Swiss people ban building of new minarets

[TX-Beau]

1-) I won't defend what happened in Iraq, the war in general. the Iraq war was a msitake, and I believe so not for the same reasons you do (as you believe christians and the USA are evil). One thing is for sure......YOU don't understand the Islamic mindset, and most likely the teachings from Islam that infects the Muslim mind.

2-) let me make my point a little more clear:
a - are there evil people that use christianity for an evil purpose? Yes.
b - is christianity the sole purpose for these people being evil? No.

Why do I believe "No" to "2-b"? Because if you understand the teachings directly from Jesus Christ you will see Jesus Christ does NOT teach violence as a way to solve issues. he just doesn't. if you see his life, he was not a violent man.

therefore, those that follow how he was will be as he was, non-violent. that said, what does that say of those who conduct themselves violently, not like their jesus?

That's the most tortured, convoluted non-logic I've ever seen.

I tried to count the assumptions, and bald assertions, but the obvious ones just spawn more and more.

 

[TX-Beau]

just what i suspected......

LOL...dont' stop there, JUST, when you have me right where you want me.

 

[SoulSearcher]

1-) I won't defend what happened in Iraq, the war in general. the Iraq war was a msitake, and I believe so not for the same reasons you do (as you believe christians and the USA are evil). One thing is for sure......YOU don't understand the Islamic mindset, and most likely the teachings from Islam that infects the Muslim mind.

2-) let me make my point a little more clear:
a - are there evil people that use christianity for an evil purpose? Yes.
b - is christianity the sole purpose for these people being evil? No.

Why do I believe "No" to "2-b"? Because if you understand the teachings directly from Jesus Christ you will see Jesus Christ does NOT teach violence as a way to solve issues. he just doesn't. if you see his life, he was not a violent man.

therefore, those that follow how he was will be as he was, non-violent. that said, what does that say of those who conduct themselves violently, not like their jesus?

Your reading of my post is exactly the opposite of what I am saying. I have never said that America or Christianity is evil. What I am saying is that one should not use blanket statements about very very diverse populations that happen to be from a particular religion, as is often done with Muslims, when we don't do that for Christianity. If Christianity and Christian teachings are superior than Islam, how come it doesn't and hasn't affected Christian conduct? Do I have to list all the atrocities, both recent and historical? But then you will tell me that they were not religiously motivated. Then I will say that it seems like Christians don't have problems with atrocities or massacres, what they have problems with is motivation and ends. If Christians are superior to Muslims, why don't I see the populace take over the white house to stop them from dropping bombs that have killed 500,000 people and made refugees of a 3rd of a nation who did nothing to us?

I'm very familiar with Islam and Christianity and Judaism, there is no such thing as "Muslim mindset" or "Christian mindset", people who want to push for such an idea are doing exactly what happened to Jews not too long ago with the "Jewish mindset". This needs to stop. Some people always need to find an "other" to hate. Maybe for once, look at your own deeds.

 

[Royal Heart]

You know, the more I read about all of this Christian and Muslim nonsense (violence, fear-mongering, hate-inciting), the more I look at China's religious policies and go, "Oh! Now I get it."

Don't get me wrong, what they're doing in Tibet is atrocious and there's no excuse for it, but when it comes to the policy of regulating religion in order to promote social harmony I can't help but think that's a pretty sweet idea.

Then no one can bitch about how their religious freedom is being impinged upon because they're no longer allowed to promote hate.

 

[jktoooo]

Your reading of my post is exactly the opposite of what I am saying. I have never said that America or Christianity is evil. What I am saying is that one should not use blanket statements about very very diverse populations that happen to be from a particular religion, as is often done with Muslims, when we don't do that for Christianity.

this "blanketing" is done ALL THE TIME by leftists about Christians.

If Christianity and Christian teachings are superior than Islam, how come it doesn't and hasn't affected Christian conduct?

first, who said Christianity or it's teachings are superior? I didn't.
Second, i would say the teachings have had an effect on christian conduct? and I say that because we don't see vast christian violence/terrorism on innnocents as we do see Muslim violence on vast innocent people.

