Who could tell Clinton to quit?

[Chalchalero]

Who could tell Clinton to quit?

By Max Deveson
BBC News, Washington

In Britain they are called the Men in Grey Suits.

They are the people a politician least wants to hear from.

The people who visit you to whisper gently in your ear that the party's over - you have to resign, quit the race.

They are usually senior members of your party, loyal friends and colleagues, who you trust enough to tell you truth - even if the truth is that your political dreams are over.

With observers now almost unanimously predicting the death of Hillary Clinton's campaign to be the Democratic Party's 2008 presidential nominee, there is much discussion about how her exit from the race will be managed.

And who will tell her that she needs to call it a day.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7396501.stm

When do we have a right to finally tell her and her supporters to read the writing on the wall, for Heaven's sake???

 

[broadwayboi]

People...there is absolutely no reason for Hillary Clinton to drop out. There are only 3 more races left in the primary, why should she drop out when there are still millions of people left to vote. The convention is meant to decide who has the nomination. Unfortunately, we've never had a race in recent history that allows the convention to decide...normally the primary season is over in February. It's about time that changed. The rules committee still needs to meet to decide upon Florida and Michigan, and if they decide to seat even 50% of their delegates, she still has a chance. Obama supporters need to quit their bitching, because Hillary is in this for the long run. She will keep going until someone is the OFFICIAL nominee. And she has said numerous times, that she will work to unite the party no matter who the nominee is. Calm down...Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton will continue her race to the White House.

 

[cumtasteit]

^Thank you Broadwayboi. The last time I looked Obama did not have the nomination.

 

[iman]

The Obama folks need to realize that Clinton is not the enemy, McCain is. The primary has strengthened the party, strengthened Clinton and strengthened Obama - Where's the downside?

 

[MystikWizard]

She mine as well stay in until the end. I have no problem with her doing it, since she has stopped the Negative Campaigning. That is her right.

 

[MystikWizard]

If only her more fanatical followers would stop.

Here, here.

Ironic that they are the ones that continue the attacks, while the Obama supporters have laid off the attacks ... yet they claim we are the "divisive" ones.

 

[iman]

Here, here.

Ironic that they are the ones that continue the attacks, while the Obama supporters have laid off the attacks ... yet they claim we are the "divisive" ones.

Maybe you need to look a little closer. I don't see any threads on the first page attacking Obama and yet there are several attacking Clinton - including this one!

Over 17 million people have voted for Clinton including the important constituency of "Reagan Democrats" that Obama does not appeal to. How hard is it to understand that the more constituencies the Dems are able to attract, the better the chances of getting important legislation passed in the next administration?

 

[ShortBoy]

When the Democratic primary season started, I considered it to effectively be the presidential election. George Bush had made such a mess of things that no Republican stood a chance of being the next president.

Unfortunately the Democrats may be squandering a great opportunity. If the Hillary vs. Obama contest/drama continues to be newsworthy through the end of August, a November Democratic victory will no longer be a certainty. The general public will be tired of hearing about Florida, Michigan, super delegates, rule changes, etc. And for a significant percentage of Democratic voters, there won't be enough time to get past the disappointment of their favored candidate loosing the nomination.

http://www.politicalcartoons.com/cartoon/32f46603-f24a-4bef-a2af-284c33032c92.html

 

[JackFTwist]

People...there is absolutely no reason for Hillary Clinton to drop out. There are only 3 more races left in the primary, why should she drop out when there are still millions of people left to vote. The convention is meant to decide who has the nomination. Unfortunately, we've never had a race in recent history that allows the convention to decide...normally the primary season is over in February. It's about time that changed. The rules committee still needs to meet to decide upon Florida and Michigan, and if they decide to seat even 50% of their delegates, she still has a chance. Obama supporters need to quit their bitching, because Hillary is in this for the long run. She will keep going until someone is the OFFICIAL nominee. And she has said numerous times, that she will work to unite the party no matter who the nominee is. Calm down...Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton will continue her race to the White House.

