway) who would be my equal.

Welcome to my/our world ... oh ok wait .. I don't like cars - but the rest.
It seems you have more of a problem with your surroundings and the gay community then with being gay for yourself. Do you think that the straight people you see on for example .. big brother or other trash tv formats are representative for your country? No? So don't see the people you see on dating websites, or those who are "obviously" behaving gay in public as representative for the gay community. You just don't see the rest, because they are like you, me and many many others just ordinary guys who happen to be gay. If you meet them on the streets you will never know it, unless they are like .. with their bf holding hands You see this is why an "outside look" will not bring you forward in finding your equal. But before you start with that, you might want to come clean with your friends first. Often all that gay = synonym for anything bad talk is just stupid talk with no real homophobic background. But often means not always .. you need to find out who is really homophobic or not. Does nobody ever call them out on their crap? Do they do the same around girls (who are usually turned off by this kind of talk)? Have you ever tried to call them out on it? Could you live without the homophobic ones? Mind that they will show their true colors if you decide to come out, and that even a few of the less homophobic ones will bend for peer pressure ..
Is that bad? Certainly. But would it be better to continue being an actor amongst your friends? Many uncertainities, many fears and doubts .. I know. Get clean with yourself before .. are you into men? Or into women? Into both? Did you ever try something with a guy? Are you really into women, or is it just for your friends and to keep you away from guys? You have much thinking to do, and nobody says it is easy, but do it now rather than later .. when it might be to late. You don't want to become one of those guys who married a woman to please his sourroundings, got kids and a family - to only at some point in his life discover that he totally fucked up, and that escaping this live now is almost impossible, so he lives this miserable live til the end ...

 

[slickery]

Good advice!

Another note you mentioned you know a couple people who are invovled in the gay community, but you don't like them. Why don't you like them? Before I came out, I noticed obvious gays around and I didn't care for them either, yet when I thought about it, I didn't really dislike them. I made myself think I didn't like them because they were so out and proud and as with acting straight it wasn't "cool."

The first step I think you need to take is deciding what YOU really want as far as your orientation goes. Second step is to find a real person to talk to as you can get post after post of advice but it's nearly as good as a real person. So go to a meeting, talk to one of "out" guys you know. The third step is diffuse your friends of their terrible English. Many people use gay in a negative tone, turn it around! Th nest time you are with someone and they say "that was gay" ask them "what makes it gay" "what is gay?" Make them think about what they are saying. Afterall no one would ever say something racist if there was someone around they know it would offend.

But first figure out what you want and work from there.

 

[slickery]

Yeah but see the thing is, if you don't challenge your mates, or put yourself out there things are only going to get worse.

When I was coming out, I had a friend who was always "gay this gay that" always called me a fag and shit like that. It was just how he spoke. He was one of the last people to find out, but it happened in a rather heated blow up. I mean in the end he was completely cool with it, and was kind of sad that it took me so long to tell him since we were like best mates at th time. I explained to him that his use of language made it very difficult and he understood. The same went for when I told my brothers, they were the same way, but often people don't realise how much words can hurt. So I say work your friends first. You will probably be surprised with how much support you might actually get from them.

Another thing is, a lot of people "wait" until they think they will feel comfortable, but oftentimes, it just doesn't happen that way. I definitely think it would be easier confiding in someone first before you started sneaking around. Then you just have to do even more hiding and lying and it just grows and becomes even more difficult.

 

[Lube]

Oh, Fordman, I really feel for you. 3 years ago I was where you are now.

I really didn't like the word 'gay', and certainly didn't want it applied to me. So much baggage associated with that word.

Eventually, I got to the point where I stopped worrying what other people thought.

I stopped letting other people dictate who I was, or who I loved.

I accepted me for being me.

It takes a while. It's an interesting journey. It makes you a man, even if you're a gay man.

 

[Lube]

... I just know that most of that list will pitter into oblivion in other people's eyes if I am actually gay.

Huh?!
I don't get that at all.

