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What do you consider "gay"?

^You might as well just post the amazon links to the books already and get it over with.

Oh, noes. Someone has an opinion based largely on accepted mainstream science conducted over the last two decades and not wishful thinking. Heresy!

When it comes to sexuality, Gay means nothing but that you're attracted to the same sex.

Sure, of course. That gay men I encounter are generally effeminate and the straight men I encounter are not is merely a big coincidence. Looking through the "It gets better" videos and generally seeing the same pattern is also a huge coincidence. That most gay men feel they didn't fit in with other boys as children is indicative of sexuality and not something more as well.

Stereotyping is for the stupid and ignorant.

The same could be said of your political correctness.
 
Being emotionally and physically attracted to members of the same sex.

andy12 : no, not all gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things. The gay men I am friends with like all the stereotypical masculine traits. Hunting, fishing, sports, cars, etc. I don't know any hairdressers or interior decorators.

It'd be great to know where they're hiding. A map with X's indicating their locations, for example. Is there an app for that?
 
nature does have the means to effeminate.a fully masculine human,at this level of development should have no effeminate voice,no feminine gestures and no feminine lesbian-like sexual arousal.
nature can break masculine traits,usually through a mixing of traits. if there were no opposite sex,there would be no heterosexuality and probably, no gay voice, and men with feminine mannerisms at all.

Very few blind men have feminine mannerisms,and the few of them that i have talked with,have confessed me of being sexually aroused by men,not by females.

society have invested great energy and resources in order to make us believe the illusion, that for example,a man doing oral sex to a woman,is more masculine than a man who prefers to do it to someone of his own sex; that he belongs to. In other words, according to society, in order for a man to be considered masculine, he must be willing to be "sensitive" , "passive" and "receptive",not to those whose body parts are the same as his,but amazingly, to those whose body parts he didn't grow with.

if a man has a cock in his ass he is effeminate, but if a woman does, she is feminine.Nature actually works in the opposite physical way,the way that we are programmed to believe, is the socially fabricated one,created by multitudes of philosophers,theologians and even psychologists throughout history.But this is a hoax.

for instance,if there is actually someone who is masculine and have to FAKE sexual belonging with a male,that would be a female.since she is the one who have to be willing to accept that there is no sexual belonging in that relationship.it is fake and it can even come across as "forced".when nature wants to invert you,it will usually give you a very high capacity of emotional attachments to the opposite sex's traits.There are homosexual men who have no emotions for feminine beauty or traits in any possible way, such as their gestures,voice,body,or their sexuality.in other words,they do not desire anything from the opposite sex,but only from their own one.

this is why you would never associate drinking vaginal excretion,or being receptive to pussy,clitoris,etc with being effeminate. Because society has created a very sophisticated system of misleading ideas,concepts, and definitions that has nothing to do with actual physical conditions.that's why, i jokingly tell my partner that he has "faith-based masculinity".

All this, is designed to mistake us,to manipulate us and to not allow people of the same sex feel any desire and emotions for what belongs to them but instead for that which the opposite sex was born with.

in that respect,we are lucky,that we have kept our sexual bond strong.this is a real masculinization, although society will never admit so,because the more masculine men willing to experience feminine sexuality as fully masculine, the better for its agenda,e.x. uncontrolled breeding,disparate "union" between unlike sexes,sexual arousal with sexually dimorphic body parts.etc
 
Because gay is effeminate. The research shows that gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things.
Research shows that all gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things? I'm pretty sure you just made that shit up. You'd be hard-pressed to find research that makes such a definitive statement about anything.

If gay was merely about who you want to sleep with (you could only tell in a bedroom), there wouldn't be any stereotypes about how gays act.

WTF? You know stereotypes can happen any time a group is "otherized", right? You know there are plenty of stereotypes that are completely fabricated, and nearly all of them break down upon scrutiny -- that's why they're stereotypes and not facts, right?

Goddamn, it's amazing how much wrong you managed to squeeze in a couple of sentences.
 
"Everybody is completely unique irrespective of ethnicity, sexuality, etc."

So how come we have magazines, newspapers, and cable channels dedicated to blacks or Latinos or gays?

