Trump 'rigged' vote claim may leave lasting damage

[Benvolio]

Canada took a lot of flack as well when our prime minister refused to bow to Bush and stayed out of the invasion. The fact that we opened our doors to the Americans who were forced to land here when all flights were halted was quickly forgotten by Bush. He wouldn't even allow Chrétien near Ground Zero.

But it's not really 'who' supported it. It's Hillary who is being held to blame even though, at the time, Trump supported the invasion as well. But Trump has convinced his supporters that Hillary is unfit to be president because she voted for the war. Her confession of having made a big mistake and her apology mean very little, as does Trump's original support.

I haven't heard Repubicans oppose Hillary because of her vote. It comes up when Dems want to use the war against Republicans. She is not in a position to use the war sgainst Republicans, since she voted for it. Other dems have used it against her as well. Her vote is not why Republicans think she is unfit.

 

[Benvolio]

Thank you---living in the shadow of the World Trade center ----it was a tough call----but she was our Senator and the country came together behind a moron like Bush---9 months after stealing the election----the email thing is a joke as the real conman criminal is trump who no one cares to investigate. And repubs never hated her until she ran for president----

Republicans have disliked Hillary since she designed a forn of socialized medicine--long before she ran for president. Remember her organization chart with hundreds of lines going every which way? Even then, William Safire called her a congenital liar.

 

[Kulindahr]

DAMN THE BITCH FOR REPRESENTING HER CONSTITUENTS!!!!!!!

...oh wait...

Please, let's hear you list and excoriate every politician who supported that. All the while insisting it was solely the fault of each and every one of them.

This is a bullshit claim, pushed by bullshit myopathy.

She didn't represent her constituents, she catered to their emotions.


Every politician who supported that" isn't under discussion.

And stop making shit up. There's a fallacy you're engaging in, and I can't remember the name.

 

[Kulindahr]

Republicans have disliked Hillary since she designed a forn of socialized medicine--long before she ran for president. Remember her organization chart with hundreds of lines going every which way? Even then, William Safire called her a congenital liar.

The "sniper fire" lie is a good example of what I think Hillary does: spins little scenarios that would make her look great, and then sometimes believes they actually happened.

Of course, given the thread's actual subject, Trump, he does that constantly.

 

[TX-Beau]

She didn't represent her constituents, she catered to their emotions.


Every politician who supported that" isn't under discussion.

And stop making shit up. There's a fallacy you're engaging in, and I can't remember the name.

It's called the call the bullshit fallacy. The fallacy being that she is somehow responsible personally for the war, and that she didn't represent the people she was elected to represent.

 

[Kulindahr]

It's called the call the bullshit fallacy. The fallacy being that she is somehow responsible personally for the war, and that she didn't represent the people she was elected to represent.

She is responsible personally -- if she isn't, then no one at all is responsible, it just happened.

Where does this notion that you have no responsibility for your vote come from? I guess if Trump gets elected, you'll be happy to excuse everyone voted for him, that no one is responsible?

 

[Kulindahr]

It's called the call the bullshit fallacy. The fallacy being that she is somehow responsible personally for the war, and that she didn't represent the people she was elected to represent.

No, the fallacy is that you attacked something no one said and dragged in things irrelevant to the topic.

It seems like you and benvolio think alike that way.

 

[TX-Beau]

No, the fallacy is that you attacked something no one said and dragged in things irrelevant to the topic.

It seems like you and benvolio think alike that way.

WHAAAAAA!!!!! Please. You jumped on that bandwagon and now you are trying to weasel out of it.

 

[gsdx]

Where does this notion that you have no responsibility for your vote come from?

That's not the point at all. They are laying the total blame on Clinton for the invasion, that she alone is responsible for it. She has already acknowledged her responsibility and has apologised for her mistake. They are also completely ignoring the fact that, at the time she voted, Mr. Trump also supported the invasion and would have voted for it had he had the ability to vote.

Clinton has said she was wrong. Trump and his supporters still hold her completely responsible.

Everybody who was sucked in by Bush's bullshit and voted for the invasion were responsible for it. It wasn't Clinton's fault. It didn't happen because of her. Meanwhile, the people holding her responsible have been (and are still being) sucked in by Trump's bullshit. Trump is their God, and he believes it and loves the idea of making a foursome out of the Trinity.