Do I have to list all the atrocities, both recent and historical? But then you will tell me that they were not religiously motivated.

If a christian commits violence or killing or attrocity, he can claim that it is religiously motivated, but he cannot tie it to any of jesus' own conduct/teachings, therefore, the xtian who might have committed violence was taking teachings out of context.

With islam and Muslims, when a Muslim commits violence, killing or terrorist attack, he can say he was doing only as his prohpet Mo did, which is the truth. Muhammad was a violent man.

Then I will say that it seems like Christians don't have problems with atrocities or massacres, what they have problems with is motivation and ends.

a true christian is not going to advocate war or violence. if they do, they do not understand what jesus teachings are about. just look at jesus life, he was not violent in any form, fashion or manner. a good christian who thinks of themselves as a good christian will say they look to jesus as the way they want to be. ask any christian.

If Christians are superior to Muslims, why don't I see the populace take over the white house to stop them from dropping bombs that have killed 500,000 people and made refugees of a 3rd of a nation who did nothing to us?.

first, our nation is very wear of war, and obama is finding this out. second, these 500k you speak of, if this is in reference to iraq, you are mistaken. THE LARGE MAJority of killings in Iraq was the killing of MUSLIMS BY MUSLIMS. Our country, like the Israeli's are damned if they do, damned if they don't, that said, the civilians in iraq have not been the targets, even though the guy in your video said they were being taught that everyone is a target, which if that was said it is understandable to seeit that way as Muslims will USE ANY MEANS POSSIBLE TO KILL, EVEN USING LITTLE KIDS, RETARDED PEOPLE and INNOCENTS TO KILL OTHERS by packing bombs on these innocents and detonating them in the middle of a shopping center.

I'm very familiar with Islam and Christianity and Judaism, there is no such thing as "Muslim mindset" or "Christian mindset", people who want to push for such an idea are doing exactly what happened to Jews not too long ago with the "Jewish mindset". This needs to stop. Some people always need to find an "other" to hate. Maybe for once, look at your own deeds.

You are proving with your posts that you believe that their is a Christian mindset because it is obvious you point to christians as being the violent ones, following a violent ideology that allows chrsitians to invade and massacre and kill.

 

[SoulSearcher]

Second, i would say the teachings have had an effect on christian conduct? and I say that because we don't see vast christian violence/terrorism on innnocents as we do see Muslim violence on vast innocent people.

Then what was "Shock and Awe" about? What is Afghanistan all about? What was colonialism all about? Whatever happened to the natives of America? What happened in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

With islam and Muslims, when a Muslim commits violence, killing or terrorist attack, he can say he was doing only as his prohpet Mo did, which is the truth. Muhammad was a violent man.

If Muhammed was violent, then so were a majority of our prophets, especially those in the Torah. In fact, at least Muhammed forbade his followers from harming women, children, and the elderly, but the Torah (and I'm an Jew mind you, so don't throw the anti-Semite accusation), the Torah at times even sanctions wiping out entire populations. And any violence in the Quran is also restricted, instead of using verses out of context, why don't you point out to verses in the Quran that says one must not aggress first, but only in defense, and that if the enemy retreats and comes in peace, then not to attack? As I have said to your other posts, I think you have not much knowledge of religion nor history, and have an obsessive hatred for Islam and Muslims, so there is little reasoning I could do with you.

THE LARGE MAJority of killings in Iraq was the killing of MUSLIMS BY MUSLIMS. Our country, like the Israeli's are damned if they do, damned if they don't, that said, the civilians in iraq have not been the targets, even though the guy in your video said they were being taught that everyone is a target, which if that was said it is understandable to seeit that way as Muslims will USE ANY MEANS POSSIBLE TO KILL, EVEN USING LITTLE KIDS, RETARDED PEOPLE and INNOCENTS TO KILL OTHERS by packing bombs on these innocents and detonating them in the middle of a shopping center.