Why are blacks or Jews or <fill in favorite ethnicity> more susceptible to some diseases than others?

Why do Asians or Italians or gays tend to prefer certain car models over others? Why are VWs consistently different from Hondas?

Please, let's dispense with the politically correct, feel-good pablum.

No, we're not all flamers just as we're not all sports-loving fans. But on average, clearly we are not the same as straight guys.

And those magazines and catalogues are marketed stereotypes... it would be silly for anyone to refute western society has become nothing more than gluttonous consumption...

Because gay is effeminate. The research shows that gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things. This obvious trait is not lost of the rest of population.

If gay was merely about who you want to sleep with (you could only tell in a bedroom), there wouldn't be any stereotypes about how gays act.

Still single, huh? Anyway, have you ever given a child a coloring book?


this easy one

gay is

It most certainly is... :=D:

OP


Now I have nothing against any kind of gay man, as I am one myself... but I feel ike the discrimination of gays in society continues by just labeling every one of us as "that kind of gay".

So once that label is applied to you, how do you react? Do you refute it?

As much energy that it takes to come to grips with the reality of being gay in this world, it would be nice to have a break every now and then, but the truth is that the misconceptions never stop... The only thing you can really do is continue being the person you want to be, and doing the things you want to do... Occasionally, if your nerves allow, you can clear the air for any non-thinking consumers you come across...


So what do I consider gay? Aside from the sex? I don't know. And that seems to be the problem.

The definitions and the labels issued out by the marketing campaigns of the corporations who aren't ashamed to take the money from our double income with no kids pockets are more than happy to tell us how to live our lives... And that would be to the tune of BUY MORE!!!

As individuals we are free to define ourselves accordingly and the associations and connections/ communities we build are of our own doing....

So Ghandi says, "Be the change you want to see."

I'd go ahead and say be the gay you already are...
 
So, no, we are not clones of each other in terms of preferences, but we generally share more similarities amongst each other than we do with straight guys. (See my blog entry)

So your friends are ignorant for lumping us all together as if we're clones. At the same time, I believe that gays who insist we are "just straight guys who love cock" are living with their head in the sand.

Good lord, do I agree with this!

I recently happened upon a website dedicated to the "art of manliness" or some shit. Now, this wasn't really a homophobic website, but it was predominantly peopled with heterosexual men, most of them married w/ children (more than a few were Christian and very sex-negative, IMO).

Now, I don't consider myself especially effeminate. I'm not one of those people whose gayness is apparent the minute he walks into the room. But after browsing a few threads on this website's forum, it became apparent to me that I have no idea how to relate to these guys at all. And I don't think I'd really want to, not because they aren't nice guys, but because we just don't have anything in common. My life is completely different from theirs. Completely.

On the other hand, even though I haven't set foot in a gay bar in years, if I walked into one tonight, I would feel totally comfortable and at home, even though I might not have everything in common with the guys there. I might not even know most of them, and a lot of them might get on my nerves, but I'd still feel like they were "family."
 
I suppose we can say "gay" just means being homosexual, and I'm fine with that. I certainly try my best to avoid using sterotypes in describing or identifying others and, in the case of gays, their non-sexual behavior.
However, on both a sexual and cultural level and considering the length to which the term is used, stereotypes or not, I think "gay" can can simply mean: challenging or rejecting traditional gender roles and/or behavior.
If you look at it that way: gay sex is "gay", androgyny is "gay", effeminate males are "gay", men liking girly pop music is "gay", etc. It doesn't have to mean all of those things, but they certainly do apply.
 
Research shows that all gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things? I'm pretty sure you just made that shit up. You'd be hard-pressed to find research that makes such a definitive statement about anything.

Not all, but overall. The unfortunate problem is that when I reference the claim as one should, I get yelled at for trying to sell a book, see a response below this.

The lack of intellectual curiosity is unfortunate. Basing opinions on wishful thinking is also unfortunate. But hey, it's easier to think that the world is 6000 years old and made just for us, Jesus love you, and gay men on average have no discernible effeminate traits.

And gay boys probably didn't feel they fit because those other boys they grew up with liked girls?

