the Bread Man

[me203]

And neither of their husbands ever darkened the door of an oven to my knowledge.

Not surprising. It would be more unusual, I'd guess, if they did anything with an oven. I know with my grandparents, at least, were of the generation where the wife generally did all the cooking.

Mother was a terrible baker and cook with few exceptions. She made good cabbage rolls once, or twice, and was just overwhelmed by having five kids and failed relationships, so cooking was just another chore for her, trying to keep abreast as a single mom.

My mother wasn't terrible, but I'd guess she didn't have much enthusiasm much of the time. It was something she did because it needed to be done. Although she got more interest later in life--it seemed like she was a bit more ambitious at times--and she did apparently like having people over for dinner at one point in her life.

sourdough as a sort of decompression. IMO, it is the best bread you can eat, and that developed flavor is truly the last thing I could wish for as I leave this world.

I have some interest in trying, but I've never gotten around to it. James Beard had some negative commentary that stuck--I think something about overrated, and difficult at home. Then, I haven't been terribly ambitious. Although I'm a bit more curious now, thanks to all the current bread talk, and it does occur to me that if I started baking regularly using an on-going sour dough starter instead of yeast would appeal to my cheap side.

 

[NotHardUp1]

I have some interest in trying, but I've never gotten around to it. James Beard had some negative commentary that stuck--I think something about overrated, and difficult at home. Then, I haven't been terribly ambitious. Although I'm a bit more curious now, thanks to all the current bread talk, and it does occur to me that if I started baking regularly using an on-going sour dough starter instead of yeast would appeal to my cheap side.

I have nothing against Beard, but they don't call it taste for nothing. One person can go orbital over pate while another cornbread. It's ok if he didn't love it. I absolutely feel that way about bagels. Unless they just came out of the oven and have a crust and hot, they are dismal dough balls to me and I cannot stand them. But I resent no other man for loving them cold. Let him eat what he likes.

I also expect his comment about home challenge may have been centered around the schedule and timing. One of the reasons bread baking fell off at home was that wives began working away from home, or became mobile and were not home all day. Miss a rising by an hour and you'll have an alcohol-putrid bread that has bad taste and texture.

Sourdough is a great hobby because it forced discipline, routine, and encourages variation and experimentation. My sourdough starter and recipe were atypical of the wonderful crusted loaves shown in this thread, and enjoyed by me when dining out. It made more of a dinner roll and was not truly sour. However, I've had the more traditional kind too and love it even more.

Sourdough starter can be used to make a wide range of breads, and they have various sourness or not. But it is always rewarding to know you've grown your own starter.

 

[me203]

Although lard is unhealthy in the diet, it's almost universally praised in pie dough, and is generally about the texture, not changing the taste really, when compared to vegetable shortening. If yours did, it is entirely possible it used rendered lard from cooking that is not the same as commercially rendered lard from a very specific source. The lard you buy at the market is pretty much tasteless unless it goes off (rank).

I have no idea what the circumstances were (it wasn't a pie crust I made), and it's been years since that incident. But I'd guess it was bought from a supermarket. So it might have jsut been an off sample. Or something else. Maybe the flour somehow picked up some off taste or something.

As I think of it, at one time I'd make those Jiffy cornbread mixes, and I think I recall noting those had lard, and I don't recall noting anything weird about the taste.

 

[me203]

I have nothing against Beard, but they don't call it taste for nothing. One person can go orbital over pate while another cornbread. It's ok if he didn't love it. I absolutely feel that way about bagels. Unless they just came out of the oven and have a crust and hot, they are dismal dough balls to me and I cannot stand them. But I resent no other man for loving them cold. Let him eat what he likes.

Yes, tastes vary. I was just probably heavily influenced for good and bad by Beard because Beard on Bread was my #1 bread resource during my most intensive baking period. It was the only all-bread book I recall using, and I only used a recipe here and there from general cookbooks.

 

[me203]

I do recall us trying some "sour dough" from a children's cookbook. It was probably when I was young--I'm pretty sure long before I did any baking. Although it wasn't a real sour dough from what I recall. It was just commercial yeast based starter. Although it was enough to intrigue me the idea of a starter that could be kept going forever.

 

[NotHardUp1]

I heard PBS refer to Jacques Pepin yesterday as "the father of cooking" and recoiled from the cringe.

The veneration of Child as the progenitor of TV cooking shows is justified, as it is about media and developing methodology to show cooking in a medium that is hostile to kitchens and timing, etc.

Although Pepin is a great chef, a great teacher, and wonderful person, there is no such thing as the "father of cooking," and certainly not anyone in modern times. It is just promotional hype, and I'm sure Pepin would never welcome such a specious title.

 

[me203]

There were some shows before Child's, although I think they might be lost (or mostly lost) in the sands of time. But there is no doubt that Child was hugely important historically. And it can perhaps be argued that her show was better at teaching than some shows since. I don't watch much on TV, but recent cooking shows I have seen seem like a mix of fantasy, and just "here's a recipe." Child--at least in The French Chef--seemed to do a better job of educating. (Useful for a clueless twit like me. ) I remember seeing her episode on onion soup, and a day or so later, I was inspired to make some--not quite her recipe, but I used some things I picked up from that episode.

 

[NotHardUp1]

The irony of Child's legacy is that she got a reputation initially for the terrifyingly complex French recipes in the book, even if explained well and faithfully. Most American housewives were just at the point of gaining some liberation from being enslaved cooks, so had no desire to become full-time chefs. However, they did want to have a guide book for pulling out the stops for entertaining or special dinners, so loved the book.