How can we know? The Christian occupiers, when asked if they know how many civilians are being killed, declared, "we don't do body counts". Why? Because they learned from Vietnam that the public would not support an adventure like Iraq if they really know how many civilians are dying. And even if the violence is within the context of a civil war, how and why did it start? How come the US decided to side with the Shiah, the most religious of all groups in Iraq? And how can we know how many civilians were killed by Americans, when there are more contractors in Iraq than soldiers, whom were outside of the Iraqi legal system until not too long ago? Erik Prince, Blackwater, the Christian Crusader, remember?

You are proving with your posts that you believe that their is a Christian mindset because it is obvious you point to christians as being the violent ones, following a violent ideology that allows chrsitians to invade and massacre and kill.

No, you're putting words in my mouth, all I'm saying is that Islamophobes have an irrational obsessive hatred for Muslims, like the Nazis did for Jews. Islamophobes use one stroke for all Muslims, but call Christian fundamentalists a fringe. It somehow makes sense in their worldviews to always have a group to hate.

 

[Deandbn]

Why would the Swiss send other Swiss who happen to be Muslim to Iran? That's like saying South African Catholics should send Orthodox Christian South Africans to Russia, it only makes sense to those who live in another planet, like you seem to do.

And where do you get your information from? Very few Muslim countries are governed by Shariah laws, and some that do, are greatly patronised by countries like the US.

And where did you learn that Myanmar was a Muslim country?

To answer your questions my boy are as follows:-

1.The swiss would not send other swiss to Iran, only moslems. Moslems are of a different reacial group to the swiss and coud be easily identified and separated by the colour of their eyes and skin ans hair.

2. Please remember that South Africa is not a catholic country, it is a christian country so the catholics would not have the right to send anyone anywhere.

3. I cannot remark on what americans do with moslems and sharia law, but i can remark that what the moslems did to your american twin towers was despicable. If they get half a chance of course.

4. I apologise for Myanmar, I see they are predominatly bhuddist, but also persecute christians so they are kinda in the same boat as the moslems anyway.

5. and seeing that you are jewish i suppose it would me most opportune to say that you would obviously be delighted if they decided to build hundreds of minarets in Israel and then kill all you jewish boys as they would like to and convert whats left to islam. Wouldnt that be a wonderful scenario.

6.Well in South Africa now, they build minarets everywhere they possibly can, and wail from them every night and morning. They are "beautiful" looking minarets with mass produced bright green plastic/fibreglass toppings and are being erected like wildfire in all the towns and villages. They are also actively trying to seduce the more ignorant itinerant population into conversion to islam - presumably so they can "grow" their"army".

7. In Places like Durbans beach front, they dont even bother having minarets anymore. They merely rent a flat/apartment/condo on one of the higher floors in buildings overlooking the beachfront, and wail/broadcast from there morning noon and night.

I might add that its real enjoyable to be able to hear sound of someone being throttled through megaphone loudspeakers morning noon and night from all sides.


Yes Soulsearcher, you should come over to africa sometime its a good place. You could be ostrasized for being white, and for being jewish. you couldnt get a job because they have what they call BEE (black economic empowerment) and you are the wrong colour. You also couldnt get yourself educated because of BEE and the wrong colour. Of course all of this happens under the auspices of our democratic constitution and government.

Did you know that they say that the SA constitution is better than the USA one because it allows for equal freedoms as well as marriage for gay people.

Why do you think that all the well to do jewish people have already left south africa for israel.

Oh! I forgot to ask why you are in Los Angeles, maybe its because the americans are giving you a free education. You know they do that for the moslems too, and they all learn to fly for some reason. Someone else said it was to enable them wreak havoc, but i didnt believe him. Them, no really, they wouldnt do such a thing would they, not to the infidels anyway. They love us to bits dont they, thats why they want to come live in our countries with us.

 

[SoulSearcher]

To answer your questions my boy are as follows:-

1.The swiss would not send other swiss to Iran, only moslems. Moslems are of a different reacial group to the swiss and coud be easily identified and separated by the colour of their eyes and skin ans hair.

2. Please remember that South Africa is not a catholic country, it is a christian country so the catholics would not have the right to send anyone anywhere.

3. I cannot remark on what americans do with moslems and sharia law, but i can remark that what the moslems did to your american twin towers was despicable. If they get half a chance of course.

