Sort of in a new relationship, have very little experience, and am in need of support and common sense!

[sekunder]

Hey guys - I really need some help. I just wrote a looong post and it got accidentally deleted so I am starting over again, god help me. I will likely be a bit briefer this time, which is probably good...

The gist of it all is this... I am a 29 year old gay guys. I'm twinkish, and look a good bit younger than my age, which is good I suppose, since I have wasted most of my life. I was a drug addict for almost all of my adult life, addicted mostly to opiates - didn't get clean until 3 years ago, when I was 26. Been putting things together since then, and getting treatment for mental illness issues (PTSD, social anxiety...) that lead to my long-term substance abuse.

So anyway, about a year ago I meet this guy online who is really nice. He's a psychiatrist finishing up his residency, we'll call him R. Me and R hit off online and talked a lot - he is a bit more average looking, a bit bear-ish (which I like, i lurv guys with body hair who are actually masculine) and I am rather femme and twink-ish with my body type, which he is very attracted to, so that worked out...

A note here... I have had very little sexual experience. Almost none. Only one relationship when I was 24 that was brief, did involved some sex, but I was a drug addict and never had an orgasm or got much enjoyment out of it, and it was... difficult. I should add I was sexually abused as a child, as well - something I was honest with R about, and him being a psychiatrist (a smart one who went to Harvard who was my age, 29, no less) and queer, I felt I could be very honest with him.

We wound up going on a few dates that went VERY well (this was all about 14 months ago, bear in mind) and over that summer we got to know each other, going slowly. I mostly wanted someone to cuddle with and maybe kiss a bit and talk to a lot and just.. be with. And R was very obliging and really happy to be there for me. Our 'relationship' was odd and I'm not sure what it was... I was terrified of initiating or having sex at the time, and R was way too gentle and understanding to push things, and just let me do whatever at my own pace. He was amazingly patient.

And this past winter I was utterly awful to him sometimes.... a big part of social anxiety is feeling like you're this awful revolting person who nobody would want to be around and whom everyone is just tolerating, and it's not rational but it makes me want to lock myself up in my apartment and never see anyone. And at times I was just so depressed/upset/self-hating that I couldn't respond to his texts for weeks at a time, or a month a time (except when he would be really concerned and ask if I was alive and OK) and wouldnt see him, or anyone really..It was so awful, so miserable. So there was a rhythm where I'd be OK and we'd hang out and go to dinner and cuddle and talk and maybe fool around with clothes on... And this went on for 14 months, seriously. And R never got another boyfriend, or even had sex with anyone else during this time period - I totally believe him, and it's not as if he had to make any effort to convince me.

But just last sunday, almost a week ago, something... clicked in my brain. I could write a whole 'nother post on what that was, but I wound up going over to R's place sort of spontaneously Sunday afternoon - was hot out. We wound up going upstairs to where the air conditioner in his bedroom was. And I just... wound up tugging at his pants and one thing led to another, and soon I was giving him a handjob and admiring his magnificent cock - and then soon I was going down on him and shedding my clothes and enjoying sex like I have never enjoyed anything before, while he did a few things to me. Even though he had happened to jerk off a few hours before I came over that morning I wound up working R up to a nice orgasm that happened all over my face Which was just hot as HELL. I didn't have an orgasm but it was unbelievably pleasurable and awesome and amazing and the first time I'd had sex in 5 years.

Then 2 days later, well... We did it again. Except this time, I wanted to try a bit of anal maybe - I had camwhored a lot and done some stuff to myself, but never had anyone else, yknow, some stuff to me like that.. and just two fingers wound up being sooooo freaking intense, SO freaking overwhelmingly plreasurable that I was literally spasming almost and making sounds I *never* make and actual saw stars after about 15 seconds as I came harder than I have in my life. I thought that was just an expresion, 'seeing stars', didn't know it was... literal Naturally, I was a good buy and sucked R off to his own climax again while he did this and that... All in All it's been so, so, so much better and less stressful and more enjoyable than I could have imagined.