Delighted you are fervent for your candidate! Supporting Sen. Clinton will make you important friends here! Smart play!

A few minor notes:

There are not millions left to vote. We are talking Montana and South Dakota and Puerto Rico, right? Add the potential votes. It won't hit 7 figures.

The primary season has never been over in February, never. So there is nothing to change there.

Sen. Clinton cannot do it mathematically if Florida and Michigan with their rules-breaking activities are included as is. You are aware of the Michigan numbers and the national numbers? If Michigan - the state where Sen Clinton lied and kept her name on the ballot - is included as is she gains like 12 delegates, and that is not anywhere near enough to do anything.

Obama supporters should quit their bitching. Right. PM me an address and I'll send you a unity pin. But attacking Obama supporters will make you lots of friends here, good play on your part.

The history of a candidate who cannot win pushing things to the convention anyway is one where that party loses in the fall because the nominee cannot get ready for the fall campaign and it increases division. Dems 1980 - GOP 1976 - under party protocol Obama cannot even officially look for a veep - anyone can stay in as they want but they will bear the burden of the party defeat.

I encourage your support of your candidate! That is the way to get ahead here!

Wishing you all good things!

 

[Alberto_15]

Who could tell Clinton to quit?

When do we have a right to finally tell her and her supporters to read the writing on the wall, for Heaven's sake???

There is nothing stoping you from telling her and her supporters anything but remember your opinion is only your opinion, for Heaven's sake.

Here's my opinion: I wish the democratic party had different rules but it doesn't so get over it. There is nothing wrong with taking this to the end and let Hillary Clinton make her case. If Barack Obama is a better candidate against McCain the party will see that and nominate him. It seems as though Clinton was comitting a crime!

I am tired of those who claim not to embrace dirty politics, to embrace "change" yet many of those also bully Hillary Clinton at every chance they get. I think Barack Obama owes the republican party a good measure of his success in this race. The republicans have been attacking Hillary for over a decade now because they knew she would be in this position one day. When I hear many Obama supporters speak about Hillary they just repeat what the republican party has been telling everyone for years, mostly without any merit.

What is more upsetting is if Hillary was a man she would not be charged with half the things people bash her for!

 

[Alberto_15]

Delighted you are fervent for your candidate! Supporting Sen. Clinton will make you important friends here! Smart play!

I encourage your support of your candidate! That is the way to get ahead here!

Wishing you all good things!

So much for ending divisions and uniting everyone. If you are going to support Barack Obama at least endorse his proposals and carry them out!

Now let me applaud you!

 

[JackFTwist]

So much for ending divisions and uniting everyone. If you are going to support Barack Obama at least endorse his proposals and carry them out!

Now let me applaud you!

Cute!

I do wish broadwayboi all good things!

I also wish for party its unity and have always gone over to support the presumptive nominee of my party. My first choice didn't make it in 76, 80, 84, 88, 92, 00, and 04. I always went over to unify the party when things were evident.

I observe who is not coming over to unify the party in 2008 in the same situation.

You are a Clinton supporter. It does you good to attack me. I am glad to be here for your pleasure.

I wish all good thing to you, too. Peace out!

 

[NickCole]

Delighted you are fervent for your candidate! Supporting Sen. Clinton will make you important friends here! Smart play!

...
I encourage your support of your candidate! That is the way to get ahead here!

Wishing you all good things!

More of that Obama bullying, intimidation, threats to shun, if you don't join the club you'll be dismissed and won't have friends. Insecure people, people with low self-esteem, people terrified of not being liked, people with big fear and small principles will be swayed. But those with a strong character and sense of themselves reject cults like Obama's.

The Obama cult is a nasty petty high school clique, amped up several notches. It's evident in post after post, comment after comment across the Internet and on TV.

This is not where positive Change and good governing comes from.