4. I apologise for Myanmar, I see they are predominatly bhuddist, but also persecute christians so they are kinda in the same boat as the moslems anyway.

5. and seeing that you are jewish i suppose it would me most opportune to say that you would obviously be delighted if they decided to build hundreds of minarets in Israel and then kill all you jewish boys as they would like to and convert whats left to islam. Wouldnt that be a wonderful scenario.

6.Well in South Africa now, they build minarets everywhere they possibly can, and wail from them every night and morning. They are "beautiful" looking minarets with mass produced bright green plastic/fibreglass toppings and are being erected like wildfire in all the towns and villages. They are also actively trying to seduce the more ignorant itinerant population into conversion to islam - presumably so they can "grow" their"army".

7. In Places like Durbans beach front, they dont even bother having minarets anymore. They merely rent a flat/apartment/condo on one of the higher floors in buildings overlooking the beachfront, and wail/broadcast from there morning noon and night.

I might add that its real enjoyable to be able to hear sound of someone being throttled through megaphone loudspeakers morning noon and night from all sides.


Yes Soulsearcher, you should come over to africa sometime its a good place. You could be ostrasized for being white, and for being jewish. you couldnt get a job because they have what they call BEE (black economic empowerment) and you are the wrong colour. You also couldnt get yourself educated because of BEE and the wrong colour. Of course all of this happens under the auspices of our democratic constitution and government.

Did you know that they say that the SA constitution is better than the USA one because it allows for equal freedoms as well as marriage for gay people.

Why do you think that all the well to do jewish people have already left south africa for israel.

Oh! I forgot to ask why you are in Los Angeles, maybe its because the americans are giving you a free education. You know they do that for the moslems too, and they all learn to fly for some reason. Someone else said it was to enable them wreak havoc, but i didnt believe him. Them, no really, they wouldnt do such a thing would they, not to the infidels anyway. They love us to bits dont they, thats why they want to come live in our countries with us.

I don't know how South Africa's constitution is failing S. African whites, but one thing is certain, the education system certainly did fail you! You read like a very ignorant person with your constant, "the whites", "the blacks", "the Muslims", "the Jews", ever anyone told you that blanket statements are intellectually unacceptable and dishonest?

I don't know why Jews left South Africa, I guess it is because they feared that they will be persecuted after the Satanic Apartheid system ended, because unfortunately, our government in Israel had long made the mistake of supporting the evil Apartheid government, so I assume the local Jewish communities had reasons to fear for reprisals. BUT I must remind you also, that within the South African white community, Jews were at the forefront of fighting against Apartheid. Some of the most prominent non-Black anti-Apartheid activists were Jewish.

I came to the US for graduate school. And no, the US government is not paying for my education, what would make you assume that?

And no, I don't fear Islam or Muslims, despite our conflict with Palestinians. Knowing the very recent history where all Jews were put into one boat, and people constantly talked of "the Jews", I refuse to put Muslims in one boat. And someone who benefited from Apartheid is hardly someone I would like to have sympathies from anyways. Apartheid was based on ideologies similar to Nazism. So yeah, you're not getting any tears from me for losing your privileges.

 

[jktoooo]

Then what was "Shock and Awe" about? What is Afghanistan all about? What was colonialism all about? Whatever happened to the natives of America? What happened in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?.

OMG, leftists are soooo much work.......
okay, shock and awe: again the iraq war was a mistake, but it was not religiously motivated. did congress say (as we need congress to declare war) this is a religious war?
Afghanistan: a direct retaliation for 9/11 in which WE were attacked, remember?
or did you forget that almost 3000k americans lost their lives by two towers that fell in new york.
Colonialism: I am not well versed in this "colonialism" except I believe it has something to do with the conquering of the ottaman empire and the islamic world left in dissarray afterwards. If I am wrong correct me. the end result, however, was that Christianity did not significantly spread throughout the islamic world as evidenced by today's very low percentage of christians in the islamic world.
the Native americans (I am AMERICAN INDIAN, I HATE THAT TERM NATIVE AMERICAN): well there is not much excuse about how the US GOVERNMENT treated the indians, but there was no such direction of the treatment by one holy preist or pope within our US Govt, that was just the US Govt being itself, stupid.
Hirshima, Nagasaki: not religiously motivated, in fact we were DRAGGED into war by the idiot japanese who ATTACKED AMERICA FIRST. America WANTED NOTHING TO DO WITH WWII, but once we got dragged into it we sure put a stop to it.