But anyway, with all this... I don't really know where I'm at. R had to go upstate for a long weekend and is coming back Monday, so we are both waiting very eagerly to get together again. I don't know... I don't have much relationship advice but I mean, R is a gay man with a fairly strong sex drive, and he waited over a year for me, very patiently, with no sex. I think he probably is in love with me? I don't know how I feel. I don't know how he feels for *sure*, to be honest... I know I turn him on like crazy and he finds me really attractive, or he wouldn't get hard every time I so much as put my head on his shoulder. But I mean, again, I'm a *really* really hairless twink who looks way younger than his age, so I'm probably a bit of a catch for guys who are into that sort of thing.

I've probably forgotten some stuff, writing this the second time... I would just like any advice or support... Things are changing so fast, I mean, I just had my first orgasm in sex a few days ago! And with anal, I sort of know how to prepare, but like... I've heard conflicted reports, some people say just make sure you use the bathroom earlier that day and make things clean, some guys say you should douche/enema, I mean... I don't want to be embarrassed or anything, though one of he nice things is that R is like... I'm just not embarrassed around him, about anything. We have a pretty high comfort level together, always have...

Ugh. Anyhow. I'm just in blind territory. I don't even know what to call our relationship. Don't know what it was and don't know what it is. I am sorry about the wall of text. Hope it was fun to read, regardless.

 

[sekunder]

Oh, and here's a pic of me just for the hell of it. I know this pic is camwhore as fuck but it's just my pale pale skin in the morning light, I only think my eyes look cool. I seriously didn't mess with the contrast or anything. I do normally try to look less gloomy, lol.

 

[palbert]

First, it's good to have another Mainer on JUB.

Sounds like you're off to a very good start with a relationship that pleases both of you. Hard to ask for more.

As for anal, I always douche just to guarantee clean, but don't over do it. Don't douche so much you actually end up prompting the feces down into the rectum. You can google anal cleansing easily enough.

All the best to you.

(Having suffered from early childhood sex abuse I understand where you have been.)

 

[palbert]

You might want to check out the Sticky "All About Ass," particularly

http://www.justusboys.com/forum/threads/272148-All-About-Ass?p=5263237&viewfull=1#post5263237

 

[KaraBulut]

.. I'm just in blind territory. I don't even know what to call our relationship. Don't know what it was and don't know what it is. I am sorry about the wall of text. Hope it was fun to read, regardless.

The sex part is going to be the easy part of all of this.

The emotional part is going to be more complicated. Listening to your history, there's been a lot of numbing of your feelings and avoidance of intimacy.

This guy sounds like he's a nice and there's a lot of potential for an emotional and physical relationship between the two of you. You owe it to him to be honest with him about the reason for your past behavior and that you want to start out on the right foot this time.

 

[sekunder]

Thanks for the feedback so far guys, it's good to just like... Talk about this.

And it honestly does feel like we're starting a new relationship and just all the dynamics are changing with sex being introduced. I think it's a very prescient comment for KaraBulut to make that sex is going to be the easiest (and probably most fun/enjoyable) part of all of this. There has been a lot of numbing of feelings and avoidance of intimacy in my life, and sex is just... On the occasions when I am having it (which have not been many as I said) I am just reminded so strongly of how incredibly intimate it is and how... vulnerable you are in every way imaginable - emotional, physical, etc. And as you say, for people like me it's a hard point to get to. But getting to that point... I'm definitely feeling it all, and I want to, and it's the hugest different between this relationship, which I'm having while sober - and my last relationship which I had as a drug-addict, where I was numbing everything all the time and in total denial about tons of things.


