What was gay rights like in the "early days"?

[BostonPirate]

It's actually classified under "Sexual Disorder NOS" in the DSM-IV.

JUB has a great forum for help with dealing with those issues..

karaBullut is the moderator there and is VERY wise. It may be in your best interest to use that as a means of finding other people that are uncomfortable with being gay who are going through some coming out issues of their own.


http://www.justusboys.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=70

 

[MoltenRock III]

It's actually classified under "Sexual Disorder NOS" in the DSM-IV.

Sexual Disorder Not Otherwise Specified - NOS

Many sexual disorders are not classifiable as sexual dysfunctions or paraphilias. These disorders are placed in this residual category.

DSM-IV Code - 302.9

Facts and Tips about Sexual Disorder NOS

Sexual Disorder Not Otherwise Specified is related with impulse control and mental sickness.
This disorder is also called as DSM-IV manual on emotional and psychological problems.
Obsessive shopping, habitual to sexual activities and internet are the symptoms of the sexual disorder NOS.
Psychotherapy is must to control sexual disorder NOS.
Get proper knowledge about sexual patterns or activities.
There is need to enhance the socialization and promote fit appreciation.

http://allpsych.com/disorders/disorders_dsmIVcodes.html

 

[chrisrobin]

my right nut is a better president than Dubya

Damning your right nut with faint praise!

 

[BostonPirate]

Damning your right nut with faint praise!

Well the left one is the low hanging slap happy wonder that I enjoy and I wanted to keep him out of it.

 

[MoltenRock III]

my right nut is a better president than Dubya

Would that have then made your left nut, First Nut? First Testicle? How many staffers come with the First office anyway?

I'm also assuming your nut was the one who came up with the TSA groping policy? LOL

 

[Kulindahr]

http://www.somanymen.com/PtownNudeBeach/

Looks like there's a legal situation there. Odd that Oregon's freedom of expression laws are better than Massachussetts.

And the National Park Service should butt out -- if the locals say it's okay, that's the final word, on two counts: first, because it's supposed to be the government of, by, and for the people, not bureaucracies; second, because that law which grants greater liberty must prevail.

 

[Kulindahr]

I know about the Stonewall Riots, but I don't really get it.

From what I understand, it was a bunch of gay men & drag queens who were getting really drunk inside the bar, and a lot of the guys were having unsafe sex with each other. Finally, the police came, rightfully so, to say "Hey......we're concerned about people having sex in public places. Can you please stop, or get a room?"

But the gay men & drag queens couldn't have any of that, so they physically beat up the police officers, and started celebrating in drunk revelry.

And that's why we have Gay Pride. Because apparently, it's okay to be promiscuous, have sex in public, and beat up police officers

Where on God's green earth did THAT perversion of history come from?

Well, you're right; you don't get it.

First. I seriously doubt if there was much if any public sex going on at the Stonewall. That wasn't the issue. The issue was same-sex dancing, which was illegal in New York City at that time. The bars used to have a system like a telephone tree to alert the other bars of police sweeps. So a few minutes before the cops got there, they'd flash the lights to give people time to change partners or get off the dance floor.

Another problem was that drag was discouraged by law. Drag queens had to be able to show the cops three articles of men's clothing that they were wearing in order to not be arrested. The charge for the arrest would be "masquerading," which was illegal. This was true in Fort Worth until well into the 1980s.

And by the way, there was no such thing as "unsafe sex" in the 1960s and 70s--quite literally, there was no such thing. The very idea of "unsafe sex" was a response to AIDS in the mid-1980s.

I'm also sure that "getting really drunk" was no more a problem at the Stonewall than it was at any bar in Manhattan--or anywhere else. The police were not raiding gay bars because people were getting drunk. They were raiding them because they catered to homosexuals, which was also illegal.

Now when a raid occurred, the cops didn't make any distinction about who to arrest. They'd pull up with a couple of paddywagons, and if there were any violations at all, everybody in the bar was hauled off to the police station.

That is why the rebellion occurred. I hope I have cleared up a few things for you.

Thank you -- my response wouldn't have been anywhere near as polite.

 

[Kulindahr]

As an aside, I'm also interested in the experiences of gay men of color (Black, Latino, Asian, Asian Indian, Native American, immigrants, etc).

From my own experience right now, I know that the process and pain of coming out is certainly not easy.

While it's nice to hear from older white guys, the reality is that for people who come from immigrant families or cultures that are extremely traditional -- we have unique challenges of our own.

Are there any older JUB'ers of color (Black, Latino, Asian, Asian Indian, Native American, etc) who can share their experiences of coming out & the issue of 'gay rights' in your time?

Thank you.

Read my blog here and then let's talk about coming out as "certainly not easy".

 

[JayQueer]

I don't. My only frustration is regarding negative reactions to my sexual orientation and femininity but not about the sexual orientation itself. Jay, on the other hand, is effeminophobic and possibly homophobic. Anyone who posts that feminine men make him feel queasy shouldn't be allowed to post here.

Travis,

That's awfully mean of you to suggest that I shouldn't be allowed on JUB.

Feminine men do make me feel queasy and uncomfortable. That's an issue I have to work on -- and it will take me time. Everyone has their own pace.

I think that the reason why feminine men make me queasy is because they are so "obviously gay." Masculine gays tend to blend well, or camouflage better with straight people. Feminine gays tend to "stick out" more. Nobody typically goes up to a queeny, lispy, "flaming" gay guy and asks him, "So, do you have a wife or girlfriend?" Most people know, without even asking a feminine gay man, that he's most likely gay.