If Muhammed was violent, then so were a majority of our prophets, especially those in the Torah. In fact, at least Muhammed forbade his followers from harming women, children, and the elderly,

you call giving Muslim men the legal edict to beat women not "Harming" them? LOL!

but the Torah (and I'm an Jew mind you, so don't throw the anti-Semite accusation), the Torah at times even sanctions wiping out entire populations.

let me make this simple for you:
if you commit a crime and I commit a crime, then the guy next door saw us commit those crimes, then he commits the same crime but points to us that"Hey they did it too" as their defense.....does that work? NO. and that's how you far leftists always argue when it comes to Christianity and islamic violence.

it's silly.

And any violence in the Quran is also restricted, instead of using verses out of context, why don't you point out to verses in the Quran that says one must not aggress first, but only in defense, and that if the enemy retreats and comes in peace, then not to attack?

Look, we need look only at how the "prophet" mo conducted himself. He fought in over 70 wars himself and of those only 3or 4 were DEFENSIVE, the rest were OFFENSIVE onsloughts to conquer and steal and loot the riches that he didn't have and spread the disgusting religion he invented. therefore, Islamic terrorists today conduct themselves as such: violent thugs.

As I have said to your other posts, I think you have not much knowledge of religion nor history, and have an obsessive hatred for Islam and Muslims, so there is little reasoning I could do with you.

and as I've said before your version of "hatred" is twisted for nothing I have said has been anything commanding hatred of any person or group (except that I hate the term "native american").

How can we know? The Christian occupiers,

yeah, those DAMNED christians, DAMN THE CHRISTIANS, They're all OCCUPIERS, ALL OF THEM, may they be damned to hell!!!!!!! MAY ALLAH CUT OFF THEIR HEADS AND SMITE THEM AT THEIR NECKS. LOL!

when asked if they know how many civilians are being killed, declared, "we don't do body counts". Why? Because they learned from Vietnam that the public would not support an adventure like Iraq if they really know how many civilians are dying. ,

the majority of Muslim deaths in iraq were because of Muslim on Muslim violence.

And even if the violence is within the context of a civil war, how and why did it start?

because shia's hate sunni's, sunni's hate shia's.

How come the US decided to side with the Shiah, the most religious of all groups in Iraq?

You're right, the US, OH SORRY, THE CHRISTIAN OCCUPIERS, should not have sided with ANY MUSLIMS. EVER.

And how can we know how many civilians were killed by Americans, when there are more contractors in Iraq than soldiers, whom were outside of the Iraqi legal system until not too long ago?

Okay michael moore, time to move on.

Erik Prince, Blackwater, the Christian Crusader, remember?

So, are you saying Erik Prince is the leader of the war mongering Christian world?

No, you're putting words in my mouth, all I'm saying is that Islamophobes have an irrational obsessive hatred for Muslims, like the Nazis did for Jews. .

sorry pal, I live by no such code that tells me to kill all muslims, slay them wherever I find them, etc etc. come to think of it, those kind of teachings sound just like the nazi's and of course Hitler admired islam and it's teachings ESPECIALLY ISLAMIC TEACHINGS of Jews which teaches Muslims to hate jews.
but I live by no such code.

I live by a code that we should understand the truth, and since YOU bring the jews into the picture, ISLAMIC TEACHINGS AND NAZI TEACHINGS OF JEWS ARE ALMOST ONE AND THE SAME, which again I live by no such teachings. In fact, prophet mo had 700 plus jews slaughtered back in his day in one battle, well, it wasn't a battle, the jews of qurayza were invaded by the Muslims and when they peacefully and unconditionally surrendered he still had them slaughtered. he was very proud of this accomplishment.

