The amazingly robust American economy

[Latimer]

The American economy is outperforming every other economy. Harris needs to emphasize this and do so repeatedly to counter Trump's lie that we are the laughingstock of the world. We are, in fact, the envy. Ontario, for example, would be one of the poorest American states, Quebec surpasses only Mississippi:

Ontario Would Be Fifth-Poorest, Quebec Second-Poorest, U.S. State | National Review

America’s much-discussed growth slowdown is very real, but the picture north of the border is even worse.

www.nationalreview.com

 

[Latimer]

Likewise this comparison: Mississippi has a higher average income than France:

It’s Great to Live in the American Economy | National Review

Let’s not talk ourselves into stagnation.

www.nationalreview.com

 

[Dominus]

I don't think it's necessary. I'm pretty sure Harris has it locked in. No way in hell Trump is gonna win again.

 

[LeicsDom]

The American economy is outperforming every other economy. Harris needs to emphasize this and do so repeatedly to counter Trump's lie that we are the laughingstock of the world. We are, in fact, the envy. Ontario, for example, would be one of the poorest American states, Quebec surpasses only Mississippi:

It's funny that. The UK boasts that it is the strongest economy
I guess that, like statistics, economic projections can say anything that you want

 

[USEDCAR]

I just love paying $100 for 3 bags of groceries!

This post should be in the current events and politics forum.

 

[peeonme]

Ask just about any American if they are better off now than they were 4, 8, 16 or even 20 years ago and you will get a resounding "no". The standard of living for most folks has dropped consistently over the years. At 16 in 1969 I could buy a 10 year old car with one weeks pay and pay .30 per gallon of gas to fill it up, try that today. In '68 Our house rent was 125. per month, that would be 1130. in todays dollars. A pack of those disgusting cigarettes was .35, today you're looking at 8.00.

We can play with stats. all day long but the worker knows when his underwear is way too tight.

 

[rareboy]

The American economy is outperforming every other economy. Harris needs to emphasize this and do so repeatedly to counter Trump's lie that we are the laughingstock of the world. We are, in fact, the envy. Ontario, for example, would be one of the poorest American states, Quebec surpasses only Mississippi:

Ontario Would Be Fifth-Poorest, Quebec Second-Poorest, U.S. State | National Review

America’s much-discussed growth slowdown is very real, but the picture north of the border is even worse.

www.nationalreview.com

The notion that we would have our GDP measured in USD or that we would want to 'join' the US is risible.



But there's no question that we hold and sustain a lot of constructive debt.

And that the American economy, which apparently manges to discount staggering deficits and debt, looks very good under the Biden/Harris administration!

 

[cityboy-stl]

Ask just about any American if they are better off now than they were 4, 8, 16 or even 20 years ago and you will get a resounding "no". The standard of living for most folks has dropped consistently over the years. At 16 in 1969 I could buy a 10 year old car with one weeks pay and pay .30 per gallon of gas to fill it up, try that today. In '68 Our house rent was 125. per month, that would be 1130. in todays dollars. A pack of those disgusting cigarettes was .35, today you're looking at 8.00.

We can play with stats. all day long but the worker knows when his underwear is way too tight.

The average median income in 1969 was $9,430. Playing with stats is omitting the necessary information to put those prices in proper context.
It would take a deflationary spiral and devastating depression to get prices back to 1969 level. No one wants that.....do they? Half the country would be unemployed.

 

[TX-Beau]

I just love paying $100 for 3 bags of groceries!

This post should be in the current events and politics forum.

Don't we all love price gouging corporations that pay little taxes that are enabled by the right.

 

[peeonme]

The average median income in 1969 was $9,430. Playing with stats is omitting the necessary information to put those prices in proper context.
It would take a deflationary spiral and devastating depression to get prices back to 1969 level. No one wants that.....do they? Half the country would be unemployed.

Throughout the '60's and most of the '70's incomes outpaced inflation.

Income in 1969 of Families and Persons in the United States

Presents information on the money income of families and persons in 1969 and are cross-classified by various social and economic characteristics.

www.census.gov

"The median income of all families in 1969 was about $9,400. This was about $800, or 9.3 percent, higher than the 1968 median income of about $8,600. However, the gain in real purchasing power between 1968 and 1969 amounted to 3.7 percent since consumer prices rose 5.4 percent over the same period."

With the advent of supply side economics coupled with the impact of outsourcing of jobs to China, India and other low wage places wages have not kept up with prices. Some items such as automobiles have well outpaced inflation due to technology along with government regulations pertaining to safety, fuel economy and emission standards.

So, it's not a matter of bringing prices down so much as it is a matter of wages keeping up with the price of things like housing, food, medical care, transportation and energy (not an exhaustive list, btw.)

 

[rareboy]

^ Of course, we know better than anyone about supply side economics.

The original NAFTA gutted industry in Canada as the jobs were shifted to the southern US and Mexico.

With that, we became primarily a resource dependent economy.

But our oil is dirty, Europe fished out our waters and all the easy mineral stripping was over by the 1970's.

So we have this vast country, rich in resources, with a very small population and relatively low domestic demand but very high premiums for living in a cold climate.

Our difference in GDP based on the metrics used in the very conservative National Review is hardly surprising.