Her greatness on TV was that she indeed made the fundamentals of cooking transparent, and many who were clueless about it were encouraged by the introduction and the systematic approach she used. Also, due to the live broadcast, she was forced to be philosophic about failures and foibles, which every cook should adopt, as things just happen.

I've seen a wide array of cooking shows, and nothing compares to her series when she covered the dishes by genre, except for Martha Stewart's Cooking School. It is just as patient, thorough, and comprehensive, but modernized. And she finally learned to relax.

Pepin is great for his economy, speed, wisdom, insight, and expansive knowledge. He is truly a French chef made American and inspires all of us with his ease of effort and simple ingredients.

 

[rareboy]

Here's my biggest downfall - southern style biscuits.

As a kid I got used to having fresh made biscuits every weekend thanks to my mom. Unlike yeast bread, my mom called biscuits "quick bread". The taste and texture were wonderful and became even better after about an hour. Years later I realized that my moms biscuits got their taste and texture from lard - not vegetable shortening!

Biscuits are a favourite staple as is Soda bread in our house. And although I use butter for the bread and biscuits most of the time....I love to make them with bacon lard when we have enough on hand.

What type of flour did your mother use? I sometimes use a 50/50 mix of cake flour and AP.

 

[EddMarkStarr]

My mom used all-purpose flour for everything, excepts cakes. But she did something few people do today - my mom sifted the flour ontop of the other ingredients already in the mixing bowl. When making cornbread my mom also sifted the cornmeal in a 50/50 mix with all-purpose flour.

After all these years I've never seen a flour sifter since - do they even make sifters anymore?

Eighteen years ago there was a "food historian" on the PBS Newshour. This historian said that before the invention of vegetable shortening most cooks used unsalted butter to make pie crusts and biscuits. The only advantage of shortening is no water, unlike butter which has water as part of its structure.

I'm guessing that in Europe there's a type of butter that is super dense, with all the water removed, for fine pastry making?

 

[me203]

The post above now has me wondering how many people still use flour sifters. I don't honestly remember seeing them used, even when I was growing up, although I have a sense that my childhood home's kitchen might have had a flour sifter in it once. I know I came across a flour sifter in the house where my father owned years later, but I think it was something his second wife probably had had for years before they married. I doubt he ever used it, and I'm pretty sure he didn't keep it when he sold that house.

They do make flour sifters, though. Amazon lists a bunch. Including a battery operated sifter!

 

[NotHardUp1]

Many cooks still have sifters in our kitchens, but they are not needed often. Occasionally flour, or a cake mix, or even ingredients may have lumps in them, a product of settling, shipping, and humidity.

It is particularly a problem with baking powder and baking soda, as no one wants a bitter lump in a baked good, or a white spec in a finished good.

Additionally, almost all kitchens have a wire mesh strainer, or several, which are multi-taskers, to quote Alton Brown.

Finally, almost every baker has a need for powdered sugar both as an ingredient and a topping, and it is notorious for lumping, so must be sifted to insure it is lump free.

 

[rareboy]

My Nanna had a 1 cup sifter that would now be about 100 years old...and which is what I use to measure and sift flour for biscuits and other small batch baking.

And yes. We have a large sifter that is used for cakes.

For most recipes though, it is just as easy to whisk the dry ingredients together to mix them.

 

[SLOPPYSECONDS]

A young bread baker, after only one month online, has become a bit of an internet sensation.

Jon, and his partner Amanda, have converted a garage into a bakery where Jon shares his love for making bread, that nourishes.

sumthin a lot piles a governits world ova wanna learun ans a pops wot nose wot is they is
" no rush universe nose human apes a sloooooooooow ons obvious "

there go a bit of rain drop ins da emptys space ofs sumthang
$hit button$
notin ooh ans postee

!jump!
forgat sumthang

 

[EddMarkStarr]

Here's something you guys might find interesting.

In 1985 I worked for Burger King - a division of Pillsbury. During the time that BK was part of Pillsbury the french fries were cooked in beef tallow. My job was to open the 30lbs blocks of tallow and slowly add the new stuff to the fryers and quickly get the temperature back up to speed.

Beef tallow gave the french fries a rich, meaty flavor that complimented the burgers and rendered a crispy crust that customers loved. But 1985 was the last year BK used beef tallow because health concerns over saturated fat caused McDonald's to switch to vegetable oil and Pillsbury quickly ordered BK to switch as well. In no way would McDonald's get a healthier bragging point than Burger King.

But what few people knew back in 1985 is that Burger King used a vegetable/fish oil blend that was balanced to replace the meaty flavor of beef tallow!

All I remember were the complaints. The fries were flavorless and never developed a crispy crust - no one likes soggy french fries.

 

[rareboy]

Can you all smell the fresh bread?

Two loaves of buttermilk honey white bread just out of the oven.....


mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[me203]

^Only in my imagination, and even that is too tempting...

I don't think I ever baked anything like that. Too bad, because it sounds good. Unfortunately, I'm now pretty heavily committed to whole grains, and I'm definitely committed to avoiding dairy...

 

[EddMarkStarr]

Can you all smell the fresh bread?

Two loaves of buttermilk honey white bread just out of the oven.....


mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I just opened a window - all I smell is truck exhaust from Highway 99.