 

[SoulSearcher]

OMG, leftists are soooo much work.......
okay, shock and awe: again the iraq war was a mistake, but it was not religiously motivated. did congress say (as we need congress to declare war) this is a religious war?
Afghanistan: a direct retaliation for 9/11 in which WE were attacked, remember?
or did you forget that almost 3000k americans lost their lives by two towers that fell in new york.
Colonialism: I am not well versed in this "colonialism" except I believe it has something to do with the conquering of the ottaman empire and the islamic world left in dissarray afterwards. If I am wrong correct me. the end result, however, was that Christianity did not significantly spread throughout the islamic world as evidenced by today's very low percentage of christians in the islamic world.
the Native americans (I am AMERICAN INDIAN, I HATE THAT TERM NATIVE AMERICAN): well there is not much excuse about how the US GOVERNMENT treated the indians, but there was no such direction of the treatment by one holy preist or pope within our US Govt, that was just the US Govt being itself, stupid.
Hirshima, Nagasaki: not religiously motivated, in fact we were DRAGGED into war by the idiot japanese who ATTACKED AMERICA FIRST. America WANTED NOTHING TO DO WITH WWII, but once we got dragged into it we sure put a stop to it.





you call giving Muslim men the legal edict to beat women not "Harming" them? LOL!



let me make this simple for you:
if you commit a crime and I commit a crime, then the guy next door saw us commit those crimes, then he commits the same crime but points to us that"Hey they did it too" as their defense.....does that work? NO. and that's how you far leftists always argue when it comes to Christianity and islamic violence.

it's silly.



Look, we need look only at how the "prophet" mo conducted himself. He fought in over 70 wars himself and of those only 3or 4 were DEFENSIVE, the rest were OFFENSIVE onsloughts to conquer and steal and loot the riches that he didn't have and spread the disgusting religion he invented. therefore, Islamic terrorists today conduct themselves as such: violent thugs.




and as I've said before your version of "hatred" is twisted for nothing I have said has been anything commanding hatred of any person or group (except that I hate the term "native american").





yeah, those DAMNED christians, DAMN THE CHRISTIANS, They're all OCCUPIERS, ALL OF THEM, may they be damned to hell!!!!!!! MAY ALLAH CUT OFF THEIR HEADS AND SMITE THEM AT THEIR NECKS. LOL!




the majority of Muslim deaths in iraq were because of Muslim on Muslim violence.



because shia's hate sunni's, sunni's hate shia's.



You're right, the US, OH SORRY, THE CHRISTIAN OCCUPIERS, should not have sided with ANY MUSLIMS. EVER.



Okay michael moore, time to move on.




So, are you saying Erik Prince is the leader of the war mongering Christian world?




sorry pal, I live by no such code that tells me to kill all muslims, slay them wherever I find them, etc etc. come to think of it, those kind of teachings sound just like the nazi's and of course Hitler admired islam and it's teachings ESPECIALLY ISLAMIC TEACHINGS of Jews which teaches Muslims to hate jews.
but I live by no such code.

I live by a code that we should understand the truth, and since YOU bring the jews into the picture, ISLAMIC TEACHINGS AND NAZI TEACHINGS OF JEWS ARE ALMOST ONE AND THE SAME, which again I live by no such teachings. In fact, prophet mo had 700 plus jews slaughtered back in his day in one battle, well, it wasn't a battle, the jews of qurayza were invaded by the Muslims and when they peacefully and unconditionally surrendered he still had them slaughtered. he was very proud of this accomplishment.

Wow, the education system has certainly failed you, and I have nothing else to say to you, just go ahead and read what you just wrote above. Blanket statements after blanket statements without any context or references, just generalisations.

 

[jktoooo]

Wow, the education system has certainly failed you, and I have nothing else to say to you, just go ahead and read what you just wrote above. Blanket statements after blanket statements without any context or references, just generalisations.

wow, the nerve of some people to say what they say. lmao.

 

[Deandbn]

I don't know how South Africa's constitution is failing S. African whites, but one thing is certain, the education system certainly did fail you! You read like a very ignorant person with your constant, "the whites", "the blacks", "the Muslims", "the Jews", ever anyone told you that blanket statements are intellectually unacceptable and dishonest?