 

[Kabluey]

She is responsible personally -- if she isn't, then no one at all is responsible, it just happened.

Where does this notion that you have no responsibility for your vote come from? I guess if Trump gets elected, you'll be happy to excuse everyone voted for him, that no one is responsible?

She shares collective responsibility along with the majority of congress at the time.
However her vote if it went either way would be used against her.

It's a win-win for the GOP. Vote against and be called anti-American, vote for and be blamed solely (by people pretending to be Democrats) for Iraq when her vote made no effective difference either way.

 

[nsguy2]

Yeah, her vote didn't make any difference to the result. Then again, neither did Trump's opinion so I still don't get why it's even an issue to this campaign.

 

[TX-Beau]

Yeah, her vote didn't make any difference to the result. Then again, neither did Trump's opinion so I still don't get why it's even an issue to this campaign.

It's an issue because butt-hurt whiners who thought someone was going to put her in her place, tried to use this among various and sundry other silly irrelevancies to crucify her.

 

[Benvolio]

Yeah, her vote didn't make any difference to the result. Then again, neither did Trump's opinion so I still don't get why it's even an issue to this campaign.

It is only an issue if she attacks Republicans for the war.

 

[nsguy2]

It is only an issue if she attacks Republicans for the war.

Republicans were attacked for the that war during the primary by their own eventual nominee.

Personally, I think what's done is done and there are much larger issues.

 

[Kulindahr]

WHAAAAAA!!!!! Please. You jumped on that bandwagon and now you are trying to weasel out of it.

What??? You made shit up and tried to change the subject, and now you're trying to put it on me?

Grow up. This isn't second grade.

 

[Kulindahr]

That's not the point at all. They are laying the total blame on Clinton for the invasion, that she alone is responsible for it. She has already acknowledged her responsibility and has apologised for her mistake. They are also completely ignoring the fact that, at the time she voted, Mr. Trump also supported the invasion and would have voted for it had he had the ability to vote.

Clinton has said she was wrong. Trump and his supporters still hold her completely responsible.

Everybody who was sucked in by Bush's bullshit and voted for the invasion were responsible for it. It wasn't Clinton's fault. It didn't happen because of her. Meanwhile, the people holding her responsible have been (and are still being) sucked in by Trump's bullshit. Trump is their God, and he believes it and loves the idea of making a foursome out of the Trinity.

The only person I've heard assert that this is about Clinton being totally responsible is TX, and he made that up in order to try tp change the subject.

I know she apologized, but that's just words. Has she made any effort to undo the damage? To make up for the harm done to millions?

And yes, she's responsible. If her excuse is that she was "sucked in by Bush's bullshit", then she's admitting she isn't fit to be president.

 

[Kulindahr]

She shares collective responsibility along with the majority of congress at the time.
However her vote if it went either way would be used against her.

It's a win-win for the GOP. Vote against and be called anti-American, vote for and be blamed solely (by people pretending to be Democrats) for Iraq when her vote made no effective difference either way.

In other words, she didn't vote her conscience, or she was dumber than Bush and bought his BS, or she didn't really care what was rigt and went for her own benefit.

People in Congress aren't supposed to be there for their own benefit, they're supposed to be there for the benefit of the country. If she's such a chicken-shit she would vote a certain way -- especially when she knew it would mean hundreds of thousands of deaths! -- just because to vote the other way would "hurt her", she didn't belong in Congress in the first place.

People like Clinton and Trump are beginning to convince me that China has a better form of government -- at least they know how to put people in place who know what they're doing and act for the good of the country.

 

[opinterph]

No, the fallacy is that you attacked something no one said and dragged in things irrelevant to the topic.

Fallacy: Red Herring

Also Known as: Smoke Screen, Wild Goose Chase.

 

[opinterph]

Was it her vote that pushed the authorization over the required majority for passage?

every vote counts. that is the nature of democracy.

It is interesting that no one seems to focus on how the Iraq war was prosecuted – only the mechanics of its authorization.

… I still don't get why it's even an issue to this campaign.

Agree.

 

[Kulindahr]

Fallacy: Red Herring

Also Known as: Smoke Screen, Wild Goose Chase.

Thank you.

My brain isn't doing well at the moment; body temp seems determined to climb into three digits (F, or course), and I don't think the grey matter likes it, so it is making recall difficult.