Becomes clearer and clearer why so many Democrats say they won't vote for Obama if he's the nominee. People familiar with history know what this is about and where it leads.

 

[falconfan]

Why should anyone tell her? This far in what will the final three primaries hurt? McCain ad Obama have moved on to each other. She's not making pot shots any longer. She just wants to go out with some dignity and see the thing through to the end. It's clear in her sharp turn in campaigning tactics that she realizes she's out. She just wants to make ti to the finish line. And I say, good for her.

 

[Sausy]

Quit projecting, Nick. Obama's campaign is no cult. And you vastly misinterpreted Jack's words if you thought that was 'bullying, intimidation, threats to shun', none of which Obama has done---it was an obvious commentary on your ilk. Obama's your party's only hope to occupy the White House in November. If that's not what you want, by all means, forgo the cowardice and be upfront about your intentions and desires--- do you prefer 8 years of McCain?

Allow me to start projecting,ICO.....Nick probably believes,along with all of the other fanatically pro-Hillary faction of the party that a Mc Cain win in 2008 is but a small price to pay as the Democrats will ultimately be stronger and better prepared to take the White House from a beleaguered,flailing,sinking McCain mess in 2012.Of course with a vindicated Hillary Clinton at the head of the ticket.

 

[Centexfarmer]

Quit projecting, Nick. Obama's campaign is no cult. And you vastly misinterpreted Jack's words if you thought that was 'bullying, intimidation, threats to shun', none of which Obama has done---it was an obvious commentary on your ilk. Obama's your party's only hope to occupy the White House in November. If that's not what you want, by all means, forgo the cowardice and be upfront about your intentions and desires--- do you prefer 8 years of McCain?

Yep, and this is the type of commentary/tone that's about to change around here.

I personally disagree with your assessment here, for several reasons, but I'll keep my comments to the exchanges that have been presented in this thread thus far.

It wasn't anyone's attempt to provide 'bulling, intimidation, threats to shun', I see it more as a dig because some see a "bias" wherever they look, and to rather discuss the issue, they'd rather name call, and point fingers, and anything else that does more to divide than to provide a common ground.

Some have allowed themselves to become so close to an issue in this forum, that they only seek those who agree with whatever "hasty/nasty generalization" that is presented, regardless of its merits, history, or any facts or lack thereof that they're based upon.

Regardless of, or in spite of, any links or supporting evidence to the contrary.

So if this is going to be another "let's personally bash anyone who either doesn't agree with me, or who I perceive doesn't agree with me, or at least in principle I feel doesn't or WON'T agree with me, or hasn't proven themselves worthy of supporting MY candidate exchange," then please let me know now, so that we can shut this thread down, and we can all move along.

Either way it's not fair to the OP of this thread who essentially asked the question, 'When is enough, enough?'













I believe, as I've been told, and heard from DNC Chair Howard Dean on all of the political talk shows/news programs, that there will be a candidate before the end of June.

I also have reason to believe that Hillary Clinton will size things up after June 3rd, and will hopefully make a decision then.

She's been harping on Bill Clinton not having been the nominee until after June 5th 1992, so hopefully someone will throw in the towel then, and we can "go on to win this thing."

Sadly, I'm afraid, that there's been too much animosity between both supporters of Obama and Clinton for there to ever be full unity within the party over whoever garners the nomination, and frankly I haven't seen too much of anyone trying to "reach accross" the divide here to make much of a difference.

Oh, but the drama must be what keeps everyone coming back.

 

[NickCole]

To answer the OP question --

The People could tell Clinton to quit or go on to the general election when we've selected a nominee.

The pattern of intimidation, woven into the OP question as it is in so much of what Obama supporters say, is outrageous. Hillary Clinton is an American citizen with many years of public service, a comprehensive platform for a Presidential run and virtually 50% of the Democratic vote supporting her. Only a thug would look for someone to tell her to quit before the race is finished. Like Keith Olberman saying a man should take her into a room and only he come out. This is a shameful way to behave towards a candidate for office in the United States, and what it reveals about the kind of atmosphere Obama might inspire if he becomes President is very troubling.