I don't know why Jews left South Africa, I guess it is because they feared that they will be persecuted after the Satanic Apartheid system ended, because unfortunately, our government in Israel had long made the mistake of supporting the evil Apartheid government, so I assume the local Jewish communities had reasons to fear for reprisals. BUT I must remind you also, that within the South African white community, Jews were at the forefront of fighting against Apartheid. Some of the most prominent non-Black anti-Apartheid activists were Jewish.

I came to the US for graduate school. And no, the US government is not paying for my education, what would make you assume that?

And no, I don't fear Islam or Muslims, despite our conflict with Palestinians. Knowing the very recent history where all Jews were put into one boat, and people constantly talked of "the Jews", I refuse to put Muslims in one boat. And someone who benefited from Apartheid is hardly someone I would like to have sympathies from anyways. Apartheid was based on ideologies similar to Nazism. So yeah, you're not getting any tears from me for losing your privileges.

Seeing that you have begun making personal attacks, It is not me who is ignorant, it is you. I did not mention any racial groups, you are presuming them based on your racist preconcieved ideas.

The 'Satanic' apartheid government dealt with your current 'Satanic' government. It is your satanic govenment that needs to move on as it were. I ams sure the jews were fighting apartheid before they ran with their tails between their legs to israel.

I would presume the jews left SA becuse they are 'good time charlies'

Apartheid was not based on nazism. It was based on nationalism just like your israel is. I also dont need your tears bud. as they say, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

You are such a sweet kid my darling, but far out of your experience and depth. I think you should go play in the shallow end, well till your balls drop anyway.

 

[Jack Springer]

It's great to know the Swiss people still have balls.

I thought Europe had turned into a limp-wristed, PC continent.

There is hope.

 

[SoulSearcher]

Seeing that you have begun making personal attacks, It is not me who is ignorant, it is you. I did not mention any racial groups, you are presuming them based on your racist preconcieved ideas.

The 'Satanic' apartheid government dealt with your current 'Satanic' government. It is your satanic govenment that needs to move on as it were. I ams sure the jews were fighting apartheid before they ran with their tails between their legs to israel.

I would presume the jews left SA becuse they are 'good time charlies'

Apartheid was not based on nazism. It was based on nationalism just like your israel is. I also dont need your tears bud. as they say, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

You are such a sweet kid my darling, but far out of your experience and depth. I think you should go play in the shallow end, well till your balls drop anyway.

Oh yes, Apartheid was just so wonderful and nationalistic, so sad the holiday is over....sorry they're all out of the Bantustans now.

 

[bankside]

There is a wonderful European tradition of asserting authority over religious excesses, and of putting religion in its place, and of containing it when necessary. Europeans have done just the same thing to Catholicism and other Christian sects over the years.

In that context, I welcome initiatives like this one in Switzerland, but in fact, I'm not convinced the Swiss were being subjected to any credible religious excesses by the Muslim community. Without substantiating their action, it looks more like a case of bullying a minority than standing up for common values of freedom and liberty.

 

[Zingerific]

I think the underlying issue here is a dilemma that liberalism finds itself in, namely, how does one tolerate the intolerant?

I think that, rightly or wrongly, it is perceived that Islam is fundamentally intolerant and, if it could, would use the machinery of government to curtail rights central to the traditions of liberal democracy: free speech, LBGT rights, and so on.

This undoubtedly conflates certain radicals with most Muslims. I think the Swiss action is foolish, and it's probably true that there is some racism, or at least xenophobia, on display here. But I think the issue is here to stay.

What I am saying is that one should not use blanket statements about very very diverse populations that happen to be from a particular religion, as is often done with Muslims, when we don't do that for Christianity.

I agree that one shouldn't make blanket statements, but I have to say that it's true that the left often makes blanket statements about Christianity and Christians.

 

[Kulindahr]

Originally Posted by Recep Tayyip Erdogan
The minarets are our bayonets.
The domes are our helmets.
The mosques are our barracks.
The faithful are our soldiers...................................................

