checkinthingsout
Slut
So I am finally asking for some opinions/advice! Bear with me this is a LONG post:
I moved to the NYC area recently and met a guy online. We went on a date and had a pretty good connection, so I decided I wanted to pursue it and see where it goes. The only problem at this point was that we both liked being tops from a sexual perspective, however, I really liked the guy and we both wanted to see what might come of it. We are both black (he says he is black but he is really half black and half white, although I never brought it up), but one thing he did point out is that I seem to come from a middle class/upper middle class background by the way I carry myself (talking, gestures, diction, experiences, etc) at my current age (25), where as he grew up poorer and with a considerably less stable/comfortable childhood than I had. He referred to me as an "All American" and "Ivy League Frat boy" Gay, or something like that. I took it jokingly. He is also 37. I didn't really think too much about it, but just that it is normal 1st date material.
Date 2:
I met him again the next weekend and we went for pizza, then I went back to his place and had sex, where I bottomed for the first time. Because I hadn't tried it before, I told him I wanted to try with him because I liked him, and he was more than eager to be my first. It was DEFINITELY an awkward encounter because it hurt for me, but we were both into it and both came. Afterwards, we watched a movie together and talked, and generally had a good day.
Date 3:
Since the second date, I had actually been planning to try anal sex again with him to understand if I could grow to like it. We planned to get dinner at this place, where he asked me if I ever wanted kids. I replied yes, and returned the question. He replied that he did not, because he hated kids/too much responsibility. He also went a step further to say that a lot of his gay friends and gay men he knows think that it is their attempt to try and be "normal" and live the american dream, citing how some gay people he knew wanted the perfect kid and would be difficult to deal with the fact that they may not get the kid they expect in the end.
I replied, saying that isn't that what every parent, gay or straight, goes through who actually wants to have a kid? He agreed but said gay people were different, because in his experience they were more superficial about it.
So then I said something like,"Do you think the fact that you do not want kids is because of the fact that you didn't like your childhood?" I don't remember exactly if I said it as a question, or a statement which I guess could be important for asking advice, but it was not meant as an attack or said with malice. He then got a little defensive and said, "It is probably not a good idea to psychoanalyze someone you are just starting to get to know," and I replied "I wasn't psychoanalyzing, I was just saying what I felt," at which point he replied, "Yea but you don't know anything about me and I didn't ask you your opinion." And I replied, "Yea I don't need permission to give my opinion." ***Awkward Silence***
I then changed the subject, as I didn't want to upset him anymore. By the time I was coming back to drop him off at his apartment we started talking about where our relationship would go next, and he said that he didn't know because I was different than other guys he had dated, and I asked what specifically.
He replied:
1. I was younger (13 years) so he didn't think I had enough dating experience or experience being in gay culture. I started coming out when I was 24, but had been sleeping with guys since age 20. He came out at age 18. He then referred to me not being experienced in dating because the last weekend. We had planned to get dinner saturday. He called me to say he was really tired and wanted to go some other time. I still hadnt eaten and wanted to go to dinner, and I didnt know anyone in the city. I found another guy to go to dinner with online. In hindsight this was a wrong thing to do because I guess technically I was on a date with another guy, but I didn't see it as much of a date, more just out to dinner, but I see how that could look. I admit this was a fuck up, but only because I wanted to see him Saturday in the first place did I text him from my "date" with the other guy. But we ended up going out twice after that, so I don't think he was that offended by it.
2. He then said that my comment was a little arrogant about me saying what I thought about why he didn't want to have kids/family, and that somethings I have to learn to keep to myself, and that it could've been a product of my upbringing.
3. He also said, in more or less terms, that my life experience wasn't "black enough" or in touch enough with "black culture" for him because I had a pretty well off upbringing, but also he referenced conversations we had before about me never taking any Afro American history classes during college, or not knowing some black history facts like the first black woman and man to win Oscars, or not having read the autobiography of Malcolm X, etc. (I am not an idiot, and I do know some black history, I could know more, but I personally don't believe that makes anyone more or less black). I then told him I think that he is limiting the "black" experience to what he has seen or experienced and that it is much broader than that and that it spans geography and class, so he couldn't tell me my experience was not black enough because it wasn't his experience of "black culture." He apologized for insinuating I wasn't black enough, but at that point I was kind of annoyed. He then referenced that I told him I had been with more white guys than black guys also as "evidence," which I replied that I lived in Atlanta and Houston (high black populations in both) and Ive been with black guys in both cities.