I don't know if I was clear about this, but I was up-front with him about my past from the very beginning, actually, before our first date - because we met on OKC, and just talked back and forth sending long messages for a long time. I was having some issues, and he was this smart and cool psychiatrist who had just bought a house in my town and was moving there in a few weeks. In some ways, I did my best to scare him off from the very beginning last year, when we were first getting to know each other. And he was not scared off in the slightest, and did not mind, and sincerely seemed to like me as a person, as I am. And being someone with no self-esteem and social anxiety, that sort of thing is difficult for me to accept, and it did take a long time, obviously, in a way. I mean, we did a spend like a year doing nothing but being friends and cuddling/fooling around with clothes on occasionally now and then...

I wanted to go further a lot of times, but it just didn't happen until, well, it did happen. I know that's self-evident but I can't put it any other way. R was not going to initiate sex and he was not going to put me in any position where I felt remotely uncomfortable - because he did know my history, and understood that it just would not work out or end well if he tried to force things. And like I said, it's really to his credit that he was totally patient and never even made me feel pressured. He really treated me way better than I treated him over this past year..

But anyway, yes, he really does know all about my past behavior - I've probably talked it to death at times, heh. Me being a former drug addict and him being a psychiatrist, we can also hold fun conversations about psychopharmacology from two entirely different angles, which is highly amusing.

But I am much better about not numbing my feelings anymore, or avoiding intimacy. I honestly think the fact that I initiated this, and did it, and enjoyed it, and did it again (and reaaaalllllyyyy can't wait to pick up where we left off ) probably speaks to the fact that I'm not avoiding intimacy anymore. Because while it does scare me a bit at first... I'm never scared once I get over to his place and we're actually together. There's no fear or anxiety going on at all, which is really wonderful.

 

[Seasoned]

This all sounds like it's on sound footing and that you are both open and honest. You both also seem like nice, decent people. I have one concern for you and it's a large one. Has he been vulnerable with you insofar as sharing his quirks and vulnerabilities? Given your issues and his profession there could be problems down the road if either of you think of him as the "healthy" one and you the "sick" one. Relationships work best if, despite strengths and weaknesses, each party brings something the other is lacking. I hope this makes sense. I know it's something he'll understand if you should bring it up with him.

Happy continued healing!!! Good for you and congratulations on your sobriety.

Don't get too hung up on the feces issue of anal sex with a loving partner. It's not the end of the world if sex gets interrupted occasionally, or if you lay down a towel or pad, or if someone pulls out with a bit of a mess. Let the two of you figure it out together. You'll learn that with a loving, caring partner in a sober relationship that everything can be discussed and that there needn't be any real secrets.

If things keep going as they have been you soon will be very comfortable having this discussion with him.

Best wishes on all fronts in your new life. You deserve every happiness. XXOO

 

[KaraBulut]

...and how... vulnerable you are in every way imaginable - emotional, physical, etc. And as you say, for people like me it's a hard point to get to...

I don't know if I was clear about this, but I was up-front with him about my past from the very beginning, actually, before our first date - because we met on OKC, and just talked back and forth sending long messages for a long time. I was having some issues, and he was this smart and cool psychiatrist who had just bought a house in my town and was moving there in a few weeks...

..Given your issues and his profession there could be problems down the road if either of you think of him as the "healthy" one and you the "sick" one. Relationships work best if, despite strengths and weaknesses, each party brings something the other is lacking. I hope this makes sense. I know it's something he'll understand if you should bring it up with him. ...

^QFT. Seasoned also picked up on the same issue.

You can't change your past. It's good that you've told him about what has happened to you and you've given him some insight into why you may have acted the way that you have toward him in the past.

But this is now about the present and putting some of that past behind you. Your relationship is changing- you've been mostly friends with a bit of patient-therapist and a bit of physical/sexual interest. If you're interested in making a change and going beyond just friends, it's a good time to talk about how that might change things and what you both want.

It may that you aren't looking for something serious and that you just want to take things day-by-day and that's perfectly okay if that is what you both want.