Except for the very small minor detail that most boys don't like girls. If anything, boys are quite homosocial (girls have cooties afterall). Pre-gay children (like the obvious ones on the Born that Way blog) are not drawn to other boys because they don't feel like other boys and in fact such boys are usually drawn towards girls at that age.

Can someone explain to me why the Born That Way blog isn't about straight boys? Can someone explain to me how a non-sexual five-year-old can know his sexual orientation, for example?

There's quite a bit cognitive dissonance required to hold the two politically correct positions that while effeminacy occurs so frequently (as evidenced by such discussions), gay men are in no way different from straight men, except for who they sleep with. Essentially I'm expected believe two contradictory positions. How do you do it?
 
There's quite a bit cognitive dissonance required to hold the two politically correct positions that while effeminacy occurs so frequently (as evidenced by such discussions), gay men are in no way different from straight men, except for who they sleep with. Essentially I'm expected believe two contradictory positions. How do you do it?

Wouldn't a better question be how do YOU do it? How do you want to have a relationship with a man and not be gay?
 
A person with the propensity to engage in sex with the same gender.
 
Wouldn't a better question be how do YOU do it? How do you want to have a relationship with a man and not be gay?

If what I see and what the research shows are true, the defining characteristic of gay is effeminacy. I don't like effeminacy whether a dick or vagina is attached and as such it's not just a sexual thing either with me.

The problem is that as this thread shows, people define gay as sexual behavior. But then why have blogs dedicated to showcasing pre-gay children? If gay is just sexuality, how the hell could you tell who the pre-gay kids are before their sexuality develops?

If gay is merely sexual, then children's non-sexual behavior should not correlate with future sexuality, which it does anecdotally (no shortage of gay men who'll tell you they felt gay well before puberty) and through more rigorous methods as well (see the book I'm apparently obligated to sell).

So where does that leave others like me? We don't have the fundamental aspect of gay (effeminacy) but only the superficial (two dicks). I think the problem is that the word "homosexual" was invented in a Christian culture which lumps everything that involves two penises as the same... evil sin.

As such, I would think that there could be different ways to be "homosexual" and the only thing we (as in gay and others like me) may have in common is only the shared label, invented by our enemies to demonize our superficially similar behavior, one that does not have a common origin though, ie. homosexuality could be like a homonym that's in reality different concepts.
 
^Glory holes are pretty awesome for that.

Could the refusal of some men to label themselves as gay who do engage in same-sex behavior be due to the fact that they fear that they'd be perceived as effeminate when they are not?

I think we should separate cultural misogyny (which also targets effeminate gays with masculine expectations) from the perfectly natural right of masculine men to be masculine. Just as it's insulting for women to be told they have nice facial hair, it's taken as an insult for masculine men to be called feminine.

If men (gay or not) have a right to be who they are and be effeminate, certainly others have a right to be not effeminate and be masculine. People should be free to be who they are (effeminate, masculine, whatever) but the term "gay" does not encapsulate masculinity.
 
:rolleyes:^^^He brings the same rhethoric to every thread he enters. I would respond with an intelligent thought, but I know it would be wasted effort.
 
Andy, I respectfully disagree.

I am gay and I am masculine. The guys I hook up with are masculine.
 
Andy, I respectfully disagree.

I am gay and I am masculine. The guys I hook up with are masculine.

What is masculine to you? How do you distinguish it from feminine?

Do you have relationships with men you consider feminine?

Looking back, when did you suspect you were gay and why?
 
Apparently Christina Aguilera is considered a gay icon (even before she made 'Burlesque') but I can't really see it. I've never thought of her as a gay icon.
 
Because gay is effeminate. The research shows that gay men are shifted toward the feminine side of things. This obvious trait is not lost of the rest of population.

If gay was merely about who you want to sleep with (you could only tell in a bedroom), there wouldn't be any stereotypes about how gays act.

Gay does not equate with effeminate and any "research" that concludes gays are generally more feminine than masculine is simply not credible.
 
Society's push on gay men to act effeminate is just as strong as the push on black people to act ghetto. If a black peson doesn't act the part they get called "acting white" or "oreo".

I see it the same with in the gay community sometimes.
 
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