It's a survival instinct to "blend in" or camouflage in with your surroundings to avoid your "predators." Other animals do this all the time. Animals who tend to stick out with bright colors or wild behaviors, tend to get preyed on & eaten.

Using this same analogy, masculine gays would be the animals in the species that are able to "blend in" with all of the straight people and avoid most of the brunt of the "predators" -- who would be the anti-gay people, and closed-minded people who might attack, injure, or even kill a gay person.

The feminine gays don't "blend in" as well as the masculine gays do with straight people, and are more likely to be verbally harassed, and attacked, or even killed.

I'm afraid of being "gay bashed" or injured, or killed..........and my survival instinct has been, up until now, to actively avoid associating with feminine gays.........because I don't want to be verbally harassed, attacked, or killed.

*P.S. When I say "masculine gays" and "feminine gays", I'm talking about men. It's obviously the opposite situation for lesbians.

 

[JayQueer]

I'm so sorry, Travis. I know I'm such a failure & disappointment to everyone.

 

[construct]

Jay, it's not mean because you are constantly degrading men who are feminine. In the past week or so, you've made a lot of insulting remarks. A moderator even closed one of your threads.

Oh, come on, Travis. I understand that you're sensitive about this, and JQ is pretty blunt in his demeaning of "feminine" men, but he's demeaned almost every kind of man I can think of. He even described the few straight, married, conservative, well-groomed, white, Republican men he hooked up with as "random, sleazy guys"!

It'd be easy to say he's a troll, but this one is a strange and exotic sort of porno-troll. I've never seen anyone like him before in my life. He reminds me of a battered woman, always coming back for more abuse wherever she can find it and provoking it even when it's already there waiting for her. It's the most gosh-durned thing I've ever seen.

 

[Kulindahr]

I'm so sorry, Travis. I know I'm such a failure & disappointment to everyone.

In some ways, perhaps.

But don't be so certain it's universal.

 

[JayQueer]

[Quoted post: Removed by Moderator]

My 'mother land' is the United States of America. I was born here, and the USA is my home.

[Quoted post: Removed by Moderator]

That's rather racist & insulting to Indians & Hindus. The Ganga River (especially by Varanasi), is considered to be sacred in the Hindu religion.

By Travis' standards, you are Indianophobic and Hinduphobic.

 

[JayQueer]

It's kind of ironic that people get up in arms about feminine guys, but if someone wants to dump me in a "filthy" river in India........nobody says anything.

 

[construct]

It's kind of ironic that people get up in arms about feminine guys, but if someone wants to dump me in a "filthy" river in India........nobody says anything.

It's prob'ly 'cause they're afraid they'd get if trouble for agreeing with him.

 

[BostonPirate]

Jay seem sto be a pretty manipulative little man, if you ask me

He went on ignore

can we all get drunk now? well let me rep[hrase

I am now driunk. who would like to join me/?

 

[JayQueer]

Jay, I've been sympathetic to you and have attempted to understand and help but you don't make it easy. Nevertheless, I do hope that you find a way to resolve your self-hatred and improve your confidence.

Thank you, Travis. I wish you the best.

 

[Kulindahr]

It's kind of ironic that people get up in arms about feminine guys, but if someone wants to dump me in a "filthy" river in India........nobody says anything.

I think the post didn't exist long enough for many to see it. I just got it, via e-mail notification. My response was going to be:

Trying to out-bigot Bachman? You're off to a good start -- but you could use lessons from Palin.

 

[cocksucker4use]

It was...

The late seventies saw the sexual revolution, and it looked like things were going to start changing then.

AIDS gave the Conservatives a reason to vilify the gay community.

This, of course, forced us to organize in ways we hadn't before. All of the gay legal orgs were first begun at that point to defend HIV patients, and insure their housing rights.

Hmmm. I have wondered about the role of HIV/AIDS and the advancement of Gay visibility, if not Gay Rights per se. So, as gay men became sick, and many died, they were outed at the same time. America became aware that their sons, brothers, husbands, fathers, doctors, priests, lawyers, mechanics....they were gay. I think the visibility and recognition of many Americans that they knew and loved gay people was game changing.

 

[construct]

Hmmm. I have wondered about the role of HIV/AIDS and the advancement of Gay visibility, if not Gay Rights per se. So, as gay men became sick, and many died, they were outed at the same time. America became aware that their sons, brothers, husbands, fathers, doctors, priests, lawyers, mechanics....they were gay. I think the visibility and recognition of many Americans that they knew and loved gay people was game changing.

You're right. It was. And at what cost!

Here you have men who had intentionally put distance between themselves and their families so that their families wouldn't know that they were openly gay to everybody else. And now these men I diagnosed with a disease and usually would die within 12-18 months, much of that time unable to take care of themselves and dependent on companions or friends or having to go back home to their parents who are now hit with a double-whammy: Their son is gay, and he's going to die a slow, terrible death. And more than a few of those parents couldn't get past the first revelation to deal with the second one in any way that you'd expect a parent should.

And then you have the men whose families wouldn't speak to them when they were alive now swooping in like vultures. to plunder a surviving partner when he's most vulnerable. More than a few men lost more than their housing along with their lovers all in a matter of a few days.

And those of us who were not infected, 25 or 30 or 40 years old, were reading the obituaries every day like 70-year-olds to find out who had died. We were going to funerals the way straight people our age went to weddings. Those who did not live through it cannot imagine what it was like.

AIDS in the 1980s and early 90s was so awful! If you weren't there, you could not possibly imagine. No matter how much you think you are imagining it, it was worse.