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"Straight world person" in gay relationship... can it be done??

steve3339

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I hope it can:)

My situation is I was married and generally unhappy with women and have been with guys and enjoying more now.

Not ready to come out in any way...well maybe one close friend. Just wondering how others have gone on and any advice, I guess finding a very discreet bf might be a start.

Any advice or tips would be much appreciated!
 
Everyone of us who's ever been in the closet has been where you are now. Coming out of that closet is a journey, you will be coming out of it all your life, everyone is outing themselves to everyone else all their lives, it's part of how we as humans bond and build relationships with each other.

Your friends and family let you into their lives and in the normal course of things you let them into yours. This isn't a problem for straight people because it's ingrained into society for them, friends talk about relationships, dating is overt and accommodated, parents want to know when they are getting grand-kids, people put up pictures at work, weddings and anniversaries are public events, and all of it is how people out themselves to each other perpetually.

For you it isn't going to be that simple. There is no such thing as the "straight world," there is just the world, the distinction you're making is one we all made, at first hiding is safe and comfortable because we don't have to deal with all the negative emotions about ourselves that were put into our heads, we tell ourselves that the reason we're in the closet is external, haters can indeed be intimidating, but the reason we were all in there wasn't others, it's ourselves we're hiding from. We don't want to be all that negative crap we associated with "gay," because on some level we believed it.

And THAT is what the closet is, and why in the end it's isolating and lonely, and puts up walls between us and that life all straight people get automatically.

I think you're going to find that well balanced gay men aren't going to get into a relationship with you from that side of the closet door. First it's not fair to expect someone else to be your little secret, it stunts their lives as well if they can't admit you are part of their lives, and really you aren't capable of fully participating in a relationship until you're able to admit you're having it in the first place.

Work on yourself, you don't have to come out tomorrow, or next month, or even the year after, you will come out when you will, and the only way you're going to know you're ready is when you find yourself doing it. That is true for all of us.

In the meantime you can start thinking positively about being a gay man. It's hard at first to see anything but negatives associated with being gay, but that's just the haters talking. You are who you are and that's normal, and it's OK, and you should never have to hide in the dark.
 
yes great reply :-)

pretty much a mattrer of timing i guess what will will be

of imterest though is my friend from a bank..... when he did business enquries for customers a bit of digging around revealed some in relationships with other guys when they appeared to be living in a straight life lol
 
Again, as TX-Beau said, focus on yourself. Do not use anecdotes to distract from the main subject: you. If you're hiding, you're ashamed of being gay, at least a little bit and more likely, a lot. A happy existence cannot develop when you are in that place. Now, maybe it's not safe (literally) to come out where you live. That's different, then. You need to know you're not going to get beat up if you come out. But if that's not an issue, then all of the lies you've heard or been told (i.e., "all gays are sissies," "they want to have sex with children," "they're deviates," etc.), are all things you need to expunge from your subconscious, and that might require outside help. In fact, I'd suggest a group that deals with married men coming out (it's great to have support), or if there are none, see a gay therapist or at least gay-friendly. It has nothing to do with you coming out: it has to do with you becoming conscious of yourself as a gay man and LIKING yourself (that is, IF you see yourself as completely gay. You seem to be saying you're just enjoying guys more, but I didn't pick up you're admitting to yourself that you are gay) and that you are no less noble or complete a human being because of that. Until you reach that point (where you decide you're gay in contrast, to, say, Bi), there's work to be done. And, how old are you? It's harder if you've been stuffing down your emotions for 30 or 40 years under the weight of marriage, but not as hard if you're only 30 or so.
 
You will need to become comfortable with yourself and your orientation if you're anything like me. I left my ex wife after 14 years and my first order of business turned out to be confronting my internalized homophobia. Best wishes.
 
Re: "Straight world person" in gay relationship... can it be done??

Again, as TX-Beau said, focus on yourself. Do not use anecdotes to distract from the main subject: you. If you're hiding, you're ashamed of being gay, at least a little bit and more likely, a lot. A happy existence cannot develop when you are in that place. Now, maybe it's not safe (literally) to come out where you live. That's different, then. You need to know you're not going to get beat up if you come out. But if that's not an issue, then all of the lies you've heard or been told (i.e., "all gays are sissies," "they want to have sex with children," "they're deviates," etc.), are all things you need to expunge from your subconscious, and that might require outside help. In fact, I'd suggest a group that deals with married men coming out (it's great to have support), or if there are none, see a gay therapist or at least gay-friendly. It has nothing to do with you coming out: it has to do with you becoming conscious of yourself as a gay man and LIKING yourself (that is, IF you see yourself as completely gay. You seem to be saying you're just enjoying guys more, but I didn't pick up you're admitting to yourself that you are gay) and that you are no less noble or complete a human being because of that. Until you reach that point (where you decide you're gay in contrast, to, say, Bi), there's work to be done. And, how old are you? It's harder if you've been stuffing down your emotions for 30 or 40 years under the weight of marriage, but not as hard if you're only 30 or so.