It may be that you're getting more emotionally involved and maybe that is not what he's wanting at this time in his life.

Unless you both have that talk together, neither of you will be sure of what the other person wants.

In order to transition into an adult-to-adult relationship, you both need to be on equal footing. So, as Seasoned pointed out, he needs to open up about what he wants and he needs to take the risk of being less-than-perfect, too.

 

[sekunder]

Thank you guys, for the last two posts. They've really given me a lot to think about, to be honest.

This all sounds like it's on sound footing and that you are both open and honest. You both also seem like nice, decent people. I have one concern for you and it's a large one. Has he been vulnerable with you insofar as sharing his quirks and vulnerabilities? Given your issues and his profession there could be problems down the road if either of you think of him as the "healthy" one and you the "sick" one. Relationships work best if, despite strengths and weaknesses, each party brings something the other is lacking. I hope this makes sense. I know it's something he'll understand if you should bring it up with him.

Happy continued healing!!! Good for you and congratulations on your sobriety.

Don't get too hung up on the feces issue of anal sex with a loving partner. It's not the end of the world if sex gets interrupted occasionally, or if you lay down a towel or pad, or if someone pulls out with a bit of a mess. Let the two of you figure it out together. You'll learn that with a loving, caring partner in a sober relationship that everything can be discussed and that there needn't be any real secrets.

If things keep going as they have been you soon will be very comfortable having this discussion with him.

Best wishes on all fronts in your new life. You deserve every happiness. XXOO

Surprisingly, there isn't really too much of a patient/therapist vibe between us when we actually hang out. I mean, he works crazy long hours, and I got the vibe early on that he doesn't exactly want to come home and *continue* being a psychiatrist to his friends, or anything - I mean god, who'd want to? So while we'd have some interesting conversations about this and that, and early on I may utilized him more in that capacity, I've actually been kinda careful *not* to encourage that dynamic of me being "sick" or anything like that.

And we actually had a lot of similar issues, in some respects - he also has social anxiety disorder, for instance. We both had stutters as children, which we have both gotten over but comes back sometimes. We're both single gay men who live alone with our cats and prefer to stay in on Friday nights, haha.

And thank you actually, for those comments about the feces thing >_> I think this is something that anyone new to bottoming is worried about. He already had a couple fingers in there last time when I had my mind-blowing orgasm and certainly didn't complain about anything or run to go wash his hand or anything, haha. Sex is dirty, messy, filthy, lots of bodily fluids and various noises and all that. I think that's probably a good way to look at it, as long you view that in positive terms - which I do

^QFT. Seasoned also picked up on the same issue.

You can't change your past. It's good that you've told him about what has happened to you and you've given him some insight into why you may have acted the way that you have toward him in the past.

But this is now about the present and putting some of that past behind you. Your relationship is changing- you've been mostly friends with a bit of patient-therapist and a bit of physical/sexual interest. If you're interested in making a change and going beyond just friends, it's a good time to talk about how that might change things and what you both want.

It may that you aren't looking for something serious and that you just want to take things day-by-day and that's perfectly okay if that is what you both want.

It may be that you're getting more emotionally involved and maybe that is not what he's wanting at this time in his life.

Unless you both have that talk together, neither of you will be sure of what the other person wants.

In order to transition into an adult-to-adult relationship, you both need to be on equal footing. So, as Seasoned pointed out, he needs to open up about what he wants and he needs to take the risk of being less-than-perfect, too.

Hmm, to address this and what Seasoned was saying as well a bit... he's fairly open for the most part, but is definitely guarded about certain things. I've definitely opened up more to him about my fucked-up issues, which doesn't mean he doesn't have them too, of course.