4. He also said that he didn't know if sexually we would be a match, because he would want me to bottom during sex, and because of this I wasn't sexually experienced enough for him as well. He thought maybe I needed to go to a club and feel guys grind on me and have a few one night stands or whatever to have more sexual experience and that I didn't seem comfortable with being gay yet either. I responded well I don't know if I even could because I have only done it once (2 days earlier) and still haven't decided whether or not I like it enough to do it on a regular basis with someone, but I needed to do it more to understand that. He then said it's probably going to be difficult to park around here, but you are welcome to come hang out if you want. I decided to call it a night and drove home.
My Conclusion:
He was saying several different reasons why we may not be compatible, but the one that I think it all stemmed from his class and upbringing.
His upbringing/class for whatever reason makes him think that "black culture" and "blackness" are so easily defined and identified in other people, which is why he would think I'm not black enough. Although I attended predominantly white schools all my life, I suspect that him being mixed and attending predominantly black schools is where this is coming from.
His upbringing/class makes him not want to have kids/family (that was just my initial speculation, but it seemed to be another reason we werent compatible)
His upbringing/class makes him think that I have not had enough sexual experiences (I have had MANY sexual experiences, I was just always the top, as was he in his sexual experiences), but I am just not as ready to TALK about prior sexual experiences because that is just not how I was raised or brought up. I never saw my parents show sexual affection to one another in the audience of others, nor many people in my family.
So ultimately, the main reason I suspect we are not compatible is because of CLASS, and the other things are a driver of that.
Questions:
1. Is anyone in relationships with people of a different class and how easy/hard was it to bridge that gap?
2. Do you agree with my conclusions and logic? What do you deduce from this situation? If not class, why are we not compatible?
3. Has anyone been deemed incompatible by someone of your own race because they said you were not in touch with the "white/black/hispanic" community enough? Is that common in the gay community?
Thanks for all responses in advance!
I moved to the NYC area recently and met a guy online. We went on a date and had a pretty good connection, so I decided I wanted to pursue it and see where it goes. The only problem at this point was that we both liked being tops from a sexual perspective, however, I really liked the guy and we both wanted to see what might come of it. We are both black (he says he is black but he is really half black and half white, although I never brought it up), but one thing he did point out is that I seem to come from a middle class/upper middle class background by the way I carry myself (talking, gestures, diction, experiences, etc) at my current age (25), where as he grew up poorer and with a considerably less stable/comfortable childhood than I had. He referred to me as an "All American" and "Ivy League Frat boy" Gay, or something like that. I took it jokingly. He is also 37. I didn't really think too much about it, but just that it is normal 1st date material.
Date 2:
I met him again the next weekend and we went for pizza, then I went back to his place and had sex, where I bottomed for the first time. Because I hadn't tried it before, I told him I wanted to try with him because I liked him, and he was more than eager to be my first. It was DEFINITELY an awkward encounter because it hurt for me, but we were both into it and both came. Afterwards, we watched a movie together and talked, and generally had a good day.
Date 3:
Since the second date, I had actually been planning to try anal sex again with him to understand if I could grow to like it. We planned to get dinner at this place, where he asked me if I ever wanted kids. I replied yes, and returned the question. He replied that he did not, because he hated kids/too much responsibility. He also went a step further to say that a lot of his gay friends and gay men he knows think that it is their attempt to try and be "normal" and live the american dream, citing how some gay people he knew wanted the perfect kid and would be difficult to deal with the fact that they may not get the kid they expect in the end.
I replied, saying that isn't that what every parent, gay or straight, goes through who actually wants to have a kid? He agreed but said gay people were different, because in his experience they were more superficial about it.
