The gay community needs more negative role models

[looseliam]

He does have a point.

You don't see people seeking out cholera, polio, etc.

What he talks about at the end, would make a great condom commercial!

 

[Nonimus]

That's quite a piece there Mattie!

"An Industry of Disease"; "The Gift"; "The Bug" - This is probably one of the most moving pieces of documentary i've seen in a long time. I'd heard of cases where individuals specifically sought-out HIV, attending bare-back parties etc etc, but having the issue addressed in this manner makes it chillingly real.

Human's are creatures of fashion, once upon a time men and women dying of consumption or T.B. sat out on their porches in full view of passers by, because to have the disease was deemeed 'fashionable'.

Once again, human beings both amaze and disgust me.

 

[MidnightPrism]

Harvey should be required viewing. This piece especially here because AIDS seems to be the only topic we won't talk about here at JUB

 

[Zeremonie]

That is a great piece!!! He really does a great job of laying into drug company advertising. Thanks for passing that on to us.

 

[justsimon]

I love Harvey.

 

[Yves]

I see negative is a play on words. Very clever.

I have to agree this bug chasing stuff is creepy. Now are there heterosexuals that seek "the gift"?

Great question. The data available is very limited. The sources of information are news articles (NYTimes, SFChronicle, etc.) and social sciences/public health research articles. According to some of these sources the population at risk are basically homosexual men (drug use -Meth- is a co-factor). Heterosexuals are usually not involved in "gift parties".

Some researchers are studying the factors influencing self-destructive behaviors in gay men and how this subpopulation of gay men (gift givers and bug chasers) is different from the average gay guy. The "gift parties" are usually targeted to homosexual men. Meth use is prevalent. A couple of news articles have described the process in a few cases: Internet announcements via chat rooms or websites targeted to men who have sex with men.

 

[Yves]

Well I doubt the "gay" percentage is very high amongst all gay men.

But I do remember someone posting about how some dad wanted to give his whooooooooooole family "the gift" his son, his wife, how he gave it to a couple of male and female whores. How he got infected at "gift parties on purpose".

Now the whoel site was devoted to this and apparently it had bi men, straight men and gay men....it was rather scary but one wonders if it was true.

The "gay percentage" is low because proportionally not many men (gay or bi) are into "the gift". The men involved in bareback parties are not necessarily self-identified as "gay". Some of them describe themselves as "men who have sex with men" and that makes the problem more complicated. The (limited) data available shows that 100% heterosexual men are not usually involved in "gift parties". Same-sex behavior seems to be a factor.

 

[Croynan]

Harvey should be required viewing. This piece especially here because AIDS seems to be the only topic we won't talk about here at JUB

Outstanding Comment. I say that in conjunction with the fact that several postings regarding AIDS usually get so few comments. It make one think that people have their heads in the sand.

 

[Austin40acres]

I can't help but wonder how many people; gay, str8, or otherwise, will take the central message of Harvey Fierstein's message seriously.

It hasn't been discussed yet in this thread.

The central message is: Individual Responsibility.

Do what you want. Have fun. Let no one judge.

But, take responsibility for your actions. This isn't an anti-gay message. I'm not a right-wing whacko.

Re-play the message. It's not about gays wanting to get AIDS. It's not about the pharmaceutical companies making huge profits. Neither of those would even be possible without individual responsibility.

Stand up. Act out. But, stand up and act out for yourself, first. Then, you can make a contribution.

A4A

 

[Sausy]

While I agree with what Harvey Fierstein was saying in the broad context,his statements on the medications were a bit over the top.No doubt the success of the AIDS drug cocktails vary,and there are quite a number who experience serious side effects.But without them,there would be no hope for a longer better quality of life .Yes,drugs mean money for the drug companies,but that in itself isn't evil..all illnesses that can be controlled through drugs,even with some serious side effects being risked,well-it's worth it.

The whole notion of barebacking,actually wanting to catch this disease as a twisted badge of honor,thinking this a passage into the gay culture....what is the fucking matter with those people?The message of promoting responsibility,protecting yourself and your partner...if infected,not passing it on through others by being responsible...he is on strong moral ground here,and his message couldn't be more urgent and clear....the best AIDS strategy is avoiding acquiring it in the first place.Like he said,it is very difficult to catch,except by engaging in reckless and risky unprotected sexual behavior.We need the emphasis to be,I'm gay,and I am HIV -negative.I am healthy and respect my body and my life,and the same of others.

 

[Croynan]

Outstanding Thread. Thank You For Posting It.

The pdf file is excellent.

Well Done.

 

[CaptainJohn]

Wow. Very powerful speech. Everybody should see this.

 

[tbonez]

The central message is: Individual Responsibility.

(edit)

But, take responsibility for your actions. This isn't an anti-gay message. I'm not a right-wing whacko.

Re-play the message. It's not about gays wanting to get AIDS. It's not about the pharmaceutical companies making huge profits. Neither of those would even be possible without individual responsibility.

I'm glad I'm not the only one. I read the thread to this point before I watched the clip. Then when I saw that clip I was like ...WTF? "Gifting" (What a disgusting euphemism!) represents the smallest subculture within a subculture I'd bet. They may not yet have Aids but they are already "sick".

My take? HIV/Aids has been a reality since before I was born. Since I was in pampers everyone has had a pretty damn good idea how 99% of all infections take place. Let's be honest here, MOST infections are the result of high-risk behaviour...not 'accidents' or some freak 'medical mystery'.

"Personal responsibility" is not a popular buzz phrase in the gay community. People who take their sexual health seriously and don't do the casual sex thing are often labelled "prudes" or "closet cases" and turning down an invitation for a one-night stand is often regarded as a personal indictment and not a personal choice. Bugs the hell out of me.

It's relevant to rail against the religious right for the role they play in promoting homophobia but what about our responsibility for homophobia? The second explosion of HIV infections in the gay population is something that we can't blame on anyone else. Not the Pope, not Fred Phelps, not GW Bush. It's our own doing.

I think personal responsibility is the achilles heel of the gay 'community'. We want all the rights of full citizenship while many of us act like hedonistic frat boys at a life-long circuit party.

Just my opinion.

 

[dkonfrost]

very very interesting piece by Feirstein! Thanks for bringing that up here.

And i definitely agree with austin and tbonez for personal responsibility.

Actually, one of my close friends is in that category of "survivor"
he's 45 now, and when the AIDS crisis hit its peak, he lost 17 friends to HIV/AIDS. buried every single one of them. he never felt survivor's guilt, but rather he withdrew from social contact. but a year later, he came back and has been a great friend and mentor to me and to our friends. he has an active and healthy sex life, but he takes personal responsibility to ensure his safety and health.

i'm gonna pass this stuff over to my friends, they need to read this

 

[LukeatDuke]

I saw some other Harvey videos posted here so I did a search and found this thread. Does anybody know where I can see a video of this pdf? I like to listen to Harvey read his essays. Thanks.

 

[LukeatDuke]

Effortless, what does that mean? I'd really like to see this if anybody has access to it. I cannot find it on YouTube and the link above does not work. I've seen most of his readings on LOGO during In The Life, but not this one.