His bigger issues - which could potentially become a dealbreaker if we ever did get seriously involved - is that he is much more closeted than he should be. He grew up with really shitty parents - never knew his father, absent mother, and was raised primarily by his grandmother, who is now dead. He's never been close to his mother and feels no need to come out to her, and just doesn't really have an extended family he stays in contact with, for good reason it seems. What's worrying is that he's also been closeted at the jobs he's worked thus far and at school, so he's clearly kept his sexuality separate from his work/school life, and there's clearly something there. I've talked a little to him about it, and got the vibe that it was definitely a sore spot, somehow, though I'm not entirely sure why or how.

Now.. I never had these issues, but that doesn't mean I can't empathize with them. I try to strike a balance of gently nudging and encouraging him. We're both very introverted guys, and neither of us really like to go out and be around a ton of people. But I'd been trying to sort of... I don't know, be slightly physically affectionate in public sometimes, trying to get him to hold hands now and then, try to push his boundaries a bit without being harsh about it. So I know he has those insecurities, and there's the fact that he's a bit insecure about his appearance not being totally perfect - the usual stuff gay guys worry about at that age - hair starting to get a little bit thin maybe, more body hair than they had to deal with in the past, etc. I'm insanely insecure so I get that. He is jealous that's I'm some sort of freakish perma-twink, lol... But it's not something he's outwardly terribly insecure about it. The closeted thing is the real problem for him, and he knows it, and I don't think he quite knows what to do about it yet... Anyway.


To get to the point, we really do need to sit down and talk about where we are. Because things have *really* changed in this last week since we started having sex. Everything's changed. I feel differently towards him, and towards relationships, and whether or not I'm ready for one right now. I feel differently towards sex in general than I did a week ago. It's a lot to process, honestly. But I am absolutely planning on just being honest and asking where we are at.

But just in general, I mean... The guy didn't have sex with anyone for over a year while he literally *waited* for me, and he even persisted through my half-hearted attempts to shove him away because I hated myself at the time and felt like a worthless headcase who would never be fit for any sort of relationship. Given how sincere his sexual feelings are for me as well as his emotional feelings, I think it might be more up to me as to whether I want to proceed? I don't know. Maybe I'm entirely wrong, and he'd turn out to balk at sudden official usage of the B-word.

 

[palbert]

Your awareness of the situation is impressive. Maybe you should go into counseling.

Best of luck.

 

[Seasoned]

Your head is squarely on your shoulders. You both have issues, just like the rest of us. The relationship seems balanced. Communicating about everything is the key to a healthy relationship. You seem to be on your way.

My husband and I have been together 31 years. Our relationship goes along well for long periods and then something creeps in. If its not addressed immediately, things get pretty tense. Over the years we've learned to try to stay on top of things. That is what I suggest for every couple.

 

[sekunder]

...Ooof. Thanks again for the positive comments and such, guys. This situation is just...it's not even complicated really, but it feels that way to me because I'm so emotionally inexperienced.

Part of this whole thing is that... You know, prior to the last 8 or 9 days, I was feeling so introverted and self-hating that not only was I not having sex, I wasn't really.. going out to meet people, or to do things, or put myself in new situations...

So for example, last night I was up late feeling annoyed at R for not being more communicative in general - while he was away for work after what had happened between us, while our relationship was (and still is) in such a nebulous state. I mean, neither of us have ever said the word "boyfriend" and I just don't have many friends, which is a bit said, but anyway.

So last night (or early this morning rather) I was up late, couldn't sleep. Around 1AM I get messaged on OKC (I am not really a grindr kinda guy, or haven't been) by this really cute boy - 21 years old, 6'2, skinny, a nerd/geek like me with issues, etc. We talk back and forth and he wants to meet sometime. Turns out he literally lives 3 blocks away from me (no joke) and he suggests meeting up right now. We talk some more - turns out he's actually in a committed relationship with this other guy, another hot one (hotter actually) who is 23 and who had messaged me/hit on me a couple times before on OKC. I should add I am 29, these two are in a committed relationship, list their age prefererence at stopping at 25... Well, I look young and I am fairly cute apparently so whatever.