Hi thanks

I am older now.... had a couple of man flings before I was married didnt think much to be honest...

After my divorce had a hook up with a guy who I quite liked and realised I could be sexually good with it:-)

I am Ok with myself, it is not a problem to be gay or otherwise for me.

- - - Updated - - -

You will need to become comfortable with yourself and your orientation if you're anything like me. I left my ex wife after 14 years and my first order of business turned out to be confronting my internalized homophobia. Best wishes.

Thanks bud
 
Seeing as how a month has passed, I don't know if this is relevant, but I will still quote myself narcissistcally, from a post I wrote on a blog I no longer maintain some years ago, because I think it's relevant (and yes, I had a boner for TX-Beau even then. Deal with it):

The Inglorious Comfort of the Closet - Thoughts on Coming Out



It is very difficult to write on this subject without being emotional, and also difficult to say anything new, so I feel like I need to put a few disclaimers up before I actually start this post. First of all, this is just a gathering of my thoughts, and I don't intend it to contain any particular pearl of wisdom. Not discovering America, just putting things in order for my own benefit. Second, I don't want anyone to feel judged (except for those of you that I'm actively judging, but I'll make sure to let you know specifically). It is a sensitive issue for all of us, and if there is any anger on my part, it's mostly directed at myself for waiting so long to come out, and the condition of being in the closet itself. And with that said...

What is the closet?
I frequent the "Coming Out, Relationships & Bisex Talk" section of Just Us Boys. I like giving advice, it makes me feel all helpful and stuff. But after a while, I began to see patterns in the topics that people post. Certain things invariably repeat themselves, as if it's a script someone else has written, and all those members keep following. All of them - symptoms of the closet. I will never forget that one topic - from a guy whose boyfriend was completely in the closet, complaining about how it put so much strain on the relationship - and more particularly, the answer it got from a member named TX-Beau, who I have a great deal of respect for:

Alright. While we all sympathize with someone who is in the closet, NO ONE has a right to it. It's simply this unfortunate place some of us who can't get past our fear find ourselves in. If we don't out people, it's because we know how hard it is to live that horrible life, and how hard it is to find your courage - not because closeted guys have a right to demand we respect their closet. There is nothing respectable about the closet, it's the big lie.

While legitimate reasons to stay in the closet DO exist - physical and financial security for example - most of what we tell ourselves in order to stay in the closet is bullshit. It is a trap our society creates, but it's a trap that our mind springs. It is that comfort zone which we are miserable in, but which protects us from the world - we are in control of our secret, and as long as we keep it, we are safe from the world's judgment.

When the truth is, there is nothing to judge
One of my favorite things to talk about in regards to the coming out process is internalized homophobia - that horrible mixture of fear and brainwashing that our environment has beshat upon us, which whispers to us, from the back of our own brains, that it is NOT ok to be gay, that it is shameful, emasculating, pathetic, wrong. Two out of three gay guys that I have met so far exhibit one form or another of this condition, and it is a very difficult thing to overcome, at least until you recognize it and stop caring what the heteronormative stereotypes are. Advertizing that you are "straight acting" is not a virtue, it is a glaring red flag that you are not comfortable with who you are. Anyone who thinks femme guys are to be laughed at obviously hasn't had sex with one. In the end, we all like d**k, and we have a chance to give the finger to heteronormative stereotypes of what is ok for a man to act like and do, and what isn't.

The lies we tell ourselves
In the time I've spent reading and writing in gay forums, a few symptomatic cliches stuck out from the mass of closeted paranoia:

My sexuality doesn't define me...
False. Your sexuality defines you through and through. Sure, it's not the only thing that defines you, and no doubt other things define you just as much. However, I claim that very few things, if anything really, defines you more than your sexuality. In my case, I spent the first 25 years of my life in self-deluding denial. It was a secret I didn't dare admit even to myself. Could anyone with any powers of reasoning even for a second think this hasn't defined the way my personality has developed? After I came out, it took me a few months to shed the last threads of secrecy, and then I burst that closet door wide open. Who I am today is an unbelievably different person from who I was barely two years ago, and that is again a direct result from the fact that I am gay.

...And it's nobody's business, so I am not going to flaunt it
It is everybody's business. There is no right and wrong here, it's just the way it is. I will quote TX again:

OK. First a note on sexuality. People are going to inquire, wonder, ask, look for explanations. They just are, because sexuality is an extremely public thing, and sharing that part of our lives with our friends and families is not only pervasive, it's expected. Your mother wants to know when she's getting grand-kids, your friends want to know who you're banging, it's everywhere you look, up front and out loud.

And it really is. A straight guy is never uneasy with talking about his sexuality. It is everybody's business and he is confident about it. And make no mistake - he is constantly, 24 hours a day, flaunting it. A man, coming out of a car and kissing his wife goodbye as he is taking their daughter to daycare, is flaunting his sexuality right in your face. And yet you think that your kissing your boyfriend goodbye on the street is somehow different, a thing to be kept private because it is "nobody's business"? Like I said - false.