 

[NickCole]

The longer Hillary supporters are able to vote for her in a primary, the less difficult it will be for them to support Obama in November. After all they are both Democrats, and one of them will face a Republican in November. That's right, a Republican. Now remember: that's the real enemy.

Obama's supposed to be about concilation and a new politics and changed way of doing business in Washington, and yet you call Republicans "the real enemy."

I think Republicans are not the enemy, I think Republicans are fellow Americans who ought to be participating equally in our problem solving process.

I think referring to any fellow American who isn't a terrorist setting off bombs to kill Americans, like Bill Ayers did for instance, as "the real enemy" is divisive.

Obama talks about bringing people together but what he inspires in his supporters is dividing Americans into groups to bully into submission.

 

[White Eagle]

I don't think anyone should tell Hillary to quit. That is entirely upon her wishes.
I could just see it in Nov if McCain won, all of Hillarys supporters would blame me personally since I am for Barack. If you blame anyone it should be Bill. He screwed up enough. Far more than he did with Monica.

 

[Chalchalero]

There is nothing stoping you from telling her and her supporters anything but remember your opinion is only your opinion, for Heaven's sake.

Here's my opinion: I wish the democratic party had different rules but it doesn't so get over it. There is nothing wrong with taking this to the end and let Hillary Clinton make her case. If Barack Obama is a better candidate against McCain the party will see that and nominate him. It seems as though Clinton was comitting a crime!

I am tired of those who claim not to embrace dirty politics, to embrace "change" yet many of those also bully Hillary Clinton at every chance they get. I think Barack Obama owes the republican party a good measure of his success in this race. The republicans have been attacking Hillary for over a decade now because they knew she would be in this position one day. When I hear many Obama supporters speak about Hillary they just repeat what the republican party has been telling everyone for years, mostly without any merit.

What is more upsetting is if Hillary was a man she would not be charged with half the things people bash her for!

The question was actually rhetorical, but thanks for the advice.

Now here is my opinion: Clinton has made her case. She has fought a good fight (overall), but she is now beating a dead horse. While McCain is able to focus on getting his message out there to swing voters across the country, and raising funds for the General Election, Obama is stuck spinning his wheels in primaries that no longer matter, and contesting a contest that ceased being a contest a long time ago.

It is time for Clinton to allow the Democratic Party to line up behind its candidate and get to work. Sure we have six months, but those six months will go by very quickly, and I do not believe they ought to be wasted waiting for Hillary to attempt to overturn party rules in Michigan and Florida and continue to drag this already overly long primary season any further, as it will serve her and the Democratic voters no purpose.

Her supporters can bitch and moan all they want about the democratic process and letting all votes count, etc, etc, etc, ad infinitum, but it does not take away from the fact that when the party decided that Michigan and Florida's delegates would not be counted, Hillary did not speak up then at all about "every voter must be counted". In fact she signed the agreement not to campaign in Florida and, hedging her bets, kept her name on the ballot in Michigan and only now that she is losing is she suddenly concerned about the voters.

Why, Howard Wolfson was running around the talk show circuit in February (when she had the lead, coincidentally, in super delegate support) insisting that Hillary would win with super delegate support and that there was no distinction between delegates elected by the voters and delegates selected by virtue of their position in the party. That doesn't sound very democratic to me, but what do I know? (Another rhetorical question, just in case...)

The second point I wanted to make is that this process has been going on for what feels like an eternity. Hillary has had the same opportunities (if not more were one to include, as per her request, Michigan and Florida, the former of which did not even have Obama's name on the ballot) to drum up her supporters, get out the vote and win this thing. The fact that they did not do it for her is what the democratic process is all about. She has lost. It is really that simple.

And to answer your last statement, if she were a man, the party leaders would have put an end to this madness a long time ago.