So then I said something like,"Do you think the fact that you do not want kids is because of the fact that you didn't like your childhood?" I don't remember exactly if I said it as a question, or a statement which I guess could be important for asking advice, but it was not meant as an attack or said with malice. He then got a little defensive and said, "It is probably not a good idea to psychoanalyze someone you are just starting to get to know," and I replied "I wasn't psychoanalyzing, I was just saying what I felt," at which point he replied, "Yea but you don't know anything about me and I didn't ask you your opinion." And I replied, "Yea I don't need permission to give my opinion." ***Awkward Silence***
I then changed the subject, as I didn't want to upset him anymore. By the time I was coming back to drop him off at his apartment we started talking about where our relationship would go next, and he said that he didn't know because I was different than other guys he had dated, and I asked what specifically.
He replied:
1. I was younger (13 years) so he didn't think I had enough dating experience or experience being in gay culture. I started coming out when I was 24, but had been sleeping with guys since age 20. He came out at age 18. He then referred to me not being experienced in dating because the last weekend. We had planned to get dinner saturday. He called me to say he was really tired and wanted to go some other time. I still hadnt eaten and wanted to go to dinner, and I didnt know anyone in the city. I found another guy to go to dinner with online. In hindsight this was a wrong thing to do because I guess technically I was on a date with another guy, but I didn't see it as much of a date, more just out to dinner, but I see how that could look. I admit this was a fuck up, but only because I wanted to see him Saturday in the first place did I text him from my "date" with the other guy. But we ended up going out twice after that, so I don't think he was that offended by it.
2. He then said that my comment was a little arrogant about me saying what I thought about why he didn't want to have kids/family, and that somethings I have to learn to keep to myself, and that it could've been a product of my upbringing.
3. He also said, in more or less terms, that my life experience wasn't "black enough" or in touch enough with "black culture" for him because I had a pretty well off upbringing, but also he referenced conversations we had before about me never taking any Afro American history classes during college, or not knowing some black history facts like the first black woman and man to win Oscars, or not having read the autobiography of Malcolm X, etc. (I am not an idiot, and I do know some black history, I could know more, but I personally don't believe that makes anyone more or less black). I then told him I think that he is limiting the "black" experience to what he has seen or experienced and that it is much broader than that and that it spans geography and class, so he couldn't tell me my experience was not black enough because it wasn't his experience of "black culture." He apologized for insinuating I wasn't black enough, but at that point I was kind of annoyed. He then referenced that I told him I had been with more white guys than black guys also as "evidence," which I replied that I lived in Atlanta and Houston (high black populations in both) and Ive been with black guys in both cities.
4. He also said that he didn't know if sexually we would be a match, because he would want me to bottom during sex, and because of this I wasn't sexually experienced enough for him as well. He thought maybe I needed to go to a club and feel guys grind on me and have a few one night stands or whatever to have more sexual experience and that I didn't seem comfortable with being gay yet either. I responded well I don't know if I even could because I have only done it once (2 days earlier) and still haven't decided whether or not I like it enough to do it on a regular basis with someone, but I needed to do it more to understand that. He then said it's probably going to be difficult to park around here, but you are welcome to come hang out if you want. I decided to call it a night and drove home.
My Conclusion:
He was saying several different reasons why we may not be compatible, but the one that I think it all stemmed from his class and upbringing.
His upbringing/class for whatever reason makes him think that "black culture" and "blackness" are so easily defined and identified in other people, which is why he would think I'm not black enough. Although I attended predominantly white schools all my life, I suspect that him being mixed and attending predominantly black schools is where this is coming from.
His upbringing/class makes him not want to have kids/family (that was just my initial speculation, but it seemed to be another reason we werent compatible)
His upbringing/class makes him think that I have not had enough sexual experiences (I have had MANY sexual experiences, I was just always the top, as was he in his sexual experiences), but I am just not as ready to TALK about prior sexual experiences because that is just not how I was raised or brought up. I never saw my parents show sexual affection to one another in the audience of others, nor many people in my family.
So ultimately, the main reason I suspect we are not compatible is because of CLASS, and the other things are a driver of that.
Questions:
1. Is anyone in relationships with people of a different class and how easy/hard was it to bridge that gap?
2. Do you agree with my conclusions and logic? What do you deduce from this situation? If not class, why are we not compatible?
3. Has anyone been deemed incompatible by someone of your own race because they said you were not in touch with the "white/black/hispanic" community enough? Is that common in the gay community?
Thanks for all responses in advance!