I am waiting to find a boyfriend, and then I will come out
No, you will not. First of all, even though everyone comes out in their own time, when they are ready, it is not something that becomes easier with age. Quite the opposite actually, and it takes more and more extreme circumstances to force us out of the closet as we get older. Second, it is unbelievably harder to find a boyfriend while closeted, but I plan on writing a separate post about that. But most importantly, third - coming out is ALWAYS and ONLY about yourself. Even though we see those scenes in movies where a boy comes out to his parents, holding the hand of his boyfriend, in reality coming out is a little bit like dying. You are absolutely alone, regardless of whose support you have. There is always only one real reason to come out, and that is the realization that you can not live the lie anymore. It is about you, and you alone. Believing that someone else in your life will magically make it easier or make you more ready to face the world is being dishonest to yourself.

Not death, but rebirth
A life ends, and a new one begins. I am the living proof that it gets better, and I live every day of my life rejoicing in the choice to come out. I walk taller - my smile no longer fake - with a spring in my step and a song in my heart. The biggest secret about coming out is how little most people actually care, and the biggest challenge you have to overcome are your own fears and shame. Once you are ready to truly believe that if anyone thinks less of you, that's exclusively their problem and they can go fornicate themselves, you are ready to begin your real life. And really, there is so much more room to breathe out here...
 
A straight world person in a gay world... the concept is poetic... normality and utopism in one :)

I think it's possible but not quite simple. Despite there should be none, we need to consider the differences between the two worlds. My conviction is that it is a bit more difficult to recreate a traditional environment in the gay context.

Coming out is not always necessary or convenient, and in the case of a married man it's not only about himself: there is also the sensitivity and responsibility of not harming his family.

Fortunately, and I use a horrible term, people who are "out of loop" do exist. So your guess is right, the challenge is to find someone trustworthy.
 
I couldn't disagree more. Coming out is ALWAYS necessary, even if it's rarely "convenient", and you harm your family far more by lying to them in the long run.

Really not here for a lecture... just gathering information and advice as I help people with other issues
 
Well,
you can visit bathhouses. :lol:
There are a lot of married men with adult kids there.
 
steve3339 said:
"Straight world person" in gay relationship... can it be done??

It may be the wrong question.

There's only one world that we all- gay or straight or anything in between- live in.

What you may be asking about is whether someone can lead dual lives - one in the closet and the other out. The answer is yes, many have done it in the past and many will do it in the future.

The question of whether they can be happy or content or satisfied while leading a dual life... well, that's another question altogether.
 
My advice would be to confront your fears and overcome them.....and do it fast. They will just keep feeding crap into your consciousness if you let them....and make the process infinitely more difficult than it has to be....

My style when I am scared of something...I take a deep breath and jump in and let the chips fall where they may.,...

Why? Today..this minute,...is all you have. Tomorrow might not even be an option ....so being true to yourself today is everything....

I don't think you need to "come out" really...except to yourself....and I don't think you should hide it either. I only came out once...five minutes after it occurred to me I was gay and I announced it to my entire family at the breakfast table ....and I was done with it. Since then..I just introduce people to my boyfriend or in regular conversation mention it and I don't think about what they may or may not think about it ...and I let them do the math on their own. I gag thinking about having "coming out talks" with anyone..not because it scares me..but because it sounds to me like I am asking for approval or acceptance and I think everyone should be able to process things on their own...let them come to terms with it..or not..on their own. A couple times over the years I have had people want to "have a talk" about it..I declined. I am happy to be gay..I would choose it if it was a choice..so I am not going to indulge anyone's hand wringing.

You won't hear this a lot so I am throwing it in the mix in case it might be useful for you.
 
My advice would be to confront your fears and overcome them.....and do it fast. They will just keep feeding crap into your consciousness if you let them....and make the process infinitely more difficult than it has to be....

My style when I am scared of something...I take a deep breath and jump in and let the chips fall where they may.,...

Why? Today..this minute,...is all you have. Tomorrow might not even be an option ....so being true to yourself today is everything....

I don't think you need to "come out" really...except to yourself....and I don't think you should hide it either. I only came out once...five minutes after it occurred to me I was gay and I announced it to my entire family at the breakfast table ....and I was done with it. Since then..I just introduce people to my boyfriend or in regular conversation mention it and I don't think about what they may or may not think about it ...and I let them do the math on their own. I gag thinking about having "coming out talks" with anyone..not because it scares me..but because it sounds to me like I am asking for approval or acceptance and I think everyone should be able to process things on their own...let them come to terms with it..or not..on their own. A couple times over the years I have had people want to "have a talk" about it..I declined. I am happy to be gay..I would choose it if it was a choice..so I am not going to indulge anyone's hand wringing.

You won't hear this a lot so I am throwing it in the mix in case it might be useful for you.

Thanks

Just to state I am happy in myself.... if I wasnt would be doing something else.

Tend to be pretty honest with people about it, I think the crunch time for me would be if I fell for someone and they lived in a more out world, but there are lots of different layers to things in life.
 
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