 

[Eagle653]

I think every bi and gay man in every small town around the world identifies with your problem. There's no real easy answer for this, but what some men have done is usually one of two things: One, they set up a network of friends--even sex partners--in a larger, more anonymous city (perhaps in your case, London?). They spend a weekend or so a month in that city, getting a breath of fresh air. Or, two, they just up and relocate to that city and start anew and form a network of friends who are accepting and supportive.

I don't know how realistic the second option is for you with your career, etc. Maybe it's something down the road if you end up feeling strongly about it.

It's interesting that you think your friends might know, or suspect--yet they continue to make such crude and hostile remarks. Either they really don't know (or denying whatever messages their inner brains are telling them about you), OR they are sending warning shots across your bow telling you to stay in the closet and play straight--or else. Either scenario is obnoxious and you really do need to develop a network of friends who not only know about you, but accept you and support you and lead you to better things. These small-town friends of yours are stuck in the 1950s and are ultimately very unhealthy. Get going--your mental health depends on it.

Good luck!

 

[Lube]

It's interesting that you think your friends might know, or suspect--yet they continue to make such crude and hostile remarks. Either they really don't know (or denying whatever messages their inner brains are telling them about you), OR they are sending warning shots across your bow telling you to stay in the closet and play straight--or else. Either scenario is obnoxious and you really do need to develop a network of friends who not only know about you, but accept you and support you and lead you to better things. These small-town friends of yours are stuck in the 1950s and are ultimately very unhealthy. Get going--your mental health depends on it.

Good luck!

I won't disagree with the first part of what Eagle653 said, but the part quoted above is something I don't really believe to be true. I doubt anyone is sending warning shots across any bows.

I think it's probably just what they expect other men to say, or perhaps they're hiding their own insecurities. They will probably come around when you come out.

People tend to flock to people similar to themselves. So all your "straight" friends may not be so straight after all. There may be reciprocating coming-out stories here.

Good luck.

 

[DVM26uk]

I think first and foremost a lot of straight lads have been mentally conditioned to use words like gay in a negative way. Especially when there's gay activity on TV or in their presence, it's their way of declaring to those around them that they are most certainly not gay.

I know that sounds like I'm justifying their anti-gay behaviour but unfortunately that's just how lads of that age group in England behave.

With that in mind and as hurtful as it can be I don't think you should take it as a personal insult.

As for the dating thing, been there worn the t-shirt. Like you, I don't approve of how some people behave on those dating sites and the whole experience can be pretty shallow at times. In saying that now and again you can meet some really nice people but to do so generally requires a lot of time and patience as most people are usually only ever looking for a quick one night stand.

Oh one more thing, your room mate is probably paranoid that if you declare yourself gay it'll look like he's your living lover.

 

[nautiboyjeff]

I guess I go back to the fact that you have never had sex with a guy. I think you should go on a few trips to a major city and go out to a gay bar (if you truly are social, you'll meet some people quickly). Hang out, enjoy yourself. See the other side.

Many people on here advise that you should throw open the closet doors, but I think it's a process and after it's done, you forget the mental anguish - it's the gay's childbirth - forgetting all the pain.

Try to keep using the dating sites, just go in with your eyes wide open and I encourage you to meet someplace public and a quick get-away (like a coffee shop). That way if they bother you, you can say you have to go. If you meet someone you like, then go to a pub, one step at a time.

Many straight people date secretly before introducing their girlfriend or boyfriend to the group of friends, you can do the same thing and you might have more confidence about being gay.

Online dating sites get a bad rap, sometimes justified, other times they can be a way for people to meet like-minded people. You just have to have good judgment about people and you sound like you have that quality from your job and life skills.

Hang in there and you don't have to rush out of the closet, it will come to you and you will feel when it's right for you to tell your friends. As far as their comments, I think you are right, they just say things and don't know they are offending anyone - when you come out, you will be one of those people who change minds about who's gay and who's not.

Good luck!

 

[mars1013]

You know, it's uncanny: I'm in almost exactly the same situation as you are. The only difference is that I do have gay friends that I like and are like me; it makes things much easier to deal with.

There's a lot of good advice here; one thing I'd recommend is come out slowly and only to those you feel comfortable with. Work up from there--it's really helped me.
As for relationships, I've never (not kidding) been in one because I've been so afraid of what might happen (small-town bullshit and all). I go to a much larger city for university--but even there, I've only come out to a few people.