Odd though, how we are still one of the top 10 world economies.

 

[Norri]

Throughout the '60's and most of the '70's incomes outpaced inflation.

However true that may be if you asked an average American in say 1978 how the economy had been for the last few yrs the answer would have been extremely negative and if you were there you know this is true. The economy today in good shape, especially if you compare it to the stagflation and unemployment of the 70’s, but people don’t seem to agree they complain that everything is awful and getting worse.

Personally I think the economy will be worse moving forward than it is today and nostalgia for this period will begin to appear, I mean if the economy of the 70s can produce nostalgia this one can too.

 

[rareboy]

I think there is a good case to be made though, that the robust American economy is favouring the billionaire class and the capitalists like me who reap the rewards on our investments, versus the millions who aren't paid a living wage and have to work 2 jobs to pay the bills.

Exploitation of the workers is a big part of a robust economy.

 

[Norri]

You should consider, as I do, that one reason those investments have done so well is income inequality. We have far more wealthy people than we did 50 yrs ago and those people take their excess money and invest it. Would you agree that if income were distributed more equally those investments might not have done so well?

I once took a look at the S&P from 1945-1975 and from 1975-2005 and the numbers were staggering. In the first instance the S&P went up something like 415% while in the second the number was around 1520%. I aware there are other factors but that’s a big difference.

 

[rareboy]

I have posted a few times this year about the wildly improbably gains our investments (very conservative) have made this year and mentioning that I am gravely concerned about what it means. But not all of our gains are related to the US economy being on fire because of investment in infrastructure, defense and finance.

I worry when the the rewards of a burning economy largely led b a rebound from the moribund Trump/COVID days aren't being spread across the entire working population.

 

[peeonme]

However true that may be if you asked an average American in say 1978 how the economy had been for the last few yrs the answer would have been extremely negative and if you were there you know this is true. The economy today in good shape, especially if you compare it to the stagflation and unemployment of the 70’s, but people don’t seem to agree they complain that everything is awful and getting worse.

Personally I think the economy will be worse moving forward than it is today and nostalgia for this period will begin to appear, I mean if the economy of the 70s can produce nostalgia this one can too.

For most people that never had a taste of the Great Depression the economy was never good enough. Most "boomers" were born into a life that was pretty easy compared to those that preceded them. A sense of entitlement seemed to prevail. Everyone thought that just by being born in America they should have a piece of the so-called American dream. So, if you were to ask the typical worker in the year(s) that you refer to you in all likelihood would have been told that life was unfair and they were short changed.

The post WW2 boom led to a period of prosperity that seemed to overshadow the memories of the prewar economy. Indeed if we look at human history the working man has always been there to make the rich richer. What we see today is probably a correction that is putting workers more in line with the role of workers in the past.

What we need to ask ourselves is how far we will allow it to go? Will child labor make a comeback? Big shock, in some parts of the world it never stopped. Also underage non-documented workers have been found working in places that the law explicitly prohibits them from working in.

I have to say that I am glad that I am now 72, I entered that work force full time in 1968 and found nothing but boundless opportunities in the 70's. Then, trickle down coupled with globalization came along. The pendulum swings both ways, I wonder how far it will swing in favor of the elite and wealthy before the workers revolt? The downfall of capitalism will be capitalism, sad.

 

[TX-Beau]

For most people that never had a taste of the Great Depression the economy was never good enough. Most "boomers" were born into a life that was pretty easy compared to those that preceded them. A sense of entitlement seemed to prevail. Everyone thought that just by being born in America they should have a piece of the so-called American dream. So, if you were to ask the typical worker in the year(s) that you refer to you in all likelihood would have been told that life was unfair and they were short changed.

The "American Dream" schtick exploded post WW2 not pre-war, and that doesn't sound very "American" at all. It's far more accurate to say that the American working class votes against their own interest because they think they're going to be rich, not vote against the rich because life is "unfair." There really is not a lot of complaining or grousing about how unfair things are even when there should be, and that is entirely due to the national mythology.

Unions, worker's rights, fair pay and benefits, all of these issues are non-issues in this country because workers are NOT fed up and are NOT voting for people by and large who prioritize any of this. In fact, in large swaths of the country being pro-union is an electoral liability.

 

[TX-Beau]

I have posted a few times this year about the wildly improbably gains our investments (very conservative) have made this year and mentioning that I am gravely concerned about what it means. But not all of our gains are related to the US economy being on fire because of investment in infrastructure, defense and finance.

I worry when the the rewards of a burning economy largely led b a rebound from the moribund Trump/COVID days aren't being spread across the entire working population.

I saw a video about the gains made in the market over the last 10 years and except for China, it's pretty surprising. how much money has been made.

 

[KaraBulut]

Today's new word: "skimp-flation".

First it was "shrink-flation" where companies were selling smaller portions for the same price as the pre-pandemic larger portion.

Now, they're putting cheaper ingredients into prepared foods but charging the same price.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/07/business/skimpflation-whole-food-ingredients/index.html

 

[rareboy]

It is how the coffee companies destroyed American coffee in the 50's and 60's...just kept using cheaper, inferior beans in greater and greater quantities until Americans didn't even know what real coffee tasted like.