I resisted a bit at first but he persisted a bit as well, which I think is good because I need a nudge sometime. I didn't plan on having sex with them or anything, I just wanted to meet and.. It was just crazy. The "old" me from the week before last (and thousands of weeks before that) would never leave at 2AM to meet a couple cute but strange guys. So anyway, we meet at a public area nearby where we could hang out a bit. They were both actually really friendly but I was so nervous in a way I was shaking, and I still wasn't sure. We had been planning on going back to their place, but I wound up practically having an anxiety attack, predictably. Which was embarrassing as hell because I literally had to stop and say I had to turn back, but we still wound up hanging out longer. And it was a really cool time, in a way, yknow? It was fun. I *never* do this sort of thing. I have no self confidence. And these cute kids in their early twenties were totally into me. And the cuter one was directly saying they both really liked me and wanted to, well, yeah.

God knows how I wound up in this situation, again... I guess I wanted to push myself a bit and I was feeling lonely and bored. I'd love to hang out with them again. I'd love to have sex with them. And that is an absolute possibility and a decision that is apparently entirely in my hands, as far as I can tell. And realizing that I have this... ability to do this is just almost overwhelming. Now all of a sudden I'm sexually feeling more interested in them than R in many respects. But I don't know. Maybe I'm deluding myself. But I'd have had sex with them, I think. Else I probably just would never have gone in the first place. To a certain degree I'm just realizing I have sexual power,expressing that. And that is ultimately... good... I just feel ambivalent because of the R thing. I'm not even sure I want to be exclusive with him. He's hot in his own way - which is a very big and masculine and hairy bear-ish way - and I like that. But I like twink-ish nerdy guys like myself, too. And one of these new guys is 6'2 and I reaaalllly like that....

Anyway, I'm sorry. I'm rambling. I'm feeling a bit... I don't know what to do with all this. Like now, tonight, R is getting back late after a 5 hour drive. He might be exhausted and not want to get together. He might want to get together ASAP and I am certainly rarin' to go after like 5 days. Or I could go hang out with these new kids. Which is really appealing in its own way, and I probably won't have go *all the way* with them if I go over tonight or anything.... but to be utterly and completely frank at the very moment they are more sexually attractive than R to me I think, and that does mean something, probably. But it doesn't mean everything. But does one preclude the other? R knows I'm really cute - cuter than him. He has never wanted to place any 'restrictions' on me and said he wants to me to get out there and such. Hell, he'd find me being with these guys hot.... though I have to think he would be jealous and that certainly gives me pause...

Christ, I am just rambling and over-using ellipses like crazy here guys, sorry. I'm just in a very confused place right now. Not a bad place really. Just a confused one.

 

[Seasoned]

With your sexual history and your long period of sexual abstinence, you might want to consider therapy to help sort things out. If you've had substance abuse issues in the past, you'll need to be careful with sex. It's probably too soon for you to be thinking of a monogamous relationship given your sexual reawakening. You have the right to seek out sexual exploration. My advice is to be careful given your history. Best wishes.

 

[sekunder]

Don't worry about that, I have a really great psychiatrist (used to treat at harvard med, really quite smart and very kind and compassionate). I see her an hour every week, which has been enormously helpful. It's also helpful having your psychiatrist as your therapist, because your medication tends to be far better managed.

But yeah, I mean... I don't know, too soon for a monogamous relationship? I'm not... Well, I'm not really sure of much at this point...

 

[sekunder]

Ohh boy. I really don't know what to do right now. Those other two guys I met turned out to be really cool - a lot more similar to me than the guy I'm saying, way more on my wavelength, they're like... part of my tribe, almost. If that makes sense. I really, really like both of them. It's an odd situation. I'm a bit confused.

 

[palbert]

In a sense you're very lucky to have three opportunities for growth. Just take it slow and easy. Things will sort themselves out.