I guess what I'm trying to say with this (not trying to make it a sob story or anything) is that it takes time. But don't lose heart!

 

[Lube]

Wow, what MoltenRock said. Really great post.

Keep in mind that, as long as you stay in the closet, you are unintentionally telling people that you agree with them that being gay is shameful.

In the closet, you are not living your life: you are living the life that others tell you you should. You are miserable in order to make other people happy.

Does that sound rational to you?

 

[Lube]

I must take issue with some of the points here. Firstly I am not anti-gay in any way, I have good friends that are gay who I respect as much as anyone else.

I had gay friends for 25 years, and still couldn't admit to myself I was gay. It was OK for them to be gay, but for some reason it wasn't OK for me to be gay. A horrible double-standard. I didn't actually verbalize it like that, but in retrospect that must've been what I was thinking.

Secondly, you've gone one better than me in actually deciding that I am gay. Surely that's for me to decide.

No, it's not for you to decide. It's not for anyone to decide. You are what you are, and you can't change it. Just accept it. Or not.

 

[KaraBulut]

I must take issue with some of the points here. Firstly I am not anti-gay in any way, I have good friends that are gay who I respect as much as anyone else. What i'm not turned on by is uber-camp people because I find them irritating, and blabbermouths piss me off because i'm not the gossip type. This is not because the said people are gay, its the attributes I dislike, much like you could dislike someone for being pushy, racist, annoyingly-thick etc.

So by their profiles alone you've pigeon holed them as "shameless male whores" and "absolute screaming queens".

Sorry, but I have to agree with fordman24. He's not necessarily a bigot or a homophobe for using those terms. We know what he's talking about and we all know people that fit the stereotypes that he's talking about- and they're not always gay or male.

It very common- when you're first dealing with your own sexuality- to be very uncomfortable around effeminate gay men. But once you get more comfortable with yourself, you will see that whether a guy is effeminate or not has nothing to do with bitchiness or tendency toward being a blabbermouth. Until you get to that level of comfort with yourself, it's much easier to see the world in terms of stereotypes.

And it's human nature to see the world in terms of what you don't want to be instead of finding out what it is that you want to be.

Secondly, you've gone one better than me in actually deciding that I am gay. Surely that's for me to decide. Yes it sounds like i'm at the start of a potentially long journey, but that's not to say that the conclusion is that I am gay. Ok that's a big possibility but let me find that one out in due course yeah....

You're confusing being gay with living a "gay lifestyle".

Your sexuality is defined very early in your life. As you get older, it is like a fog that clears. At some point, you find where you are in between that broad range between totally het and totally gay. You can fight it but ultimately you cannot change it.

The way you live your life is your choice. You can be assimiliated and have a life that is mixed between gay and straight friends and quite ordinary. You could also be glitter-fabulous, if that is what makes you happy. One is not better than the other- you just have you find your own way.

What really matters in the end is that you life your life honestly and true to who you are.

Thankyou for all your comments. I'm not sure what to do right now but your advice has been noted and will hopefully guide me in some direction - wish me luck :-D

There are no easy answers. The problem is not you- it is the attitudes of your friends (and to a certain extent your own). You can't change who you are but you may have to change your friends. That's assuming of course that you want to find love and companionship someday.

 

[Fedfan]

Can't believe how similar this is to my life. I'm 24 and from a village in the East Midlands. I think I'm gay but there's still some girls I like. After uni I moved back home with my parents (hopefully not for much longer) which has kind of affected my lifestyle. I've also been focusing on my career which has limited my freetime.

I always lived with guys at uni so had to act straight. Guess now its a new year will make a resolution to do something about it. Just need to figure out what. Most of my friends seem to be in longterm relationships so a bit bored of being the single friend.

Good luck fordman in figuring out what to do. Hope I can do the same.

 

[Lube]

I'm not doubting that there's a load of decent gay people on them, and out there in the wider world.

That, for me, was the beauty of JUB. Finding that there are all sorts of gay guys out there.

But also learning to accept myself for what I am.