That's something that people don't want to look at, because they want to pretend everyone is nice and we can all get along. But the point at which a civilization no longer has the will to shoot the barbarians at its doors is the point at which it is doomed.

I
Hence the minaret would be on top of the bowling alley, but never the mosque.

No, the minaret would be on top of the mosque, it's just that it would lean on it from off to the side and have a sag on one side before it rose to the peak, and you wouldn't be able to tell you were looking at a minaret or at a mosque, but would think it a bad 3D impressionist rendering of a fallen loaf of bread holding up a partly-peeled banana.

Ah, the point. Well, here goes: if a majority of Islamic college professors prefer to believe a silly story regarding creation rather than an accepted scientific account then it just indicates the general lack of intelligence and culture in the society as a whole. Such ignorance has definite detrimental ramifications when wedded to a literally deadly and nihilistic religious ideology. One thing more: where were all the “integrated” Swiss Muslims when Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini the “spiritual” leader of Iran put out a contract on the life of Salman Rushdie? Where were all the protests? Imagine the pope ordering a hit on a novelist? The Catholic world would have been rocked. The choice of what trumps what in the pseudo-liberal mind astounds and amazes.

Quite so.

If they wish us to believe they are peaceful, they should put themselves at risk for the same of peace.

 

[Kulindahr]

Plus the smug, knee jerk defenders of the tiny minded petit bourgeoisie in the west really love to forget or ignore, WHY the Muslims are so pissed off, I mean it's not as though crusades and Inquisition, invasion, colonial exploitations ever occurred anywhere. Oh no, the West doesn't have to UNDERSTAND the problems, we're allowed to feel smug and superior (and isn't that fun!!), nor do we expect ourselves to figure out why there are plenty of Islamic radicals, no, that wouldn't make any sense at all.

Just a note: the Crusades were efforts by Christians to take back lands taken from Christians by Muslims.

The problem is easy to understand: Islam is a religion that was founded by a terrorist, and has never ceased the use of terrorism through its history. What the West has done is merely aggravation to an existing disorder.

Plus it's lots more self-gratifying (read mentally masturbatory) to play emperor strutting around in his new clothes, peckker naked to the world, than it is to try and do something as stunningly radical as understanding the problems and their context before tossing out the bigotry and ignorance.

There's a difference between the problem and the cause celebre. What you're talking about is the latter: the latest excuse for many Muslims to take after their founder by taking up violence.

 

[Kulindahr]

With islam and Muslims, when a Muslim commits violence, killing or terrorist attack, he can say he was doing only as his prohpet Mo did, which is the truth. Muhammad was a violent man.

Spot on.

a true christian is not going to advocate war or violence. if they do, they do not understand what jesus teachings are about. just look at jesus life, he was not violent in any form, fashion or manner. a good christian who thinks of themselves as a good christian will say they look to jesus as the way they want to be. ask any christian.

Excuse me, but Jesus was violent once, showing that He was a libertarian: He chased invaders out of His Dad's place with a whip, throwing their things after them.

 

[Kulindahr]

How can we know? The Christian occupiers, when asked if they know how many civilians are being killed, declared, "we don't do body counts". Why? Because they learned from Vietnam that the public would not support an adventure like Iraq if they really know how many civilians are dying.

Right war, wrong lesson: they don't do body counts because they found in Vietnam that when you ask for body counts you get (1) inflated figures and (2) trigger-happy soldiers shooting anything that moves. In other words, they don't do body counts because it is militarily counter-productive.

BTW -- "Christian occupiers" -- are we back to the Crusades? I thought we were talking about the present.

The integration of ethnic groups with an islamic cultural and social background in western european society has failed.
....
Islamic culture does not bend, does not change and does not compromise....

The tolerance towards islam, promoted by the european political elite, is a one sided tolerance. This is what the Swiss voted against. And this is what the rest of western europe will vote against. The minarets are just a symbol.

True, true, and true.

I think the underlying issue here is a dilemma that liberalism finds itself in, namely, how does one tolerate the intolerant?

Excellently put.

Religious freedom can be offered only to those who believe in it. Doing otherwise is like offering your hand to a cannibal: soon enough he will take your arm, your leg, and eventually your heart.