Have you ventured out to find a gay special-interest group in a nearby city? What do you like to do, hobby-wise?

 

[Fedfan]

Fordman

Which dating sites did you try? Were they any good? I thought about going to a gay bar though I still find the idea pretty scary. Have you been to any?

 

[Fedfan]

I might try them. Do you have to give names and photo's or is it all pretty anonymous? Not too optimistic but you never know. Maybe I'll find someone like me - educated and ambitious (though maybe more modest).

Thought I might go to a bar on my own early one evening when I'm next in one of the cities near me. Probably not my nearest city in case I knew anyone there. Is that a bit sad?

 

[fezzfoot]

I was previously fordman24 and last week, at the ripe old age of 31, I eventually came out as gay to family and friends.

Between 2008 and now I have experimented to the point where I was as certain as I could ever be that I was gay. The last 18 months or so I've been pretty certain and in the last 6 months or so in particular I've mentally strangled myself, drinking really heavily and feeling very low because I knew it was inevitable that I'd have to admit it someday.

Well last Sunday was that day and say what you will about alcohol, the hangover it gave me last week was the final straw. I asked myself how long I could keep on like this, feeling like I was in an ever-shrinking box. I was becoming more insular, anxious, nervous and humble around friends and some of them were starting to ask if I was ok etc.

Since 2008 there has been one person leave our friendship group (for thieving) and the rest of us have matured well together. We've all mentioned how good the group ethic is (probably the best it has ever been) and how we're looking forward to future plans etc. All these subtle things have prodded me in the right direction and last week I declared my news - first to close family, then to close friends.

The perceptions I had of my friends back in 2008, bearing in mind I still live in the same town, had changed significantly and I was reasonably confident that most of them would at least be ok with the news. Nonetheless, I prepared myself for the worst (as I tend to do anyway) and sent a message to everyone who mattered.

It's early days and I haven't seen everyone face-to-face since, but early indications are that everything is ok. My dad is worried, probably more than I am, and he's being a bit weird (questioning his parental skills etc despite me telling him nobody has done anything wrong) but he's on my side at least. Everyone else seems to have been fine. One friend is saying the right things but I sense he's in partial denial - time will tell how that pans out. One of my best friends, we went for a meal yesterday and it wasn't awkward at all. We didn't avoid the topic, but the evening was totally normal for us which is great.

I haven't got a fella and probably won't go looking for one this side of Xmas until I get used to my "new normal", mentally speaking. I feel bad for underestimating just how good my friends and family are, but so thankful that they are.

Like I say, early days, but it has been a bit of a non-event up to now. I'm expecting some bumps in the road moving forwards but hopefully that's the hardest bit out of the way. Once I've taken stock of the whole situation, I'll need to get out there and find me a fella.

I'll stand by my earlier comments about the "queens" and "blabbermouths" - I still don't like these character traits and if I have my way, they will be the last people who get to know.

Time flies doesn't it!?

 

[TX-Beau]

Congratulations. Isn't it nice having that weight off your back?

The biggest secret about being out is how few people actually care in the end. The world keeps spinning, the paper gets delivered, birds sing and dogs still bark.

I don't know what being a "blabbermouth" has to do with gay anything, but "Queens" have a whole spectrum of personalities, so by that term I'm going to assume you mean "effeminate," and since you seem to be defensive about it, I'll just refer you to the previous posters who explained why gay men, out and otherwise dislike "effeminate."

Don't worry, Queens and blabbermouths probably don't care much anyway.

 

[Ganoderma]

hi fezzfoot (formerly fordman24),

Thanks for the update and congratulated that you have finally taken the step to tell your family and friends that you are a gay guy. I fully agree with TX-Beau that you will experience that very few people will care. Great that you also have experienced that your coming-out is some sort of non-event of others. I even tend to think that all of your friends will have realized themselves that you don't seem to have much interest in girls.

Hey man, you are living in the UK and the attitude in the last few years towards gay people has changed alot in a positive way in your country. I would like to wish you good luck. Friends who will give you a cold shoulder are no friends, and you can just ignore them.

Take care & feel free to react and/or ask for more advise.